454 Brass - Open Primer Pocket to LP

[missionary5155]

Good morning
No one seems to like the Small Rifle Primer Pocket on the 454 brass so how hard is it to open that small pocket to LP size ?
Today is a national holiday here in Peru so I am going to experiment a bit with some old 38 special brass. I figure with all the unwanted 454 brass there must be a simple ,easy, cheap, fast way to modify primer pockets to the LP size.
Any Ideas ?
Pondering this I have decided to find my closest drill bit to LP diameter (Uses a 44-40 case for that) . Drill 5 38 SP cases to proper depth - .005 Grind off the drill bit to flat point and finish to depth. Check for diameter- may need a simple " Polish job to exact diameter. Attempt to seat 5 primers.

Thanks !!!! [smilie=2:

[NickSS]

I can't imagine why go to all this trouble. I am positive that they went to small rifle primers because of the high pressure this cartridge works at. A large pistol primer will probably give problems. I have some 454 brass that I cut down to make hot loads for a 45 colt carbine. I will not give details but they would probably blow a colt clone apart and maybe stretch a Marlin lever action a bit as well. I certainly do not want a soft pistol primer for these loads.

[Lloyd Smale]

just find some smith and wesson 460 brass and cut it to 454 lenght.

[Whitworth]

just find some smith and wesson 460 brass and cut it to 454 lenght.


Yup, that is what we did.

[44man]

I will be making another test later today. I found the .460 brass mixed in with .44 brass in a big plastic bag.

[44man]

I just got back up from shooting the .460 brass. I just don't have enough cases to work loads so went close to max with the 325 gr boolit. I have 10 cases.
First, they cut groups in half on the average. Loads need worked but it is hard with just a few cases.
Anyway I took a picture of the primer to show that even with max book loads a large pistol mag primer is fine. I have shot hotter in another gun with them and never even had one get flat. These are Fed 155's.
You need to work on the edge of insanity to need a tougher primer and the .454 just does not need 55,000 psi loads with cast anyway.
The LP primer will run just fine from 34,000 to 40,000 and maybe more.
Shooting jacketed at 55,000 I would go to a LR primer to prevent primer setback against the recoil plate. I would look for the mildest I could find.
If I had a pile of brass and my own .454 I would do all the testing but it is a caliber I never fell for. I do not know the pressure limit of a LP primer but a cast boolit at over 1500 fps is all anyone needs.

[missionary5155]

Hello again
Changing a primer pocket from small diameter to large diameter is not a tough task. Getting set up and thinking through the process and a few sideline experiments take longer than actually doing it.
As I have plenty of small primer 454 brass and care not to buy expensive brass just to wack off half of it I decided I wanted to find out how tedious the project could be.
The included foto has the prime ingredients and a finished case. May be the only Large Primer 38 Special case you ever see.
I found a few 308 cases to get my Large Primer measurements. IF I had a drill Index Set here it would have been even easier as I would have had the correct size bit and not had to ream the almost correct new cut primer pocket.
I used a 13/64 bit in my drill press to do the drilling to depth... about .005 less than I needed. I used 38 Special brass to gain technique. The wood holder was drilled to outside diameter then split well past the hole to get a good crush grab on the case in the vise for drilling and finish reaming.
The process was...
#1 Drill cases with 13/64. The next size bit from a drill guide would be perfect.
# 2 Grind off the point of the bit making it flat point to finish the primer hole.
# 3 Finish the primer hole to depth. I used my dial caliper to check depth.
#4 Due to my undersized bit I used my primer pocket reamer to open it to spec.
#5 Chamfer the primer pocket mouth. I used the case chamfer tool pictured.
#6 Seat primer.
With the correct size bit I could I could produce at least 50 cases an hour... I would have a second bit ground off ready to insert. Do these in a group of 50 and you could breeze right through. Once you have the depth set on the drill press all else is quick. Reset the depth for the final flat point drilling and cut the chamfer.
To me this is a simple solution to the 454 case that would benefit from a large primer. Again you can buy the .460 case and cut off a chunck... I would rather not spend the money and do a little easy work.

[44man]

Nice work! [smilie=w:

[sagacious]

Very nice indeed. Easy and straight-forward. Good job!

[Dale53]

I would think a primer pocket uniformer would be the tool to do the final drilling.

Start it with a drill of the proper size, then finish with the uniformer. This notion just may take hold of me.

I certainly agree with 44man that we don't really need to drive these things at over 40,000 psi. Large pistol primers, at a reasonable pressure level, should solve a lot of potential problems with the .454 Casull. I guess we can call it the ".454 Nearly":bigsmyl2:[smilie=l:

FWIW
Dale53

[44man]

I would think a primer pocket uniformer would be the tool to do the final drilling.

Start it with a drill of the proper size, then finish with the uniformer. This notion just may take hold of me.

I certainly agree with 44man that we don't really need to drive these things at over 40,000 psi. Large pistol primers, at a reasonable pressure level, should solve a lot of potential problems with the .454 Casull. I guess we can call it the ".454 Nearly":bigsmyl2:[smilie=l:

FWIW
Dale53
I know one thing about them at reasonable velocities. I rebuilt my boolit trap with very thick wood at the back and much larger nails. It is 3 feet long and the back is getting knocked out, splitting the wood and pulling nails. Same on the sides. The energy in the rubber mulch is something to see.
Since I have a lathe, I am going to open some .454 brass, just need to make some tools.
I even got starting loads of 296 to ignite reliably with a standard LP primer but the mag primer is more accurate. The larger primer allows load work where the SR primer must be loaded to max unless you use a faster powder.

[missionary5155]

Greetings
I would have uesd the primer pocket uniformer but alas I do not have one here and this was an "Experiment" to learn procedure so when I next get back to my stuff in Illinois I am ready to jump on it. Plus down here I have a drill doctor so grinding a bit was no big deal... it worked really good.
It just seemed to simple an opperation not to try and give all those 454 SP cases a new life.

[44man]

Greetings
I would have uesd the primer pocket uniformer but alas I do not have one here and this was an "Experiment" to learn procedure so when I next get back to my stuff in Illinois I am ready to jump on it. Plus down here I have a drill doctor so grinding a bit was no big deal... it worked really good.
It just seemed to simple an opperation not to try and give all those 454 SP cases a new life.
The pocket uniformer does not cut well, it scrapes. The flat drill is better.

[44man]

I just made a drill for the primer pockets. I ground the drill flat and made cutting edges. It does NOT need a pre-drill, just drill to the stop. It cuts very fast and easy.
Chuck a case in the lathe and just cut. Primers fit about right. I used a number 4 drill bit. I set it to drill .112" deep.

[missionary5155]

That is even a better solution... watch out small primer pockets !

[44man]

Hey guys, a number 4 drill is too large. I went to a 5 and then the uniformer tool and they seat primers just right.

[44man]

I shot the cases today with Fed 155 primers. On the left is a max load for the cast boolit. I used the Lee 300 gr with cat scratch crimp grooves. I shot 4 and looked at number 5, the boolit did not move at all. Group was decent at 50.
I then went to 40,000 PSI and groups opened some. But the primer still looked normal, no flattening at all. Boolits still did not pull crimp.
I don't know if I have exceeded spin or alloy with skidding boolits so a harder boolit needs tested or I need to back down and work loads.
I am confident that the LP primer will take any pressure that a cast boolit is good for before alloy or twist failure.
It also goes to show that just a moderate roll crimp will even hold a Lee boolit if case tension is correct.
This is getting interesting but darn it I need to make some hard alloy and drill more brass.
I am going to load one shot to 55,000 PSI to see what happens. I will get back.

[RobS]

44man: Very cool...........I like to see things in the works which makes reading your posts very interesting. I may have to work on my 454 casull brass next thanks to this thread.

[44man]

OK, I just shot a load that must be around 55,000 PSI. I will only say it is higher then the max load for a 300 gr bullet since I am using a 300 gr cast. I will not tell the load.
NOTHING! Case fell out and the primer is not as flat as my normal .44 loads.
I would have no fear working loads from starting to max using a LP primer now that I seen the gun comics are just something to laugh at.
Remember, the Federal is supposed to be the softest too.

[missionary5155]

Thanks 44man for that fine picture ! That is the first Large Primer 454 case I have seen.

[mdi]

I would be interested in knowing how much metal was left around the primer pocket. Are the bases solid brass all the way up to the powder chamber/area? Solid beyond flash hole? Mebby one could be sectioned and measured?

[missionary5155]

Greetings mdi
I think production of ballon head cases ceased before I was born.
But that is an interesting thought. The weakest link in modern cases is where the primer pocket and vent hole are. I would be reasonably certain that if the primer cub can support the internal pressure the case head supported by the breach face will not have any failure.
I just checked some info and ballon head cases ceased being produced about 1960... So I guess I was around.

[RobS]

Well, I made up some 454 casull cases this evening. Used a #5 bit (.2055") and I went as deep as the previous primer pocket. I finished up with a LP pocket reamer and a round ball head dremel bit to bevel the top of the primer pocket hole.

They look pretty good and plan on testing them out tomorrow. I have them loaded up with some 260 grain LFN bullets and some 280 grain Keiths. To compare I also have some small primed brass with the exact same loads.

http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt206/RobS01/454Casullprimerpockets.jpg

[RobS]

mdi: The head of the brass is solid.

[RobS]

cross section of the brass

http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt206/RobS01/PrimerPockets.jpg

[Ed K]

I like this thread :)

[454PB]

I like this thread :)

Me too.

I was in my loading room for a while, measuring bits, primer pockets, and flash holes.

A #4 bit should be just right (.2095"), but isn't......primer fit very loosely. A large pistol primer measures .210".

A #5 bit is too small (.2055"), the primer wouldn't seat....at least at the amount of pressure I was willing to exert.

The I wondered about a difference in flash holes diameters, so I measured a few by using numbered drill bits. All (small rifle, small pistol, and large pistol) accept a #45 drill bit, won't quite take a #44. That tells me there's no problems with flash hole size in a converted primer pocket.

So, I'm still thinking of options.....primer pocket uniformer, modified #4 drill bit, or tapering the hole as RobS did.

[44man]

Me too.

I was in my loading room for a while, measuring bits, primer pockets, and flash holes.

A #4 bit should be just right (.2095"), but isn't......primer fit very loosely. A large pistol primer measures .210".

A #5 bit is too small (.2055"), the primer wouldn't seat....at least at the amount of pressure I was willing to exert.

The I wondered about a difference in flash holes diameters, so I measured a few by using numbered drill bits. All (small rifle, small pistol, and large pistol) accept a #45 drill bit, won't quite take a #44. That tells me there's no problems with flash hole size in a converted primer pocket.

So, I'm still thinking of options.....primer pocket uniformer, modified #4 drill bit, or tapering the hole as RobS did.
A number 5 is just right if you run a uniformer in. It does not seem to remove any metal but might burnish the sides a tad.
I found the same thing with tight pockets after drilling but just a twist with the uniformer did the trick. I do not see any cuttings from the uniformer.
Rob did not taper the hole, he just deburred the edge and it is not necessary. I just twisted a 60* countersink on the edge.

[RobS]

Nope it isn't necessary to bevel the mouth of primer pocket hole; however it does make things easier on a progressive press. I've noted that all the factory brass primer pockets I've looked at have has just a bit of bevel to them that way there isn't a straight 90 degree angle to them; they are more rounded edges rather. If you look at the cross section cut of the left pic of the factory 454 casull brass above you can note this. Primers are snug the first time around with the #5 bit, but are good to go the second seating.

[missionary5155]

When I did my drilling here on the 38 Special case I used my Lee case chamfer tool (in picture) to bevel the pocket opening. I also tried a 3/8 drill bit hand held.. a couple turns and all was nicely done.

[RobS]

Just tried some brass without the bevel and a no go on the progressive press.........well they went in about 3/4's way and then smashed the top of the primer. I thought the primer was just bottoming out at first so I re-measured the pocket depth and it was deep enough.

The process is a bit slow, not too bad though, but way better than cutting down 460 brass $$$$ :shock: and is better than 45 colt brass in that the front drive band of my boolits sit in the cylinder throats as I like and there is less bullet jump as well with 454 casull brass.

[shotman]

may try an end mill bit Mc Master carr has a lot of types and cutting brass would last a long time

[RobS]

I had a chance to shoot some loads with the modified LP primer pockets and I found that groups generally tightened up especially on the loads that had larger ES with the small rifle primers. The two loads shot were a 260 grain LFN and a 280 grain Keith with all loads charged with 12.5 grains of Herco.

The 280g Keith loads with the small rifle primers had lower ES (14) vs the 260g LFN (26) and is probably due to more case tension (more bullet in the case) and less open space in the case.

The great part is with the large pistol primer loads the ES on the Keiths was 8 and the LFN was 10 both shooting an average in the 1,140's fps. Where as before with the small primer pockets velocities with the Keith were averaged at 1,134 fps area and the LFN's were 1,093 fps.

Accuracy was much better with the LFN bullets that were shot from the brass with LP primers and the Keiths were close and I just may have had a better group with the LP brass if I wouldn't have blown the group with a flyier.

An unscientific comparison of LP vs SR primer ignition:

SR=Wolf; wolf states their standard SR primer is the same as their magnum SR just made with a softer cup
LP=Wolf

I loaded up a dummy round of each with just a seated primer (no powder/no bullet) in my revolver and headed off to a dark room in the garage. I set them off and there is definately more ignition potential with the LP primers. Flame from the end of the gun was doubled with the LP and the blast from the LP was about twice as loud.

I think with the shooting results alone I am going to convert all my 454 casull brass to LP primers.

[missionary5155]

Great info here. Really makes me wonder why a SR primer was used ?

[RobS]

Me too, other than possibly the design being too thin at the web with a large primer pocket diameter when pushing 454 Casull max pressures. 44man did test his with a max or a bit over a max load and he saw no signs of problems so that shows promise. I don't know if repeat max loads would have any ill effects or not though.

I cross sectioned a 44 mag case and it is darn near the same regarding the web thickness at the primer pocket as the 454 Casull case (only .0005 different from my sample). Another note the walls are thicker on the 454 Casull especially toward the head of the brass. For my purposes I never shoot up there in the 55K range and more typically run in the 30K range and sometimes run in the 40K area. Comparing, I figure the 454 Casull brass to be equal to or exceeds 44 mag brass and at a worst be able to handle the pressures that 44 mag brass can.

[44man]

Great info here. Really makes me wonder why a SR primer was used ?
I still think it was from original experiments when duplex and triplex loads were used and pressures were way above sanity. Dick destroyed a lot of guns and felt the SR primer was tougher. I think he worked to 90,000 PSI or until gun failure.
Dick actually put some Bullseye in the case before other powders.
The primer problem showed up when I used starting loads of 296, they would not ignite the powder and the primer pressure blew boolits into the rifling. I needed a brass rod and hammer at my range. Only max loads lit off but SD's and ES's were too bad. I found even a standard LP primer would light off starting loads but the mag primer was more accurate. They generate more heat.
None of this had anything to do with case tension or crimp because I use max tension.
I think the primer compound fire in a SR primer just goes out too soon.

[missionary5155]

Well that clears up a few clouds.. That is some high pressure loading in a handheld lead slinger. But still why not start with a LRP ? Almost sounds like a Benchrest orientation.
Oh well... least we know there is a simple way to change over small primer pockets to large primer pockets.

[Dale53]

I continue to follow this thread with interest.

After reviewing the information herein, it looks to me like a good method would be to use the modified #5 drill then finish off with an RCBS Large Pistol primer pocket swage. You would be insured of a near perfect fit. Since the case is supported from the inside with an RCBS swage, there will be no rim damage, either. Further, the primer pocket entrance will be nicely rounded for primer use with a Progressive Press.

Dale53

[44man]

I shot some today with Jerry's gun and had 4 in 3/4" at 50 with one out a tad.

[454PB]

I played with it some more today, and finally found a method that works for me.

I first made an adjustable stop collar for the #5 bit, similar to the one 44man made in post #14. Tried it out, and the brass chips kept plugging the drill bit flutes, which negated the use of the stop collar. It also caused the primer hole to be too loose. I then did several tests without the stop and a modified bit profile, and that worked well.

The trick is proper bit point profile. I sharpened it as normal, then ground a flt nose to within about .010" of the cutting flute. If flattened completely, it won't cut and just rubs a bright spot. That flat point become a stop, preventing the bit from removing too much material and a too deep pocket. No chamfering of the hole edge is required.

I used my RCBS priming tool to seat the primers, and although it takes more pressure than normal, it was not enough to worry me.

[Houndog]

44 man,
Check the diameter of your flash holes!!!!! I have never worked with the 454 Casul, but primers are not a good indicator of pressure with some of the real small flash hole brass such as the 6PPc and BR Lapua cases. From the looks of your picture, that may be a possibility. I recently got some Winchester brass in 9MM that had grossly undersized flash holes, and if you guys worked up a smokin hot load in cases with say a .062 flash hole and your next batch had something like the normal .080 or larger. it could be trouble. Winchester's brass certainly ain't what it used to be!

FWIW: Sinclair used to make an adjustable primer uniforming tool with both small and large sized cutters that were actually carbide end mills. If they still make that tool, that would be ideal for your primer pocket change. I've had mine over 20 years and never readjusted the cutter or replaced the end mill in that length of time.

[44man]

I played with it some more today, and finally found a method that works for me.

I first made an adjustable stop collar for the #5 bit, similar to the one 44man made in post #14. Tried it out, and the brass chips kept plugging the drill bit flutes, which negated the use of the stop collar. It also caused the primer hole to be too loose. I then did several tests without the stop and a modified bit profile, and that worked well.

The trick is proper bit point profile. I sharpened it as normal, then ground a flt nose to within about .010" of the cutting flute. If flattened completely, it won't cut and just rubs a bright spot. That flat point become a stop, preventing the bit from removing too much material and a too deep pocket. No chamfering of the hole edge is required.

I used my RCBS priming tool to seat the primers, and although it takes more pressure than normal, it was not enough to worry me.
I used a little cut off wheel to shorten the bit so the collar has no flutes inside. Chips can't go in mine.

[44man]

44 man,
Check the diameter of your flash holes!!!!! I have never worked with the 454 Casul, but primers are not a good indicator of pressure with some of the real small flash hole brass such as the 6PPc and BR Lapua cases. From the looks of your picture, that may be a possibility. I recently got some Winchester brass in 9MM that had grossly undersized flash holes, and if you guys worked up a smokin hot load in cases with say a .062 flash hole and your next batch had something like the normal .080 or larger. it could be trouble. Winchester's brass certainly ain't what it used to be!

FWIW: Sinclair used to make an adjustable primer uniforming tool with both small and large sized cutters that were actually carbide end mills. If they still make that tool, that would be ideal for your primer pocket change. I've had mine over 20 years and never readjusted the cutter or replaced the end mill in that length of time.
Flash holes in Starline brass will just take an .081" drill bit. WW brass is the same.
.44 mag will take an .082".

[454PB]

Hounddog does make a good point.

I finished opening the primer pockets on one lot of 50 cases, and ALL the flash holes were undersized by the act of the bit bottoming out in the primer pocket.

I uniformed them all by using a #45 drill bit.

I also find that performing this operation using a lathe is time consuming and hard on the lathe motor. 50 starts and stops for one box of modified cases.

[44man]

Hounddog does make a good point.

I finished opening the primer pockets on one lot of 50 cases, and ALL the flash holes were undersized by the act of the bit bottoming out in the primer pocket.

I uniformed them all by using a #45 drill bit.

I also find that performing this operation using a lathe is time consuming and hard on the lathe motor. 50 starts and stops for one box of modified cases.
They cut so easy, you can put the chuck in free wheel and spin it by hand.

[Groo]

Groo here
I always wondered why FA went with the SR primer also..
I have some original FA cases with LP pockets in them ,also some bushings
to change over to SR .. [never used them]
Can anyone tell if the volume of the case has gotten smaller?
The loads I use to make were hotter than anything I have seen lately.

[Humbo]

I'm reviving this thread, I find it most interesting.
Did anyone try to open up the 454 Casull primer pockets to accept a LR primer? I measured the case head of a Starline .500 S&W case and a Win .454 Casull case. The 454 is actually thicker by about 0.010. So the 454 case should be fat enough for a LR primer. Any thoughts?

[44man]

I'm reviving this thread, I find it most interesting.
Did anyone try to open up the 454 Casull primer pockets to accept a LR primer? I measured the case head of a Starline .500 S&W case and a Win .454 Casull case. The 454 is actually thicker by about 0.010. So the 454 case should be fat enough for a LR primer. Any thoughts?
I would not use a LR primer. That will raise pressures too high and also blow out boolits before good ignition. I did some research and even the .475 and .500 JRH should NOT use a LR primer. The .454 brass is smaller.
You might get in trouble if a few LP cut cases get mixed in too. The LR will stick up and can fire against the recoil plate.
This was blowing up the S&W .500's. There is brass floating around that is made for the LP primer and also the LR. Guys were using the LR primer in both and a round would go off in another chamber.
You really need to know what pocket your .500 S&W brass has so the safest primer would be a LP mag in all brass.
Why brass was made so different baffles me because the LP primer works fine in pockets made for a LR.
The parent brass for the .475 is 45-70 with LR pockets but they should not be used. I even shoot the 45-70 with LP primers.
JRH brass is made from .500 S&W so who knows if some are LP and others LR???
I started all this because the SR primer did not have enough fire in the .454 but had a lot of pressure. Keeping pressure low and heat high is always better.
This even proves out with the .44 and .45 Colt, I use a FED 150 in both with 296.
I had to delete a lot of pictures, I ran out of room and am close to it again. After I clean out some old ones, if anyone needs a picture back I will post it again.

[44man]

While on primers, some might not have seen my results with a .45 ACP revolver.
Groups---well, patterns were miserable! :veryconfu We tried all loads. I sat and looked at the brass and came to the conclusion the LP primer is just too much of a good thing.
I made bushings and went to a SP standard primer to test. I cut patterns to small round groups right away. They even shot much better in the 1911.
My friend located a large supply of brass made for the SP primer and life is good for him.
So I have to ask why is most .45 ACP brass made for the LP primer?
That would be OK for military use I suppose.

[ole 5 hole group]

While on primers, some might not have seen my results with a .45 ACP revolver.
Groups---well, patterns were miserable! :veryconfu We tried all loads. I sat and looked at the brass and came to the conclusion the LP primer is just too much of a good thing.
I made bushings and went to a SP standard primer to test. I cut patterns to small round groups right away. They even shot much better in the 1911.
My friend located a large supply of brass made for the SP primer and life is good for him.
So I have to ask why is most .45 ACP brass made for the LP primer?
That would be OK for military use I suppose.

I guess because that's the way it's always been. I've never heard of the SP primer working better in the 45ACP than a LP primer. I know of no major match ammunition manufacturer using the SP primer in 45ACP match ammo, so if there was a slight possibility of the SP primer having an accuracy advantage, I would think they would be using the SP primer in their match grade ammo and the top competitors would be shooting it.

[Frank]

ole 5 hole group:
I would think they would be using the SP primer in their match grade ammo and the top competitors would be shooting it.
There's jump in a revolver and a primer can be a hindrance to a revolver if it is blowing out the bullet too quick.

Now what if a bullet is snug or even tight in the throats? Wouldn't that hold it in for a small rifle primer to work? :coffeecom

[44man]

I guess because that's the way it's always been. I've never heard of the SP primer working better in the 45ACP than a LP primer. I know of no major match ammunition manufacturer using the SP primer in 45ACP match ammo, so if there was a slight possibility of the SP primer having an accuracy advantage, I would think they would be using the SP primer in their match grade ammo and the top competitors would be shooting it.
Maybe a lot of them ARE using SP primers. The brass we got was once fired collected at matches. The outfit had a huge quantity of the brass and my friend bought either 1 or 2000 cases. Someone has to be using the stuff. The head stamp is Speer by the way.
Go to www.oncefiredbrass.com/45acp and check it out.

[44man]

ole 5 hole group:
There's jump in a revolver and a primer can be a hindrance to a revolver if it is blowing out the bullet too quick.

Now what if a bullet is snug or even tight in the throats? Wouldn't that hold it in for a small rifle primer to work? :coffeecom
Not enough. A single shot, rifle or auto would work better.
It is amazing the force a SR primer has. Some boolits were blown 1-1/2" up the bore with all the powder behind it. The rear surface of the powder was just a little off color.
Now imagine if it had a spark left and decided to go off from that position!!!! NO THANKS.
These were LBT 335 gr WLNGC boolits and very tight case tension with a good crimp.

[Frank]

44man:
It is amazing the force a SR primer has. Some boolits were blown 1-1/2" up the bore with all the powder behind it. The rear surface of the powder was just a little off color.

It is amazing how the bullet does move from just the primer. The Fed155 will blow the bullet into the gap if no powder is in there. So perhaps in a revolver, the effective seating depth is where the bullet is when the powder ignites, is what I was getting at.

[45r]

I haven't had problems with accuracy using SRP's but if enough people wanted LPP's maybe they could get Starline to make some.

[Humbo]

I've actually contacted Starline, and the minimum order for custom brass is between 100,000 and 250,000 pieces. There will also be a onetime tooling charge of 750 USD.

[Groo]

Groo here
I might be interested in a few hundo depending on price,,
also how about 45colt basic brass and just a bit longer.

[Humbo]

Maybe an idea for a group buy?

[Groo]

Not enough. A single shot, rifle or auto would work better.
It is amazing the force a SR primer has. Some boolits were blown 1-1/2" up the bore with all the powder behind it. The rear surface of the powder was just a little off color.
Now imagine if it had a spark left and decided to go off from that position!!!! NO THANKS.
These were LBT 335 gr WLNGC boolits and very tight case tension with a good crimp.
Groo here
That is just what I suggest happens when we get these k-booms that kill the
magnum pistols. [tipstrap goes by by]
but the spark is there..

[Grapeshot]

Good morning
No one seems to like the Small Rifle Primer Pocket on the 454 brass so how hard is it to open that small pocket to LP size ?
Today is a national holiday here in Peru so I am going to experiment a bit with some old 38 special brass. I figure with all the unwanted 454 brass there must be a simple ,easy, cheap, fast way to modify primer pockets to the LP size.
Any Ideas ?
Pondering this I have decided to find my closest drill bit to LP diameter (Uses a 44-40 case for that) . Drill 5 38 SP cases to proper depth - .005 Grind off the drill bit to flat point and finish to depth. Check for diameter- may need a simple " Polish job to exact diameter. Attempt to seat 5 primers.

Thanks !!!! [smilie=2:

Open the flash hole with a 3/32nd's inch bit. Use either the standard or magnum small pistol primer and you will be able to light any pistol powder you want. I did this with a batch of .454 Cassul brass I found mixed in with my .45 Colt brass I got from an indoor range.

I just trimmed them back to .45 Colt length and use them with my Anaconda and have had no problem with them. I do keep them segragated from standard .45 Colt cases w/ LPP pockets.:swagemine::cbpour:

[44man]

Open the flash hole with a 3/32nd's inch bit. Use either the standard or magnum small pistol primer and you will be able to light any pistol powder you want. I did this with a batch of .454 Cassul brass I found mixed in with my .45 Colt brass I got from an indoor range.

I just trimmed them back to .45 Colt length and use them with my Anaconda and have had no problem with them. I do keep them segragated from standard .45 Colt cases w/ LPP pockets.:swagemine::cbpour:
I would not suggest this because if one ever gets mixed up for a high pressure load you will be in trouble.
I have one box of cases with drilled flash holes just for rubber bullets fired by primers only. Those are never removed from their box.
Please do not open flash holes in .454 brass.

[Humbo]

I am lifting this thread again since I acquired a tool to open the primer pockets on the .454 brass. I don't shoot much full power loads any more, and figured that a LP primer should be sufficient for my use. And it also makes switching between .45 Colt and .454 Casull a lot easier on the Dillon 1050. I just need to get some more .454 brass before doing any testing, I don't want to experiment with my original FA brass.

322863 322864

[lar45]

You can always cut down 460 brass to get a large primer pocket

[Humbo]

You can always cut down 460 brass to get a large primer pocket

That is of course a possibility, but I would prefer to use LP primers, and .454 Casull brass is cheaper and more readily available also.