357Maximum/JackHuntington/500Maximum

[500bfrman]

I just bought a 357 maximum here http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=197684537
Called Jack Huntington. Whitworth had told me to call him to talk about a 50 alaskan conversion. I hesitated because I hated to bother an important gunsmith. Well when I saw this maxi I called Jack to make sure he would do it. Man that guy is awesome, one of the nicest people you will talk to. I thought that was amazing given the fact that there just aren't that many people that do what he does. His rates will really reasonable compared to others, time frame not too long, but not overnight either. So I asked about doing a 500 maximum conversion on this one, and also asked about a 50 alaskan on a bfr. He was more than helpful. I was quite shocked how cheap he do an alaskan for, but they use the cylinder of the BFR and just make the holes bigger per se. Tells us what kind of quality the bfr's are made out of. Anyway just wanted to share this, cause I am soooooooooooo excited. and yes I realize I don't need a 500 maximum and an alaskan. I don't need most of what I have. If you have any conversion needs I encourage you to call Jack Huntington. www.jrhgunmaker.com

[frankenfab]

I was watching that auction! I would love to have just the .357 Maximum in a revolver to shoot, I have a .357 Max Lone Eagle.

BFR's are great, There's a .444 at a great price on GB right now that would be your .50 Alaskan. I want one, too.

Nice to hear Mr. Huntington is so ammicable.

[500bfrman]

I am hoping to get a bfr a little cheaper than that. 699?. I bought my 475 just couple months ago for 750 nib. same price for my sw500. they don't come along often that cheap though. Funny thing I wasn't really even looking at that auction too closely but after i lost out on a NIB anaconda, I had to do something to comfort myself. IF it (the 357 max) is as good a condition as advertised I might keep it and look for another one to convert. The description basically stated it was nearly NIB.

[frankenfab]

Please, you guys, let me know where we can get BFR's cheaper than $699, in the long cyclinder? I have a .444 BFR, and it is such a pussycat to shoot that I can't see the .50 Alskan with a brake being much worse than my 7.5" .500 Linebaugh on a Ruger, the 7.5" .454 Freedom arms. They are both pretty snappy with top loads.

I think the secret is the big grips, in conjuntion with the long barrel. Alot of people don't like the big grips, and I didn't either, at first, but, after shooting with them alot and also shooting other large grippped pistols and revolvers, I git used to it. You have more surface area of your hand in contact with the gun. I'ts just a different technique.

I long for the day when I know what a .500 Alaskan on a BFR feels like.

[500bfrman]

oh i'm not saying I can get it cheaper than that. but I'm going to try [smilie=l:
I wouldn't think the alaskan would be that much worse, but to hear whitworth and jwp talk it's out of this world. That alaskan is a little lighter frame than the current bfr's are. dmax? I would think the converted maximum would be the worst.

[44man]

JUST WAIT fellas, the BFR will soon be out in the .500 JRH. Short cylinder too. The stinking, most accurate revolver I ever shot and recoil is not that bad, about like the .475.
If you want an Alaskan, wear a hard hat, it is FIERCE! :drinks: I still refuse to shoot Whitworth's with the Bisley grip. :mrgreen:
I know some can't be deterred and Jack will do you right.
I have fallen for the JRH big time. It is the only revolver I ever shot a sub 1/4" group with at 50 yards and I know if done right, it would do 1/2" at 100.

[Whitworth]

oh i'm not saying I can get it cheaper than that. but I'm going to try [smilie=l:
I wouldn't think the alaskan would be that much worse, but to hear whitworth and jwp talk it's out of this world. That alaskan is a little lighter frame than the current bfr's are. dmax? I would think the converted maximum would be the worst.

Yeah, mine is on a DMax frame and it is lighter than the current BFR, and yes, it is nothing short of brutal.

Glad to hear that you had a good talk with Jack! He's a first-rate guy and a first-rate gun builder. He is also building me a .500 Max on my Ruger .357 Maximum -- just haven't sent it to him yet.

[Whitworth]

I would think the converted maximum would be the worst.

Actually, the .50 Alaskan is considerably worse. It'll push the heavy bullets faster and it just burns so much powder.

[500bfrman]

you know where to get any reload data for maximum? other than taffin. The data on hodgdon is for the linebaugh 500. The speeds they are getting doesn't seem to jive with what other people have. And then I read many are pushing the 500 linebaugh harder than it was designed. you have a linebaugh don't you whitworth?

[500bfrman]

ok I now see that hodgdon uses more h110 than Linebaugh reccomends or did recommend anyway. According to taffin tests linebaugh stated to stop at 29 grains at about 440 grain boolit. for a 468 grain boolit hodgdon says you can use 31.5. also for a starting load in hodgdon a 425 grain boolit is 31.5 this is likely already over linebaugh's max according to Taffin. What gives.

also, according to recoil calculators it states the maximum in a 3 pound gun would be just as bad as the alaskan in a 4.5 pound gun, but I think whitworth's alaskan weighs less than that. However my alaskan will hopefull weigh about that much. the dmax frame is lighter and my barrel will be slightly longer. Mr. Huntington did state he was building one right now that was basically like a chief's special 3 inch barrel. he said, I don't know how the guy will shoot it, but whatever. Barrel barely longer than the cartridge. but I have a 500 s/w like that right now. 2 3/4 inch barrel.

[Whitworth]

I am in the process of gathering .500 max load info. Let's take this conversation off-line. PM me.

I do have a .500 Linebaugh and so far it has favored the higher end loads from an accuracy standpoint.

My .50 Alaskan weighs 3.5 lbs. But that doesn't tell the whole story. It burns a lot of powder. Again, my starting loads are over 50 grains! It's a big case!

[500bfrman]

I will send you a pm. 3.5 lbs!!!! ok yeah that would be the worst by far. also on John Linebaughs's website he states that hodgdon has data on their website. this he states for the 475 but not the 500. so at this point we don't know until one of you guys call him up and ask him.:grin: I already called one important guy this week.

[44man]

ok I now see that hodgdon uses more h110 than Linebaugh reccomends or did recommend anyway. According to taffin tests linebaugh stated to stop at 29 grains at about 440 grain boolit. for a 468 grain boolit hodgdon says you can use 31.5. also for a starting load in hodgdon a 425 grain boolit is 31.5 this is likely already over linebaugh's max according to Taffin. What gives.

also, according to recoil calculators it states the maximum in a 3 pound gun would be just as bad as the alaskan in a 4.5 pound gun, but I think whitworth's alaskan weighs less than that. However my alaskan will hopefull weigh about that much. the dmax frame is lighter and my barrel will be slightly longer. Mr. Huntington did state he was building one right now that was basically like a chief's special 3 inch barrel. he said, I don't know how the guy will shoot it, but whatever. Barrel barely longer than the cartridge. but I have a 500 s/w like that right now. 2 3/4 inch barrel.
The boolit I made for Whitworth weighs 456 gr and we are using 31.5 gr of 296 in the Linebaugh. Seems to be the most accurate so far. I don't remember if we chronographed it.
In the JRH we use a 437 gr boolit and 29.5 gr of 296, it goes 1350 fps. The Double Tap 400 gr shoots good with the same charge.
The .50 Alaskan is ported but I don't see them doing much to reduce recoil, need a death grip on the thing! :kidding:A few aircraft bungee cords from the barrel to the ankles seems in line. [smilie=1:
Yes, both of us can take hours of brutal recoil too but there is a point where you can go too far. The .475 and JRH actually get easy to shoot, the .44 then feels like NOTHING. The little Linebaugh will wear on a guy.
Some guys just get carried away with light guns and I bet a lot of what Jack makes for guys might be shot once (Some, maybe NEVER!) and left as a bragging gun or loaded down a whole bunch. Some will be so violent, the split head makes a starting point for bear teeth to get into.

[500bfrman]

The boolit I made for Whitworth weighs 456 gr and we are using 31.5 gr of 296 in the Linebaugh. Seems to be the most accurate so far. I don't remember if we chronographed it.
In the JRH we use a 437 gr boolit and 29.5 gr of 296, it goes 1350 fps. The Double Tap 400 gr shoots good with the same charge.
The .50 Alaskan is ported but I don't see them doing much to reduce recoil, need a death grip on the thing! :kidding:A few aircraft bungee cords from the barrel to the ankles seems in line. [smilie=1:
Yes, both of us can take hours of brutal recoil too but there is a point where you can go too far. The .475 and JRH actually get easy to shoot, the .44 then feels like NOTHING. The little Linebaugh will wear on a guy.
Some guys just get carried away with light guns and I bet a lot of what Jack makes for guys might be shot once (Some, maybe NEVER!) and left as a bragging gun or loaded down a whole bunch. Some will be so violent, the split head makes a starting point for bear teeth to get into.

yeah, I have always liked the heavy guns. 10 inch bfr's and such. But I decided I want one (more typical carriable gun) So I am have a 5 inch maximum made on the one I bought. Your load of 31.5 is way over max according to taffin's write up, howevere is exactly in line with hodgdon's website. they list a 468 grain at that area. and I will be in line for a magnum jrh

[Whitworth]

yeah, I have always liked the heavy guns. 10 inch bfr's and such. But I decided I want one (more typical carriable gun) So I am have a 5 inch maximum made on the one I bought. Your load of 31.5 is way over max according to taffin's write up, howevere is exactly in line with hodgdon's website. they list a 468 grain at that area. and I will be in line for a magnum jrh

My max is going to be sporting a 6-inch barrel or maybe 6.5-inches. I too want something that can ride on my hip.

I don't think our 31.5 grain load is over max. It doesn't show any signs of pressure at all and the case just drop out. For the maxie, I'm thinking 550 grain bullets right around 1,300 fps......should be a hammer!

[500bfrman]

I don't think it is over max either and I don't even have one. perhaps taffin had older data that JL wanted to be sure was safe. Since then perhaps hodgdon has tested and says this is what is safe for your pressure limits. 550 at 1300 I would think is doable in the max. another person on line that wasn't necessarily seeking the max in the max got a 590 at 1200. i won't be going that big though. 550 would probably be the tops i would want to go. if that may 525.

[c.r.]

And then I read many are pushing the 500 linebaugh harder than it was designed.

I think John L will tell you, "many folks are pushing them harder" as well. i didn't get the impression he condemns the practice, but rather simply a statement that the 500L is being pushed harder than what he inteded the cartridge to be ran at.

If I'm correct in my understanding (and i believe I am), the 500L was designed to duplicate the 50 caliber rifle cartridges (black powder) used by buffalo hunters.............but in a handgun that is light and compact enough to easily pack on your hip.

[Whitworth]

I think John L will tell you, "many folks are pushing them harder" as well. i didn't get the impression he condmens the practice, but rather simply a statement that the 500L is being pushed harder than what he inteded the cartridge to be ran at.

If I'm correct in my understanding (and i believe I am), the 500L was designed to duplicate the 50 caliber rifle cartridges (black powder) used by buffalo hunters.............but in a handgun that is light and compact enough to easily pack on your hip.

My 525s are only traveling at 1,100 at the muzzle of my .500 Linebaugh. But they are really hard to stop!

[c.r.]

rather than saying "pushing them harder"..........I should have been more clear and said, "pushing them at higher pressures".

I'm not suggesting anybody is being unsafe.

~carroll

[500bfrman]

I am gathering that JL did not design it to do what is being done, however the guns are more than capable of handling it. It is not unsafe but it is more than JL desired of it. Sort of like Elmer Keith and the 44 mag I guess. This is not a blanket endorsement for every load you might see out there for the 500L but hodgdon's data is safe and whitworth's as well which is right in line with hodgdon.

[44man]

I think a lot of the loading info Whitworth gave me came from John Linebaugh and Jack Huntington. I had to have a start with his guns since I do not own any .500's, at least until I buy a JRH but I know exactly how to make it shoot so I am light years ahead.
I don't feel or see any indications we are shooting high pressure loads.
I hate to say this but after reading Taffin for years and having problems from the man on the single action site, I quit reading him. I feel what he thought was no good was based on what he could handle since he ruined himself looking for more then a gun should do instead of accuracy. He gave me the feeling that the groups I shoot were denigrating him in the eyes of his followers. I WORKED for what I do. Then I tell everyone how so everyone can try things.
I am almost 73 and most likely shot more heavy stuff, more often, without damage then he has. Whitworth, Bioman and I control the guns, never let the guns control us.
I do not fear the recoil of the .50 Alaskan and will shoot it but I don't like the smooth, shiny grips and there is no filler behind the trigger guard to protect my knuckle. The setup can get away from grip and move in the hand.
Stay away from those real pretty, shiny, smooth grips with the big guns, they WILL hurt you and ruin your shooting. Put them back on after shooting so you can show friends. Find a grip that will not hurt you or slip in your hand.
Many of you can't shoot a big rifle without a recoil pad and some need a shoulder pad or a lead sled but then shoot the wrong grips on a revolver! Take some of the revolver rounds and put them in a rifle and they will beat you silly but you think you can hold them with one hand in a revolver. You start out holding the revolver with two hands but just how many times does the gun leave your left hand? That means you still are holding the gun with one hand through the rest of recoil.
Look for control and comfort, leave pretty for show.

[500bfrman]

I think a lot of the loading info Whitworth gave me came from John Linebaugh and Jack Huntington.

When you get some reliable sources come back and talk to us. :lol:



I hate to say this but after reading Taffin for years and having problems from the man on the single action site, I quit reading him. I feel what he thought was no good was based on what he could handle since he ruined himself looking for more then a gun should do instead of accuracy. He gave me the feeling that the groups I shoot were denigrating him in the eyes of his followers. I WORKED for what I do. Then I tell everyone how so everyone can try things.


Just so were all on the same page, the reson I included him was the fact it is about the only place I found a write up with load data on the 500 maximum. Other than the fact he writes a lot of articles on sixguns I know nothing.

[44man]

When you get some reliable sources come back and talk to us. :lol:



Just so were all on the same page, the reson I included him was the fact it is about the only place I found a write up with load data on the 500 maximum. Other than the fact he writes a lot of articles on sixguns I know nothing.
It is true that a lot of the calibers have so little information to find that a guy can start with.
I went crazy even with the 45-70 revolver because there are so many different loads for RIFLES that will not work in the shorter barrel.
I feel that I lucked into a lot more then I will admit! [smilie=w:
It is just more complicated with case size, powders, boolit weights, etc, so I will always feel the designer of the caliber and gun gets first nod. You will find they are great guys, pleasant to talk to and have a lot of smarts. Better then a gun writer for information.
It is not something to take lightly, new territory is always scary.
Yes, I am like all of you and never jump into anything. In my case accuracy is top, never what the gun can be pushed to. But how do we know what is too light for a powder and what is max? I worry more then you think. Safety first, then accuracy. I could care less about someones 2000 fps!

[ole 5 hole group]

I've given Whitworth my data for his reference - and I'll say this, a 440 grain from a 500 Linebaugh Maximum going down range just under 1,600fps will leave a train wreck behind and about the only thing you'll hear is a little whimpering going on from a grown man.

[44man]

I've given Whitworth my data for his reference - and I'll say this, a 440 grain from a 500 Linebaugh Maximum going down range just under 1,600fps will leave a train wreck behind and about the only thing you'll hear is a little whimpering going on from a grown man.
I hear you, crazy for sure! :groner:
Some things Whitworth will bring here will not be shot by me. :bigsmyl2:

[Whitworth]

I've given Whitworth my data for his reference - and I'll say this, a 440 grain from a 500 Linebaugh Maximum going down range just under 1,600fps will leave a train wreck behind and about the only thing you'll hear is a little whimpering going on from a grown man.

Probably more than a little whimpering -- LOL!

[44man]

Rain is the only thing that cleans Whitworth's blood off my bench! :holysheep