Primer confussion

[parrott1969]

B]Why does there appear to be soo much confussion on primers?????[/B] I have noticed that on several forums people say to use magnum primers because the powder is "harder to ingnite". It seems to me that too many people do not do their home work. For example, Remington and Winchester use the same amount and type of compounds in standard primers as they do in magnum primers. The only difference is in the cup hardness not the coumpound. Remington even tells you to use 5 1/2 (mag primers) for 40 s&w. Wolf does the same thing as Winchester and Remington. CCI is a different animal, they actually do use a hotter mix and harder cup in magnum primers. I belive that CCi's hotter mix is unwarranted and a waste of material. I think it would be better if manufactures standardized their componets. OK, Flame Away.

[jsizemore]

Variation in components means you stand a chance of finding an accurate load for YOUR gun.

[wistlepig1]

Parrott, Thanks for the info, some I new and some I didn't! No Flame here.

[GabbyM]

We need some more confusion already.
European primers like the Russian ones we've been bringing in by the boat load. Use a different compound that is said to burn less violent but longer duration. So how do you compare them to US primers? My answer would be you can't. Just shoot them and see.

[HORNET]

Some of the claims are wrong. I've seen claims that Rem 6-1/2's and 7-1/2's are the same except for cup thickness....the groups and chronograph say otherwise. CCI BR-4's and Fed 205M's are even hotter to light the compressed charges of ball powders that the benchresters like. They come in handy to improve ignition consistency with cast loads that operate where the pressures are at or below those needed for consistent burning characteristics as happens with lower velocity loads using slower powders. They allow doing some interesting ignition profiling.

[cajun shooter]

Parrot1969, You might not have loaded long enough to see all the difference that does occur with primers.Some powders have a very long burn rate which will require a different primer mixture. Just because you use a certain primer that is different than the one called for and the gun goes boom does not show you are correct. Some different primers have shown as much as 2000 pounds of pressure more than the called for one. All primer mix is not made at the same factory. Even shot shell 209 primers can produce a huge jump in pressure. Some long range BRCR and Creedmoor shooters place a thin piece of paper between the primer and powder charge to change the effect of the burn for better burn. The wrong primer may cause a pressure level that may cause harm to the gun and shooter. There was a test on primers that was performed by John Boy I think. It shows a huge difference in the different primers.

[bigdog454]

C.S. is correct that there is a difference and has been tested. I have been reloading since 1960, and have found that some powders and cartridges need hotter, ie. magnum primers. I had problems with the Casull 454 lighting many powders till I went to a hotter primer, also lately I hae been experimenting with a new inline muzzel loader with a new powder (blackhorn 209); when using a standard 209 primer there was no bang, just a whoose. I bought some magnum 209 shotshell primers and they go bang every time. So you see, with some powders and some cartridges you will need a hotter (magnum) primer. You probably won't have this problem loading your average cartridges, such as 38 sp, 45 ACP, 20 Ga shotshells etc but, there is a place for magnum primers.

BD

[grog18b]

I have some old British 303, that have the click-boom primers in them... I pull the trigger, the firing pin clicks, about .75 sec later, the primer actually goes off... Interesting stuff.

[parrott1969]

cajun shooter, I hav been loading a very looong time and I never said that all primer mix is made at the same factory. Maybe you need to read my post again. What I did say is that winchester uses the same formula and amount of coumpound for both standard and magnum primers. The only difference is in the cup hardness. Remington uses the same type and amount of coumpound in both standard and magnum primers with the only difference being cup hardness. This is why Remington clearly states on the box of 1 1/2 primers " Not for use in 40 S&W". Wonder how do I know this? Shhhhh! Here is the secret " I can read the writing on the box". Wolf does the same. If you bothered to call remington they will tell you that they do not make magnum primers. As I stated in my first post, CCI is a different animal. They do use hotter coumpond.

[lwknight]

Parrot , are Winchester primers stronger than Remington?
Think back to the old days when a Winchester primer was specified
and they did not differentiate magnum from non magnum.

Also in the old days CCI was the cats meow for tricked hot rod guns till
they changed to a harder cup because some people were blowing primers.

Also , what say you regarding Federal?

[parrott1969]

I do not know if winchester is stronger than remington and am not sure how you could compare them because on the different priming compounds. The only thing I know about federal is that their standard primers are real soft. I am going to try to find an article I read about primers and post here.

[nicholst55]

Several years ago (20?), American Rifleman ran an article comparing the 'hotness' of various small rifle primers; IIRC, at the time the Winchester small rifle primer was the least 'hot.' The author took a .223 case and cut it off just forward of the solid part of the case head, then he primed it and secured a common steel BB over the flash hole. He then fired this 'cartridge' and chronographed the BB.

His theory was that the least 'hot' primer would probably produce the best accuracy potential. As I recall the author found a surprising difference between the several different brands of primers that he tested. So, yes, there really is a difference in primers.

And FWIW, I scrolled through 12 pages of Google search results looking for the referenced article, but couldn't find it, or even any mention of it.

[HORNET]

This link might be relevant here:
http://www.castingstuff.com/primer_testing_reference.htm
There used to be a lot more detail on the chart but it got done in by a computer crash. Can't trust them things...