Question on Primers w/110-296

[torker]

Hello Guys,

I've casted some 240 grn. SWC from a lee mold. WW/AC, w/1% tin added. I sized to .431 with a re-worked lee sizer. Pan lubed w/50-50(parafin,vaseline, and a dash of STP Honey). Winchester brass. My question is this, The reloading manual states that a magnum primer is needed. Is it really needed for 296/110? Any information, and suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I have large pistol primers: Remington 2 1/2
Federal # 150
CCI 300

I have powders available: Titegroup
H 110
WW 296
Unique
Power Pistol
Universal
HP 38

I may have left some other information out. Ruger SRH. 9.5 bbl, 2x liepold scope

Thanks...

[spqrzilla]

I think its a good idea to use magnum primers with H110/WW296.

[bhn22]

it is absolutely necessary, according to the powders manufacturer.

[torker]

Thanks guys, I'll head out in the mouring to get some.... Thanks again...

[WARD O]

FYI

Recently I was looking thru a current publication from Federal listing all their Premium ammunition offerings. In this book they listed the primer they were using for their loads. All of the Premium offerings for the 44 mag used the Federal 150 primer and not their 155 mag primer.

I have been using the Federal 150 primer with good results in my 296 44 mag loadings.

Ward

[Larry Gibson]

If you use standard primers with H110/296 and you get a "click" without the "bang". Do not attempt to fire another round!!!!!!! Open the cylinder or remove it and look into the forcing cone to see if the bullet is lodged there. I've been involved in 3 such instances; two with .44s and one with a 357. In on .44 instance the bullet was not all the way into the forcing cone and it essentially tied up the revolver. The other instance the bullet was all the way in (softer cast) and the cylinder could easily have been turned and another round fired. Same on the .357. It was out of an OMBH and the shooter just thought it was a misfire so he thumbed the hammer back and tried to fire. Just as he did I grabbed the side of his hand and got a nice cut on my thumb which was in front of the hammer...fortuneately. There was indeed the previous bullet stuck in the forcing cone.

I learned my lesson (the guy with the .357 did too); no standard primers with H110 or 296 and if it don't go "bang' always stop shooting and check the barrel. Also do not reduce the loads below those listed. I use a lot of both powders in the .357, .41 and .44 Magnums. I've not had a single instance of such a misfire with CCI 350s and 550s since I started using them 42 years ago with H110 and 296 (when it came along).

I would say the magnum primers are essential with that soft cast lighter weight bullet.

Larry Gibson

[dnepr]

I definitely had an accuracy improvement going form standard to magnum primers with H-110

[454PB]

I agree with Larry, I've had several stuck boolits and hangfires using H-110 and some other slow burning ball powders and standard primers.

[hornsurgeon]

i personally would never use a remington primer with h110, but i have been using the winchester WSP primer. i have seen in some load books where there is not suggestions to use a magnum primer and some that say it is a must. perhaps the winchester is hot enough. it does seem to be definately hotter than others.

has there been any studies done on hottness of primers? rankings? i would also think it would be a 2 part deal, temp of flame and durration of burn.

[whitetailsniper]

in my 41 rem mag using powder h110/or w296 it is highly recomended to use magnum primers,due to the powders burn rate,and specially when the weather turns colder. i have used regular large pistol primmers with these powders,,but i woundnt think of it in the winter/colder months. the casted bullets react the best with magnums in this cal. than regular ones.

[JesterGrin_1]

I have been using H-110 and W-296 in my .44 Mag with heavy loads with only the Standard CCI large pistol primers and have never had a problem. They also shoot more accurately without the Mag Primer. But I also do not hunt in extreme cold either. Say below freezing lol. As down in Deep south TEXAS it normally does not get that cold. Boolit weights range from 255Gr to 310Gr.

If I was going to use the ammo in extreme cold then I would work up a load with a Mag primer in the cold as temp swings will change how it shoots.

I use these loads in a S&W 629/ Ruger Super Blackhawk Bisley and a Marlin 1894 in .44 Mag

Since you did mention TightGroup a really nice load for the 240Gr SWC is 5.5Gr of TightGroup with a standard large pistol primer.

But as for the .357 Mag I have found that one needs to use a Mag primer. :)

[JIMinPHX]

I've been using H-110 with standard WLP & WSP primers for years. I've never had any problems with ignition.

That powder only seems to burn happy when you pack the case rather full though. It seems to like heavy boolits too. Low power loads with that powder are bad ju-ju.

[hornsurgeon]

ok, i ask this question then. i'm loading 12.5gr of h110 under a 200gr boolit in a shortened 357 case, using wsp primers(non-magnum). the powder charge is full to very slightly compressed. i hunt in wisconsin where is is normally less than 35* when hunting. this load was worked up durring warmer weather and is quite accurate at just over 1" at 50 yards. if i understand this thread correctly, should i anticipate having ignition issues when the weather gets colder? should i re-work this load using a mag primer instead of the winchester wsp?

[JesterGrin_1]

In my humble opinion I would use the Mag primer if you expect to be in temps below freezing for any amount of time. I do not know what your max load for the boolit and case length you go by but you should not reduce the max load more than 3%. I would start there and work to find the best load.

It may or may not be as accurate as the load you mentioned but I would feel more confident that I would have more uniform ignition in cold weather. :)

[fourarmed]

I have always used CCI 350 primers with H-110, but because of a discussion on this board, I decided to re-examine that choice. I did a lot of group shooting and chronographing with my 10" Dan Wesson .41 mag and a 280gr. LBT GC boolit using H-110. I got the best results on the target and on the chrono using Winchester Large Pistol primers. I also tested Federal 150 and 155 and CCI 350. The magnum primers opened groups and had larger velocity spreads. The Fed 150 looked good, but one group had a round that produced almost 150 fps more than the average of the others, so I ruled it out. With colder weather or a lighter-for-caliber bullet, results may have been more in line with the conventional wisdom.

[Larry Gibson]

Note all that had success were also using heavier bullets than the 240 gr Lee that is the subject here. Heavier bullets do make a difference both because of the greater inertia of the bullet and less powder. The WLP is considered by Winchester to be good to go for for all ball powders including 296. My caution was "if" you have that "click" but no "bang" just stop and check the barrel. It's one of those things that doesn't happen to everyone or all the time. Yet it happens often enough to be warned.

Larry Gibson

[JIMinPHX]

Larry, I had good results with 240-grain boolits, compressed charges of H-110 & WLP primers in a .44 mag. I got 1" groups @ 50 yards with iron sights in a carbine & less than 50fps extreme spread in velocity over an entire string of shots, but I never tried them in cold weather. That may be the difference in my case.

[spqrzilla]

I've seen Winchester WLP primers described as being equivalent to magnums, and given that back when both were Olin products, you'd expect Winchester to use their primers with their ball propellants, that's makes sense.

I've seen several reliable authorities recommend magnum equivalent primers for ball propellants.

[JIMinPHX]

I think that in addition to WLP, Winchester also makes a magnum version. I think that it is called the WLPM or something like that. This is just off the top of my head. I need to go back & check on that. I just use the WLP.

[RobS]

I think that in addition to WLP, Winchester also makes a magnum version. I think that it is called the WLPM or something like that. This is just off the top of my head. I need to go back & check on that. I just use the WLP.


W209 =Shotgun Shells
WLP =Large Regular Pistol
WLR =Large Rifle
WLRM =Large Rifle Magnum
WSP =Small Regular Pistol
WSPM =Small Magnum Pistol
WSR =Small Rifle

Only one primer for large pistol

[RobS]

I would follow the load data or call the primer or powder manufacture and ask them what they think is a good idea for the reloading situation/ambient temperatures etc in which you are planning on. Having said that, I would go with a mag primer if I wasn't working with the upper loads and/or if I was planning for cold temps.