Every 3rd round is a flyer

[WildmanJack]

Gentlemen and Ladies,
I have a friend that owns an AR in .308 . Now his problem is when he loads one round at a time by hand the gun is dead on at 100 yds. BUT, when he uses the magazine and shoots 3 rounds in the same amount of time his third round is a flyer. He has recovered some of the fired rounds and said that there was a "scratch" on the nose of the bullet ( all J words). I kind of figured with a .308 at 100 yds, it would have to be one heck of a big scratch to make it shoot any different than normal.
Any ideas? I wish I had pictures but he lives in New Hampshire and I'm in Fl. besides he has no idea how to use a computer...
Thanks,
Jack

[koehn,jim]

It sounds to me like a problem with the feed ramp coming from the magasine. Does it do it with different mags and different bullet profiles. I seated my bullets a little deeper and seemed to clear up a similar problem with a m1a.

[WildmanJack]

Haven't found out if he has more than one mag for the gun. But, how could the feed ramp cause a flier? If the round goes into battery, and the bolt locks up. Isn't it in there the same way every time??? I could see if there was a difference in the OAL of the round, maybe a longer jump from the case to the lands and grooves may cause the round to be slightly inaccurate, but I'm no authority by any means. I don't know...
Jack

[220swiftfn]

um, because the rounds are staggered in the magazine. It sounds like the first one being chambered by hand (non recoil) is fine, the second one chambered by the action is fine, but the third by recoil is hitting somewhere.... check the magazine and ramps for a burr, sharp edge, or even better, some jacket material. You might want to have him load as normal, but instead of firing that third round, eject it to find out what's scraping (as you eject, use a sharpie thru the ejection port to mark the brass so you don't lose the orientation..)

Dan

[Bill*]

I just checked with the White House firearms team....they told me to just skip loading the third round and load a fourth instead. That should clear it up[smilie=p:

[462]

I just checked with the White House firearms team....they told me to just skip loading the third round and load a fourth instead. That should clear it up[smilie=p:


My Garand used to have a 7th round stoppage problem. Skipped loading the 7th round and went directly to the 8th and the problem disappeared.

[Multigunner]

My Garand used to have a 7th round stoppage problem. Skipped loading the 7th round and went directly to the 8th and the problem disappeared.

If its one of the early receivers with part of the clip guide cut away by accident during the machining of the barrel opening the seventh round jam can be avoided by ensuring that all clips are loaded with the top round on the proper side. I forget which side that is off hand.
Many of these early receivers were repaired by welding in the missing steel and recutting that guide.

A slamloader can bend the case neck which would present the bullet to the origin of rifling at a cant. The looser the throat the more the bullet can be canted and still chamber. If the bullet starts on its way canted the bullet base can leave the muzzle with one side ahead of the other letting gas escape on one side. Thats pretty much like having a bad crown, only its the cant of the bullet causing the problem.

[462]

Multigunner,
It's a '43 Springfield, so I knew that the receiver was not at fault. Also, orientation of the top round didn't have any bearing. Since it was an intermittent occurance, it was difficult to diagnose. First attempt at a fix was to replace the bullet guide and follower, but the problem remained. In the end, some of the aftermarket IMI clips were to blame.

[KCSO]

Shoot two shot groups????

Hard to say withut looking at the gun and the bullets, but nose damage usually won't throw a bullet far off at 100 yards, maybe an inch or so, more than that and there are other problems.

[WildmanJack]

KCSO, I agree, without looking it's kind of a **** shoot. I spoke to him yesterday and he told me that he has 4 mags, and they all do the same thing. I suggested that it was not the mags but possibly the feed ramp and he should take the gun to a competent gunsmith and explainthe problem to him rather than get it third hand by someone who has not even seen the weapon!! We'll see if he takes the advice..
Thanks for all the input guys...
Jack