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View Full Version : Lee boolit sizer,is that good enough?



jeff223
05-14-2005, 08:42 AM
once i get my mold from the group buy im going to get started.a friend of mine told me i could use his sizer but i want to get my own.do you think the Lee boolit sizer would be good enough for me?size,lube and seat the gas checks on the 180 gr 357cal boolits for my 357max?

what do you all think?

Bass Ackward
05-14-2005, 09:05 AM
once i get my mold from the group buy im going to get started.a friend of mine told me i could use his sizer but i want to get my own.do you think the Lee boolit sizer would be good enough for me?size,lube and seat the gas checks on the 180 gr 357cal boolits for my 357max?

what do you all think?

Jeff,

Yep. I have everything, and still use the Lee's.

azrednek
05-14-2005, 12:41 PM
I'm with Bass Ackward, I have the higher priced equipment and often find myself using the Lee sizer and single stage press.

beagle
05-14-2005, 12:46 PM
The Lee nose first sizers are good. They'll size and seat the checks better than a regular lubricator/sizer but they won't lube. You'll have to use the liquid alox for lubing and then size. Or size and then dip in the liquid alox.

This is one reason, and the use of multiple size dies that keeps the older guys using Lyman, 450s, RCBS, Stars and Saecos./beagle

Rrusse11
05-14-2005, 03:51 PM
Jeff,
I give my 'as cast' boolits a light coat of the Lee liquid alox, I find a ziploc bag the best applicator, size after drying, and then another round of alox. You can either give 'em a quick trip thru the size die again,,,,, cleans 'em up a bit and gets more lube in the grooves, or simply load. The bell/flare on the case mouth also packs a bit more lube in. Unless running top velocity, I don't get fussed about filling the grooves completely. Felix can possibly weigh in on the notion that the minimal amount of lube needed is the best.
Cheers,
R*2

Maineboy
05-14-2005, 04:15 PM
I use Lee push through sizers exclusively. I rarely lube boolits before sizing and applying checks, unless they are 3-4 thousandths oversize, then I might. On those occasions I've sprayed them with WD40 before sizing if I'm in a hurry, instead of applying a light coat of liquid alox and letting that dry. It doesn't take much liquid alox to lube boolits if the velocity is my usual 1200-1600 fps, but if the boolits are meant for more speed, I'll put on a second coat.

Years ago, when I shot a lot of 38-357 revolters, I did have an old Lyman lubrisizer, but I sold it when I sold the guns. I don't miss it.

David R
05-14-2005, 04:53 PM
I have used the Lee sizer for TL bullets, but for my gas check pistol and rifle boolits, I use the Lyman 450. To each his own.

44man
05-14-2005, 06:47 PM
The Lee will give the straightest boolits of any sizer. I use soft Felix lube and smear it in the grooves by hand and push them through the Lee. My RCBS lube sizer is under the bench!

StarMetal
05-14-2005, 07:21 PM
44man

Not necessarily so. My older Lyman 450 lubes straight bullets and they are still straight when they come out. I believe if you have a good one that they worked just fine. Also I think the Lyman/RCBS sizers put gaschecks on better too. I've had alot of Lee sizers catch the check and ruin it and I would usually end up sizing throught them base first to avoid that. Nope, I'll take my Lyman any day of the week. It works very good and I don't have to mess with lubing by hand.

Joe

drinks
05-14-2005, 09:52 PM
I use the Lee sizer, have never had a check hang up, yet.
I was getting tired of letting the liquid alox dry overnight, tried a few things,the least messy and fastest way I have found is with Hornady Unique case lube, a can of very hard and slick lube, I just wipe my fingers across the lube, then fondle 4 or 5 bullets as I am putting on the gas checks, then rewipe my fingers, no stuck bullets and no buildup of lube so far.
I then put conventional lubes on the bullets before loading them.
Don

buck1
05-14-2005, 11:03 PM
They work fine . I had a .309 but sold it after I got my RCBS sizer. I am going to get another one on my next order. I lubed the bullet by hand then sized . It worked fine for me. ....buck

JohnH
05-14-2005, 11:50 PM
While I'm only 46, my wife calls me "old fart" and on some things I'm as stuck as an old fart can be, lubesizers are one of them. I have the Lyman 4500 currently. My first some 20 years ago was a Lyman 450. I then got the RCBS and thought I'd gone to heaven. I got the Lyman 4500 this go round, wish I'd held out to put together another 15 bucks, but I still like it better than messing with the liquid alox and all.

The Lee is cheap enough, get one and use it, use your buddies sizer too and make the decision that suits you. Both work. Each has there strengths and weaknesses. You may find yourself with both on your bench.

I still pan lube even though I have a sizer. A Lee sizer would be a nice quick way to seat gas checks on pan lubed bullets without changing the set up in my sizer as I frequently shoot small amounts of a given bullet. It is probably my dislike of the mess of the liquid alox that keeps me from being overly enthuesed about the Lee system.

I must say this though. I first tried the Lee system with their 45 230 RN tumble lube bullet. I was using it in a Ruger Redhawk in 45 Colt. I had no trouble shooting 2-3" groups at 20 yards. I still remember thinking it was too easy to get that good a result from such a cheesy method. I shot a lot of those, still have the mold. Wish I had the Ruger.

Buckshot
05-15-2005, 06:53 AM
..............Without a doubt, a push through die is going to give you your best boolits, so far as even sizing is concerned. For most pistol applications I T-L the slugs, whether they're a T-L design or not and for 38 Special target loads it may be a bit TOO much lube, but that's what I use.

For almost all rifle applications I use the Lyman lube-sizer press. If I was to load for ultimate accuracy I'd lube-size in a slightly oversized die and then run them up through a push through die if sizing were required.

..............Buckshot

Cayoot
05-15-2005, 09:00 AM
..............Without a doubt, a push through die is going to give you your best boolits, so far as even sizing is concerned. For most pistol applications I T-L the slugs, whether they're a T-L design or not and for 38 Special target loads it may be a bit TOO much lube, but that's what I use.

For almost all rifle applications I use the Lyman lube-sizer press. If I was to load for ultimate accuracy I'd lube-size in a slightly oversized die and then run them up through a push through die if sizing were required.

..............Buckshot

So this is probably a dumb question...but is Lee Liquid Alox (tumble lube) adequate for non-tumble lube design boolits (in other words, can I tumble lube my Lyman .38's .44's & .45's with tumble lube instead of running them one at a time through my Lyman luber/sizer)?

Or will I get a leading problem?

I'd like to run them as cast (unsized) in many cases, and T/L is soooo much faster with large batches (500 - 1000) than my Lyman 450s are.

Rrusse11
05-15-2005, 10:06 AM
So this is probably a dumb question...but is Lee Liquid Alox (tumble lube) adequate for non-tumble lube design boolits (in other words, can I tumble lube my Lyman .38's .44's & .45's with tumble lube instead of running them one at a time through my Lyman luber/sizer)?

Or will I get a leading problem?

I'd like to run them as cast (unsized) in many cases, and T/L is soooo much faster with large batches (500 - 1000) than my Lyman 450s are.

Yep! Depends on velocity, hardness of boolit, size vs bore diameter, yada yada,,,,,,,,, but try it, works for me for low/mid velocity plinkers.
R*2

Maineboy
05-15-2005, 10:31 AM
You can push the velocity up to 2000 fps if you lube heavily enough, it may take two applications though. When I'm putting on a heavy coating, I stand the boolits on their bases and the lube tends to run into the grooves. I think it's pretty good stuff.

BCB
05-15-2005, 11:19 AM
jeff223,

I have an RCBS Lube-O-Matic that I have never been able to get to lube bullets without a heck of a mess. I now just use it to seat gas checks, not full-length size the bullet, if I want to shoot the bullet as cast. The Lee sizers will seat a check, but the bullet must be pushed the entire way through the sizer. I have six of the Lee sizers and I really like them. I ordered a custom one to size to 0.278”. I use this one to size some 0.286”+ slugs down to use in the 270 Winchester cartridge. It works very well.
I have posted a picture (maybe). It shows RCBS 38-148-WC’s sized to 0.358” and a light coat of Alox on them. That is all the Alox I use unless the velocities are to be 1800 fps or faster. I think people put to darn much Alox on there bullets and it does get messy when seating them. I fully size these slugs so the will not cause a bulge in the case when seated. Sometimes this bulge will not allow the loaded round to chamber in my Security-Six. This sized slug will rattle my 5.5”x11” pendulum at 100 yards from a good sandbag rest. Good-luck...BCB

grumble
05-15-2005, 11:20 AM
I agree with Mainboy. Liquid Alox is pretty good stuff. Might not be the best at velocities over about 1600, though.

Several comments about it being messy and taking a long time to dry. I thin the alox with mineral spirits, about 50-50. I pour raw boolits in a dedicated plastic container, add a few drops of Alox, and roll them around for a couple minutes. (no mess yet.) Then I pour the coated boolits into one of those aluminum foil turkey pans, also dedicated to the purpose. (still no mess.) I use a dedicated old plastic cooking spoon to smooth out the pile. (A little mess on the spoon, but not much.) Then I use a hair dryer to heat the boolits. Since the alox is thinned with mineral spirits, they dry quickly. (the only mess so far is on the spoon.) I let them cool off for a few minutes, and if they still smell like mineral spirits, I give the pile a stir with the spoon and another shot with the hair dryer. Elapsed time is about a half hour or 45 minutes at the most. (And only a slightly messy spoon to show for it.) The boolits are now ready for the Lee push-through sizer. Some boolits might be slightly tacky, but not much. After sizing them, they go back in the plastic container for another light coat of diluted alox, and into the turkey pan for the hair dryer treatment. Then they get a sprinkling of powdered mica. The result is a well-lubed boolit that's dry to the touch and ready for loading.

If I feel particularly fastidious, I'll clean up the "mess" on the spoon with a rag dampened with mineral spirits.

Compared to using "real" lube, it's about as easy as it gets. Lots cleaner, too.

BCB
05-15-2005, 11:22 AM
Sorry about the large picture!!! How do I get it smaller the next time I decide to post a picture? Thanks...BCB

Cayoot
05-15-2005, 12:03 PM
WOW!!! I can never get over how much great information you guys give out when someone asks a question!

Thanks! :-P

Scrounger
05-15-2005, 12:37 PM
Sorry about the large picture!!! How do I get it smaller the next time I decide to post a picture? Thanks...BCB

I assume the photo was taken with a digital camera of recent manufacture. Most likely there was a CD with the camera to install software in your computer to download and process the digital images from the camera. So far I have bought 3 digital cameras and they all had some additional software on the CD that allowed you to edit the image to some extent. The one for my current camera is called ACDSee. If you don't have any editing software, I think I can send you a copy of mine, by email or CD. Try this: Go to your photos; right click on any photo; mine gives me the option"Open with ACDSee". Click on it, that photo goes to a different screen by itself. Across the top of the screen there are words: File- Edit-View-Tools, etc. If I click on "Tools", a box opens up with options to use on the photo. One of the options is "Resize"; clicking on it brings up a screen with controls to make the photo bigger or smaller. Do some exploring on your computer, I'd bet you have something similar

carpetman
05-15-2005, 01:03 PM
BCD--Couple of things you might try to get the RCBS luber to work. To begin with they seem to hold pressure better than Lymans. Enough so that once the pressure is built up,you may be able to lube several bullets before applying more pressure. Before you apply pressure to the the lube(from the toggle handle on newer ones or the ratchet on older ones)be sure you are holding a firm pressure on the main operating handle. If you dont have firm pressure there it's about 100% that you will have a big glob of lube on the base of the bullet. After you have lubed a few bullets and determined more pressure is needed on the lube,a very little is all the pressure you apply. A little goes a long ways. Once you get things going,rhythm established,they work pretty smooth. The old ratchet feed is much better than the new toggle handle,but with some work,they can be converted. Because they do hold pressure,when done back off the pressure on the lube a few turns or you will have seepage.

Junior1942
05-15-2005, 03:23 PM
Sorry about the large picture!!! How do I get it smaller the next time I decide to post a picture? Thanks...BCBSet your camera to the "Email" or "Web" setting or whatever setting takes smaller photos. You want a picture about 640 x 480 pixels in size. Mega pixel photos are great for color hard-copy photos but AWFUL for Internet use, especially for guys like me with dial-up connections.

357tex
05-15-2005, 03:35 PM
I am not an expert by no means. But I do tumble lube lymans 311466 boolits.The first coat is light then size seat gas check,then 2 heavy coats of Lee Lq.alox.most of the time shoot at 1900fps in my mosen 7.62x54.but working up a load with 3031 37gr.they run 2200fps give or take 50fps .Shot30 of them just to see if they would lead.not much but not much accuracy either.better35gr. blc2 .3in grops at 100yd 1900fps.

454PB
05-15-2005, 03:46 PM
BCB:

Here is a link for a photo imaging resizer, it's a free download from Microsoft. You will find the resizer about half way down the page. I use about a half dozen different photo resizing programs, but this one is the easiest, fastest, and smallest. It integrates itself into Windows, and resizing a picture is a simple right click on the photo file name.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.mspx

StarMetal
05-15-2005, 04:42 PM
Ok Ok, enough about how good Lee sizers are. I'm not buying the sales pitch. Without doubt a good Lyman, RCBS, Saeco, and Star sizer are the best. Sized, lubed, checked, in on easy no mess, no fuss method. One guy tell how great the Lee's are and everyone jumps on the wagon. Well if they are so good how come I get groups like these with supposely bent bullets with my Lyman sizer?

http://www.hunt101.com/img/151409.jpg
7mm-8 Sako Mannlicher carbine 100 yds, 135 Lee gashcheck at 2640 fps!!!!!!!, those four are into 28 mm's. No leading with my own lube.

http://www.hunt101.com/img/228920.jpg
Steyr Model 95 8x56R oldfeller 200 some grain boxcar bullet, receiver sights 100 yds. No leading

http://www.hunt101.com/img/077873.JPG
CZ 550 30-06, lyman 314299 100 yards my lube no leading

http://www.hunt101.com/img/196517.jpg
Yugo 48B Mauser 8x57 240 gr Lyman Loverin spitzer 2400 fps receiver sights 100 yard my lube no leading

http://www.hunt101.com/img/088387.jpg
Yugo SKS Lee 312155 issue sights 100 yards my lube no leading

I'll be damn if I'm going to buy all Lee sizer and do it the inconveint way while I have a good lyman that apparently isn't bending my bullets, isn't messy, doesn't leak lube, I don't get lube under the bullets on the bases.

All these loads are 1800 fps and higher, except where noted and the SKS load is around 2200 fps.

Joe

Scrounger
05-15-2005, 04:59 PM
[smilie=l: StarMetal
Boolit Master




Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 399

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ok Ok, enough about how good Lee sizers are. I'm not buying the sales pitch. Without doubt a good Lyman, RCBS, Saeco, and Star sizer are the best. Sized, lubed, checked, in on easy no mess, no fuss method. One guy tell how great the Lee's are and everyone jumps on the wagon. Well if they are so good how come I get groups like these with supposely bent bullets with my Lyman sizer?

[smilie=l: Maybe you have a better keyboard ???? Just kidding, Joe. :grin:

BCB
05-15-2005, 05:14 PM
I am using Kodak software. I got to thinking about the Microsoft stuff. So I went in and right clicked on a picture and told it to "open with" Microsoft whatever it was. Sure enough, there is the 'resize' option. I tried it and it worked--I think. Now if I can just figure out how I posted that previous picture!!!Ain't nothing easy anymore. Thanks...BCB

BCB
05-15-2005, 05:17 PM
Carpetman,
Thanks for the hints on getting my Lube-O-Matic to function a bit better. I think if I had someone locally to just show me one time how to make it work properly, I might use it to lube bullets. I will just have to get into a "patient mood" and attempt it someday myself. I even have a heating unit for it thinking that might be the problem...BCB

StarMetal
05-15-2005, 05:19 PM
Art

It's a brand new keyboard har har har

Joe

Cayoot
05-15-2005, 05:39 PM
So StarMetal....what's your recipe for lube? It seems to be working at high velocity pretty well.

carpetman
05-15-2005, 05:59 PM
BCB--You are welcome for the info. I used a Lyman luber sizer from 1967 until in the 90's. In the early 90's ran across a deal on the RCBS. They are both very similar in operation--dies and top punches interchange. I have never used a heater and have never used hard lubes that required them. Prior to FWFBL I mostly used Javalina and Lyman lubes. The main thing is hold a pretty firm pressure on the main handle while applying pressure to the lube. The lube pressure is like Brylcreem--"a little dab will do ya"--only the old geezers will remember that.

BCB
05-15-2005, 06:43 PM
I used Brylcream (sp) or Vitalis!!!! Vitalis was a bit more greasy, but I think the smell was more attractive to the chicks...BCB

44man
05-15-2005, 07:40 PM
Starmetal, I use the RCBS to seat some checks and to lube some boolits that do not get sized because I use a larger die. However over the years when I had boolits that did need sizing, my Lyman and RCBS would always size one side of the boolit more then the other. I tried every solution on earth to try to size a boolit evenly from both of these machines. I do not have this problem in the Lee sizers and if I take two boolits and size one in the RCBS and one in the Lee, only the one from the Lee will be perfect. You can also push a flat nose boolit through the lee base first to seat a check.
I make my molds with a tight check portion so I have to tap the check on the boolit. I rap them on my bench. Once run through the die there is no way to get one off without destroying the boolit. Most of my boolits do not get sized anyway and I use the Lee to take off the extra lube. Works great as a cake cutter.

StarMetal
05-15-2005, 08:02 PM
44man

My lyman sizes dead center from what I can measure and tell. If you run the ram down without a bullet and use a bullet punch where the nose is very close to the size of the sizing die you can eyeball it and see that it has the same clearance all the ways around, it's very centered. I have also not had any problems where the bullet required so much force that it bent it. I've never broken the linkage on it and this thing I'm going to mention surprised Buckshot when I told him. Buckshot and I are noted for sizing bullets from one size caliber to another. For example I have sized down 150 gr loverins in 7mm to 6.5, but I've even gone more drastic then that. Anyways what surprised Buckshot is that I've be able to size down jacketed bullets with my Lyman. If you get a good Lyman or RCBS that is properly made and aligned, it's every bit as good as a Lee sizing die. Cost more money yeah, but still good.

Joe

StarMetal
05-15-2005, 08:32 PM
Cayoot

It's a mixture of Slick 50 One Grease, ATF oil, and beeswax.

Joe

David R
05-15-2005, 08:35 PM
I had a lee sizer, used 35 cal TL boolits, they worked. I sprung for the Lyman around 1988 and have used it since. It sizes the boolets in the center, I too shot a 1" (give or take) group, and also shot boolits at 2700fps with no leading. I use RCBS lube in the green stick. I have no idea where the lee sizer is and don't care.

To each his own.

Nice targets Starmetal :)

Ranch Dog
05-15-2005, 08:59 PM
Here are my bad boy TLC432-285-RFs waxed up with the Lee Liquid Alox and ready to rumble. They clock 2370 FPS out of the 24" barrel of my 444T and I don't have any lube problems. I use 3 coats or what ever is necessary to fill the lube grooves.

jh45gun
05-15-2005, 09:03 PM
Bottom Line is for me the lee stuff I can afford and it works. The whole setup cost under 30 bucks for even a custom sized one which is the price of a sizer for one caliber for the lubrisizers you guys are talking about. For the price of a lubrisizer I can get Lee sizers for every thing I shoot and that does not include getting the individual sizers for the lubrisizer. Its just economics to me and like I said the Lee sizers just plain work. Jim

Rrusse11
05-15-2005, 09:29 PM
Here are my bad boy TLC432-285-RFs waxed up with the Lee Liquid Alox and ready to rumble. They clock 2370 FPS out of the 24" barrel of my 444T and I don't have any lube problems. I use 3 coats or what ever is necessary to fill the lube grooves.

Michael,
When ya gonna' set up another run of ur boolit? A 6 banger would be great, but I'd certainly be happy with a double cavity.
Cheers,
R*2

Willbird
05-15-2005, 10:08 PM
I was thinking about grinding ****** and several of the other super pills into a fine powder and mixing into my felix lube, the bullets would not bend then no matter what kind of lube sizer you sized them in :-)

Bill

StarMetal
05-15-2005, 10:21 PM
Willbird

I think alot of guys would be biting the bullet then.

Joe

Cayoot
05-16-2005, 12:20 AM
Michael,
When ya gonna' set up another run of ur boolit? A 6 banger would be great, but I'd certainly be happy with a double cavity.
Cheers,
R*2


WOW! Count me in on it if you ever set up another run of that beauty!

454PB
05-16-2005, 12:59 AM
BCB, here is an example:

Buckshot
05-16-2005, 04:41 AM
............I just posted a photo over on "Casting Equipment" showing how I handled the alignment issue on my Old Lyman lube-sizer.

http://www.fototime.com/0EC721E256DE02F/standard.jpg

Here's a couple Saeco tapered .336" shuetzen boolits TL'd as Maineboy and others mentioned, then run up through a ho-made push through sizer. One even had a GC put on it, but it had to go up base first. Not required if the boolit is SUPPOSED to have a GC :-)!

.............Buckshot

Four Fingers of Death
05-16-2005, 04:55 AM
I use Lee push through sizers exclusively. I rarely lube boolits before sizing and applying checks, unless they are 3-4 thousandths oversize, then I might. On those occasions I've sprayed them with WD40 before sizing if I'm in a hurry, instead of applying a light coat of liquid alox and letting that dry. It doesn't take much liquid alox to lube boolits if the velocity is my usual 1200-1600 fps, but if the boolits are meant for more speed, I'll put on a second coat.

Years ago, when I shot a lot of 38-357 revolters, I did have an old Lyman lubrisizer, but I sold it when I sold the guns. I don't miss it.



I have a Lyman and an RCBS Lubesizer and lots of gear to go with them. I aven't used them since getting the Lee sizers some ten or so years ago. I have cast lots and lots of 38s and 9mm boolits in the past. I lube the bullets with liquid alox and shoot them if I'm in a hurry. If I'm not and feeling keen I run them through the sizer and might even relube them. I use an ice cream bucket and tip them out onto some brown paper. I can't tell the difference performance between the lubed unsized, lubed sized, lubed sized lubed boolits.

You gotta think outside the square when using Lee products. I have't used Lee moulds with this process, just RCBS, Lyman and Cast Bullet Engineering (both standard and custom) moulds. Virtually all of the boolits I have meved through the Lee sizers are traditional big grease groove boolits, but the liquid Alox seems to work fine with all of them. I haven't tried gas checks yet.

jeff223
05-16-2005, 08:22 AM
thanks everyone.i sure have alot to learn.lots of good info here from all of you.

thanks again
jeff

carpetman
05-16-2005, 10:44 AM
Willbird--If you use ****** in your lube,you'd need a ****** hardness tester.

StarMetal
05-16-2005, 11:57 AM
......and I might add Carpetman that the hardness tester must be operated by a female tester.

Joe

Willbird
05-16-2005, 12:41 PM
I was just going to keep adding powdered blue pills until the boolit would cut glass.

Bill

Hang Fire
05-19-2005, 07:41 PM
Jeff223:

IMO Lee RL equipement is the equal or better to all the high priced guys in quality, and they are a hell of a lot easier on the wallet.