Better results if cast wadcutters are seated backwards?

[Maven]

All, I have 3 wadcutter molds, a Cramer (.360") an RCBS (.360") and a newly-acquired Lee for my .44Mag. I've noticed over the years that the RCBS wadcutters shoot exceptionally well from my S&W Mod. 10, Ruger BH and Dan Wesson revolters if they are seated with the "nose," such as it is, seated backward (facing the powder). This is also true of the Cramer, but only in the Mod. 10.

After "leementing" the Lee WC and sizing its droppings to .432", I proceeded to test it in my Ruger SBH using 7.0gr. Unique & Fed. LP primers. The results, while not discouraging, were not exactly match quality either. I.e., they'd group low and to the right on the 25yd. target (open sights) with perhaps no more than 3 or 4 touching. The second test was the same except that I used CB's from only one of the mold's cavities. The results were a little better, but there was still too much dispersion. While reloading for the SBH yesterday, I remembered how seating WC's backwards gave me a huge improvement in my other revolvers, and thus, tried it in the SBH. Groups immediately improved ( 5 in 1" and 7 in 1" x 1.25") and were centered on the target. Velocity was 980fps +-17 for the normal seating and 1,001 +-20 seated backwards, which is statistically insignificant. If you have a cast WC that isn't as accurate as it should be, try seating it backwards and roll crimping it. It worked for me!


P.S. This also worked with some commercial WC's I purchased years ago, which is how I came upon the idea in the first place.

[dragonrider]

A long time ago and not so far away when I was shooting bulleye I knew of many who did as you mentioned and loaded button nose wadcutters backwards. All claimed it improved a great deal. I don't know why but I never tried it so I have no experience with it.

[David R]

Geez, now I have to try that one!

Thanks Maven

David

[MT Gianni]

Are any of those bevel based bullets? I seem to have better results with plain square base than bevel bases. this would put a square edge on the base. gianni.

[Maven]

David & dragonrider, It really works! Besides, the bottom lube groove is wide enough to allow a good roll crimp to be applied. The Cramer and Lee WC's I mentioned, have a very small crimp groove, which pretty much forces you to use a dial-indicating caliper to establish the correct OAL. Seat them backwards and it's not quite as critical because you can clearly see where to crimp.

[oso]

I haven't notice that much difference in accuracy, but I seat H&G BB WC's reversed when seating flush for the S&W Model 52 because my wife prefers the looks of the cartridge loaded that way.

[Leftoverdj]

I've always loaded WCs sprue up. Any inconsistencies do less damage to accuracy at the nose than at the base.

[David R]

I bought a Seaco Saeco? Seco mold #050 14 grain wadcutter before I even bought a 38. I ended up with a Smith K38 6" barrel. These boolits would never shoot for me. I tried lubing all 3 grooves, small amounts of 231 and bullseye. No luck. Just spray. My latest effort I added "a bunch" of linotype to my pot and wanted to try some hard boolits. I sized in a 450 and only filled the last lube groove. today while I was loading some of those, I put in 6 backwards. The targets speak for them selves. Both are over 2.7 of bullseye. Targets were from the bench at 50 feet. Backwards shot better.


A little trouble posting the pic.

David

I keep getting up load file failed. Its not too big.

Tomorrow......

[Maven]

David R, I was hoping someone else would confirm my results. Very pleased that they worked for you!

[eka]

I've got a S&W 686 that doesn't do what I think it should with my RCBS 148 WC bullets, so when I get a chance this coming week, I'm gonna try loading some backwards just to see what they will do. I'll report back my findings as well.

Keith

[David R]

I only loaded 6, but last night I loaded another box. I also tried pushing them in frontwards crimping over the front driving band. Here are the pics. If this works, I will be amazed, I have been trying for months to get this boolit to shoot.

Frontwards crimped in factory groove:

[David R]

BAckwards flush in case with a small crimp over the base. Lube groove is the same, now its in the front. I wonder if this makes a difference. Going back to the range if I get time to sneak out of work today. Only 6 shots, but you can see the group is better.

[catboat]

I've only done it once, as an experiment. It was a Ruger GP100 with 4" barrel, using 38 special cases (357 chambering) with hollow base wadcutters with base up. Didn't work for me. Groups at 25 yards were normally about 2.5 inches, and with base forward, it was more likle 4". I was just playing. I may try it again with a different powder. I was using Unique.

[David R]

I went to the range at lunch time last week. I shot some groups and the backwards wadcutters shoot smaller groups. They also group 5 clicks to the right and 5 clicks higher. You can see it in the targets above. I tried loading the same boolit (saco 050) flush and frontwards with no difference than crimping in the groove.

When I get my STAR, I will try lubing the front groove. Until then, I will load em backwards because they work better.

David

[Jack Stanley]

Many years ago I loaded some double ended wadcutters that I cast from a H&G mold backard and seated them out . Not content with using .38 cases ( after all I was loading for a model 28 ) I loaded them in .357 cases so the bullets was just short of the cylinder face .
I seem to remember they worked better but they used more powder than one might expect . I never did just try loading them sprue forward in a .38 an' tryin' that though .

Jack

[Uncle Grinch]

This thread brings back memories....

Many years ago, while I was working nights, I carried my Colt Diamondback .38 Spec loaded with hollow base wadcutters reveresed in the case. They were extremely devastating on various test mediums at close range. Anything over 15/20 yards could get kinda iffy on accuracy, but that was not my real concern; I was worried about "upclose" impact!

[grumpy one]

Many many years ago I tried swaged hollowbase 38 wadcutters installed backwards in 357 cases over a moderate 357 load of 231, in a 4" model 28. I won't give the load in the hope that nobody else will try it. The dead-soft swaged bullets may have been part of the problem, but most of the bullets were travelling sideways at 20 yards, and I had some difficulty ejecting the cases. A complete failure.

[Maven]

All, The only commercial WC's that grouped impressively without having to seat them backwards were Remington swaged HBWC's, seated to the crimp groove and roll crimped. Btw, they were coated with a black, wxy dry lube and were very reasonably priced.