Lets talk Contender lock bolts again (with pics)

[Ohio Rusty]

First and foremost - I need to say a BIG thankyou to listmember HeavyMetal for helping me out with my lockbolt issue. He had several different bolts, and was kind enough to send them to me so I could find the one I needed. Thanks Heavymetal for helping out a fellow listmember with 'contenderitis'.

I hope my sharing the past 'experiences' with different contender frames of different years, and this new thread will be a help to future contender owners.

I have had the opportunity to take pics of three completely different lock bolts, and they ae shown below. On the left in both pics, is the first series lock bolt that is on my first 4 digit contender frame. You can see it is completely different than the newer bolts. The top has a flat, and 45 degree angle machined into the top-face, then a stair step flat on the top of the bolt. It also has a tiny ridge that runs along the front edge of the top stair step. The half moon shaped cut out on the front of the bolt is alot smaller than the cutouts on the middle bolt and the split bolt on the right. Turned over, the shaft looks completely different than the other two bolts, middle and right. The shaft on the left bolt underneath doesn't have the machined in gap, and the foot on the end is much thinner. No wonder the newer bolts refused to let the barrel open on the older frame. The internals on the older frame are made to fit the machined shape of the older lock bolt.

The middle bolt is the newer one piece bolt. The shape of the top is missing the flats and steps. and is one gradual angle to the rear of the face of the bolt. The under side of the middle bolt has a machined in gap on the shaft, and the foot on the end is much thicker.

The last bolt is the one on the right, and is the two piece modern bolt that work with all the newer series 2 and series 3 model contenders. All three of these lock bolts all have the removeable roller pin that goes thru the underside of the lock bolt. (I have been told there is a 4th bolt that the roller pin is machined in and is not removeable.)

Although T/C made the split bolt design to upgrade and fix problems, the split bolt will not work with my older, 4 digit frame and the barrel locks up solid and will not open. The frame only works with the older bolt on the left in the pics.

I hope these pics are helpful and give a good show and explaination as to why some bolts will absolutely not work with some frames, causing barrels to lock shut and not open. I hope this an informative thread to for the list.
Ohio Rusty ><>

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v372/OhioRusty/3bolts1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v372/OhioRusty/3bolts2.jpg

[EDG]

If the newer bolts are fitted so they will function properly your frame will work. The problem is your interlock is not being released because the locking bolts are not extending into the frame locking shelf far enough. When that happens the barrel is partly locked in place but the interlock is not released. The hammer will fall but the gun will not fire. It is a safety feature.
The TC frame conversion is well worth the hassle since the new setup is much easier to unlock.

[headblade]

Is there a website that you can purchase locking bolts for G2 Contenders?

[HeavyMetal]

Glad I could help and thanks for the "honorable" mention for the assist!

This should be a sticky that every first time Contender guy reads before he takes his first barrel off the frame!

The only way I know to obtain parts for a any Contender, particularly the older ones, is either search the auction sites, place a want add or pick them off used barrels as you buy them.

Thats how I aqquired the small supply of locking bolts I was able to send the OP.


Glad you got the pic's up Rusty it will help a lot of people!

[missionary5155]

Good morning
I appreciate this info. Explains alot about problems I see & read about.
I vote Yes for a sticky also.
Mike in Peru

[headblade]

Ok. Thanks Heavymetal. Yeah I have sent a couple of Emails to TC contact page and no replies in 2 months time. I will have to try what you recommended or maybe call TC and tell them their email machine is broken. 8p

[cbrick]

EDG is correct. The split bolt will not only work but is also better but it does need to be fitted correctly. If the bolt table isn't worn and the bolts are fitted correctly they do work better.

I am extremely fortunate in not only having the best T/C smith on the planet including at the factory as my smith but he sets up shop at our clubs monthly matches. Jim Henry has been a T/C smith since the mid 70's. Until T/C was sold they sent him any parts he wanted/needed so he would keep the pistols out of T/C's warranty shop. The new owners sadly changed all this.

I don't know where headblade is but HeavyMetal is a short drive if he needs anything done on a T/C. Matches are the second weekend of each month.

Rick

[JohnH]

Must the frame be modified or can the bolt be modified/ have a 5 digit frame that is not modified and new model bolts will not lock. The hammer will fall and even fire but the barrel opens on firing. I solved this for a 30 Herrett barrel by swapping the bolts out from a 44 shot barrel. Id like to get other barrels, but don't because I don't how the lock up will work out. Suggestions?

[cbrick]

I've not seen much of any modifying the frame, it's the bolts that need to be fitted to the frame. If the frames bolt table is worn too much the frame needs replacement.

Try this on a T/C that opens on firing. Take a majic marker or such and coat the top of the bolts and close the action. When the action is opened you should be able to see how far the bolt goes under the frames bolt table. It should be at least half the length of the flat on the bolts.

Here is a ton of info on T/C's:
The articles of Mike Bellm (http://www.lasc.us/ArticlesBellm.htm)

Contender Barrels That Unlock When Fired And Fly Open
(http://www.lasc.us/BellmFiresFliesOpen.htm)

Rick

[bogorman]

I called TC about 3 weeks ago about getting a new bolt, and there was no problem getting one shipped directly to me for about 11 bucks shipped. It is backordered currently but hopefully will arrive in the next couple of weeks.

[crashdummy]

I just ordered a set today, still on backorder, price is now $17.71 shipped.
TCs customer service really has gone downhill.
Have a GREAT day guys

[stubshaft]

Must the frame be modified or can the bolt be modified/ have a 5 digit frame that is not modified and new model bolts will not lock. The hammer will fall and even fire but the barrel opens on firing. I solved this for a 30 Herrett barrel by swapping the bolts out from a 44 shot barrel. Id like to get other barrels, but don't because I don't how the lock up will work out. Suggestions?

There are a couple of reasons the barrels pop open on firing. The first is that the pressures may be running too high and the second is that there may be oil on the bolt or ledge. T/C's work best when the bolt and ledge are clean and dry of any lube or fouling.

[quilbilly]

I have had a locking bolt on backorder since early November and even got the confirmation post card that said 6-8 weeks. Nothing yet. They did send the spring however. I vote on this as a sticky as well. I have had Contenders with multiple frames and barrels for almost 35 years and never had a problems until this year. The pics explain a lot. Thanks to all.

[218bee]

Good post...I am getting back into Contenders after a 30yr or so absence.
Very good info and I would like to be able to order parts also but am having a hard time.
You would think there would be more out there wouldnt ya?

[ratboy]

hmmmmm. i have one of those old bolts that refuses to play nice with a 4 digit frame. i know it is the bolt because it was on a 222 barrel and i swapped it with a 22wmr barrel i have and now the 222 barrel will open and the 22wmr barrel will not. i wonder what i will have to do to get it to work. all the other barrels i have that dont like the early frame work fine in the later frame i have. has anyone run into a problem such as this? it seems opposite of the problems that people usually have i.e late barrel on an early frame.

[quilbilly]

It took me five months but I finally got a split lockbolt from S&W when I found a guy who actually knew something and knew where one was hidden. At long last I got it installed on a very old (mid-70's vintage) pristine 45 acp octagonal barrel that had a bad locking bolt which is why the barrel was unfired no doubt. At my home 40 yard range with 200 gr swc it hits a soupcan 3 of 5 times and the frame opens beautifully. Life is good!

[JohnFM]

I know this is a fairly old thread, but I found it trying to find info on just how the locking bolts worked on the Contenders.
I have 3, all older models. .41 Mag, 30 Herrett, and 30-30.
All seem to have identical frames.
The 30-30 barrel is a 14 inch and it has a 2 part bolt.
To open the action is a real mother bear, the spring behind the bolt section is so strong it's really tough to try and push the bolt sections back against it.
Before I found this thread I had no idea so many different assemblies were used.

Anybody know if there are some features to look for to try and figure out if this one is somehow a mis match between the bolt type and frame type?
I read something about an "easy open" frame, but still haven't figured out what that is.

Thing seems to lock up good and shoots with no problem, but everyone comments on how hard it is to open the thing up.

[mazo kid]

I have a 6 digit frame and 10 barrels; one of which is a Super Fourteen in 35 Rem. This last barrel is VERY hard to open. I had called T/C a while back and talked to a nice gal. She said the only fix was to send ALL barrels and frame to be "fixed". At a cost of $65.00 each! The 35 Rem barrel has the 2nd type bolt as far as I can tell (angled face). However... I have a 22 Hornet barrel with the same bolt and it works fine!!?? Any suggestions? Will a change to the early bolt work on the 35 Rem. barrel? TIA.

[lostindesert]

I have referenced so many people to this thread, that after finding new critical info, I decided to revive it.

Ohio Rusty,
Great job.


I picked up a new 45colt barrel for the contender. doesn't really fit. I got it because all current 45 colt barrels are 45/410. To do that T/C had to cut a 3" long chamber for the 410 shell. That means the 45 colt bullet must jump over an inch before it hits rifling. Terrible for accuracy. This barrel was quite unusual for being a 45 colt only and should have better accuracy.
There are 3 types shown in Rusty's post.

Lucky me, I have a fourth type that is so early it is solid and has an allen head bolt on the bottom. All others are pinned. I went through 4 gunsmiths to find nothing, and then a member on singleactions I was on the phone with, recognized it. What a piece of luck (to find out I had no options). I have almost got it working, but it is still really tight to open.

[M-Tecs]

http://bellmtcs.com/store/index.php?cid=759 may have them.

[Leadmelter]

Talk to SSK, they were helpful to me.
Leadmelter
MI

[tctender]

Since we are talking about locking problems i recently purchased a new G2 frame. Tried it on 17 barrels most all with the newer split bolts and only 5 would allow the hammer to be cocked. Some would not even close up. Called T C and they said send it back with one of the barrels that would not work. They said they had no locking bolts to send me to try and did not know when they would have any. I sent it in with a barrel and have called them and found out nothing. They have had it over a month now.I never even fired it while i had it. Loosing faith in them. Not the same TC as before S&W took over.

[JohnH]

Since we are talking about locking problems i recently purchased a new G2 frame. Tried it on 17 barrels most all with the newer split bolts and only 5 would allow the hammer to be cocked. Some would not even close up. Called T C and they said send it back with one of the barrels that would not work. They said they had no locking bolts to send me to try and did not know when they would have any. I sent it in with a barrel and have called them and found out nothing. They have had it over a month now.I never even fired it while i had it. Loosing faith in them. Not the same TC as before S&W took over. I fear the Contender if not all of TC is going the way of the dodo. I've been going to a public range over the last year and a half and every time I take my Contender there is someone who will ask, "What is that"? Four or five years ago Stan Trzonic (Sp?) did an article on a G2 Contender, that is the last I've seen in print on a Contender and it was at least that much in time before that article that I'd seen anything else written up about the Contender. I remember when one couldn't pick a gun rag up without seeing an article spoutin' off about some new fangled wildcat for the pistol. Sometimes i hate the self defense craze that has hit the gun industry. So many other aspects of handgun shooting are being pushed to the wayside.

[richmanpoorman]

I have 2 "G1" frames. 3 bbls: 222 14"blue, 35 rem 14" stainless , 50 cal Mz. The 222 works fine on both. The 35 would not lock on either. I stoned the top of the bolts (stone and try over and over), now it works fine. The 50 had a pin on the bottom of the barrel lug to prevent it working in a "G1" frame. Dremel fixed that, now works fine. IMO rushing to buy new bolts is silly until you try fitting them. A fine flat stone, a candle and patience is all you need.

[iplaywithnoshoes]

The Encore and Contender are alive and well I think. S&W just needs to put a little more effort into maintaining T/C. Either way, there is great support from TC Addicts and Mike Bellm.

shoe

[tctender]

I have 5 contender frames all my barrels (over 20) fit on. I hate to mess up the fit trying to get them to fit the new g2. Will see what S&W( since its there call now not TC) says about the g2 before i try any stoning but may before its all over.

[richmanpoorman]

Why would you bother with the G2 ? I have found no demonstratable advanges to it.

[tctender]

Got the g2 back today. Seems to work on the three i tried. They did not say what they did.

[gemihur]

307476
from Bellm's archives
E. Arthur Brown has 'em for $50!
Check with SSK Industries, J.D. is more reasonable

[tunnug]

One of the things that seem to be bypassed is that you need to close the action with some authority, if you close it gently the locking lug could stop before doing it's job, at least thats how it goes with several of my barrels.