Question for Ruger gurus

[AnthonyB]

Question for the experts - I took the Bisley frame and internals from the 4 5/8th inch Lipsey's 44 Special and swapped them onto the 6 1/2 50th Anniversary 44 Mag FlatTop yesterday. The FrankenBisley is working fine and I really think I'm going to like it. Problem is with the 44 Special, and only when the cylinder is in the frame - no cylinder, eveything appears to work as it should. With the cylinder installed, the hammer will not go back far enough for the full cock notch to engage. Remove the cylinder and everything is fine. Any thoughts or sugestions welcomed!
Tony

[redneckdan]

timing of the cylinder in relation to the swapped parts?

[August]

Grip frame.

I have had several issues with the grip frame -- as it matches up to the cylinder frame and hammer.

[EDK]

Did you also have to switch the cylinder alignment plunger, etc?

My guess is that the hand/pawl is too long and binds against the ratchet teeth before you get to full cock...or something similar with the cylinder pin/transfer bar.

I installed new hammers, triggers and grip frames to make SUPER BLACKHAWKS into BISLEYS, but they went to Jim Stroh (ALPHA PRECISION) for final fitting and trigger jobs.

Put the guns back to original and order parts for a permanent conversion. A HUNTER or DRAGOON grip would work with the 50th Anniversary trigger and hammer...the HUNTER might suit better than the BISLEY, especially if you add a SUPER BLACKHAWK hammer...which is actually lower than the BISLEY.

If you like books, Kuhnhausen's book on Rugers is excellent and Hamilton Bowen's THE CUSTOM REVOLVER is a "coffee table book" with super photography and lots of information.

:Fire::cbpour::redneck:

[Char-Gar]

If you would replace all of the original parts except the hammer, trigger and grip frame from the Bisley, I think your problems would go away.

[AnthonyB]

Fellas:
Thanks for the replies. After sleeping on it last night and posting this morning, I tore both apart and swapped pawls. That seems to have done the trick so far - the FrankenBisley went through fifty trouble free rounds today; the newly minted FlatTop 44 Special had four failures to fire in 100 rounds shared with its original brother. One of the four fired the second time in the "new" FlatTop, the other three failed but fired on the first try in the original FlatTop.
I'm thinking this isn't as simple a swap as I originally thought and I may be over my head.
Tony

[Heavy lead]

If you would replace all of the original parts except the hammer, trigger and grip frame from the Bisley, I think your problems would go away.

Plus one, have done a few of these. I think Chargar is going down the right road.

[AnthonyB]

Think that is what I did in swapping pawls; must have gotten them mixed up in the original conversion.
Tony

[tek4260]

The pawl was the problem as you have noticed. The 44 Spec is a mid frame and the 44 Mag is a large frame, and therefore have different length pawls.

[jblee10]

Absolutely, the pawl (hand) is the problem. The length of the hand from the pivot point to the first tooth in particular. The Blackhawk hand does not pass by the cylinder ratchet like it does on a S & W revolver so lenth is important for final lock up. The tip on the hand farthest from the pivot point is only to keep the cylinder from rotating backwards while the cylinder bolt is unlocked during cocking. I usually file the inside third off the tip of the pawl to make a freespin pawl and have never had any trouble with my guns. Makes it easier to load if you go past a cylinder. I've never had a bulllet back out during recoil so never used it for that. but I can see how it would come in handy if it ever happens to me. Just switch the hands between the two revolvers and the problem should be fixed. Although, I guess there could be slight differences in where the pawl fits into the hammer, but it doen't seem to likely.