Will a 38-55 drop a deer at 200 yards

[Just Duke]

Will a scoped Marlin 38-55 drop a deer at 200 yards. Or Plus?
Looking at the Lyman 250 grain mould bullets I have cast up.
Maybe need one that's gas checked too for faster velocity.
TIA,
Duke

[Catshooter]

Duke,

For silhouette shooting I use the 375449 with a check (285 grains) at 1750 or so fps. This is not a full load. When I do my part they knock the 60 or so pound ram with ease & authority. Never shot a deer with though, but I can't imagine a deer would like it much.


Cat

[lonewolf5347]

I shoot soft cast Saeco #738 255gr BHN of 10 with IMR3031 33.0 Grains out of my H@R Buffalo classsic no gas check have no fear out to 125 yard with iron peep sight

[hpdrifter]

ONly if it's an Ackley Improved. :)

if you can hit it, it'll prolly kill it.

[NickSS]

You can load a 38-55 Marlin to the same ballistics of a 375 winchester and that will kill a deer at 200 yards but bullet drop and aiming points will have to be determined as it is not a flat shooting cartridge like say a 308 win. I one time killed an antelope at 443 yards per my lazer rangefinder with a black powder loaded 45-70 but I needed to know the range and sight settings for every range in 25 yard increments to do it. The antelope was standing and I fired prone after adjusting my sights.

[Bret4207]

Yes. If you put a good FN boolit in the vitals it will kill it. It probably won't be a "bang, flop" DRT type kill. The 38-55 was a great deer round in it's day, still is for hunters as opposed to "Hail Mary" shooters that bang away at stupid distances. You need some remaining velocity at your max distance, I'd feel okay with 13-1400 fps with a 255 gr FN boolit. 1600 would be better.

Do yourself and the deer a favor. Get a package of 9" paper plates. Start using them for targets at various distances. The max distance you should try and shoot at a deer is a little less than the max distance you can put all your rounds on that plate. IOW- if you can't put them all in the plate at 175 yards, but can at 150 then limit your self to a little under 150 yards. You go under the max distance because a deer doesn't offer the target contrast a paper plate will. Ethical hunting demands you err on the side of caution.

[Freightman]

Yes. If you put a good FN boolit in the vitals it will kill it. It probably won't be a "bang, flop" DRT type kill. The 38-55 was a great deer round in it's day, still is for hunters as opposed to "Hail Mary" shooters that bang away at stupid distances. You need some remaining velocity at your max distance, I'd feel okay with 13-1400 fps with a 255 gr FN boolit. 1600 would be better.

Do yourself and the deer a favor. Get a package of 9" paper plates. Start using them for targets at various distances. The max distance you should try and shoot at a deer is a little less than the max distance you can put all your rounds on that plate. IOW- if you can't put them all in the plate at 175 yards, but can at 150 then limit your self to a little under 150 yards. You go under the max distance because a deer doesn't offer the target contrast a paper plate will. Ethical hunting demands you err on the side of caution.
Great advise! paper plates are great to see how good you are with the "Kill Zone"
Saw a " Hail Mary hunter " shoot at a deer at well over 1000yds with a 30-30 all he accomplished was to make sure no other deer came around. I think some "hunters" think we have radar guided missals.

[GabbyM]

Trajectory tables found in the back of Lyman cast bullet handbook show a #375449 with a BC of .315 fired at 1700 fps with 100 yard zero to be 14.74” low at 200 yards with remaining velocity of 1340fps for an energy of 1052 ft lb. That sounds simple enough. However the tricky part comes in if your deer is actually 250 yards instead of what appears like 200. Your bullet drops off like a rock and you've lost 14.36 inches in only fifty yards for a drop of 29.1 inches. That makes it sound harder but if you compare it to say bow hunting it looks like a walk in the park.

A BHN# 10 or even a 12 will expand nicely at 1300 fps. So if you hit them you are carrying greater energy than a 44 mag handgun. With a higher SD bullet that will deliver it's load to the inside of the animal better than a fatter bore. IMO you want an expanding bullet in the 38 bore but that's an easy task. Lyman 49th Edition reloading Handbook on page 84 shows a photo of a #375449 BHN# 12 alloy fired at 1750 fps at a distance of 80 yards expanded to double caliber with 264.7 grains retained weight. It's down right inspiring.

[Old Goat Keeper]

What concerns me here is that it was recommended to load the 38-55 to 375 velocities! First off the 38-55 SAAMI pressure is held to 28K CUP and the 375 goes up to 50K CUP. The problem is not that a Marlin 336 won't handle 50K CUP but that the 38-55 brass won't on a repeated basis and will fail. 375 brass is heavier in construction to handle that pressure. It's sort of like trying to "magnumize" the 45-70 to equal a 458 magnum. If you need the extra power/speed then just SAFELY move up to the next more powerfull gun/cartridge combo. BTW, I have both a 38-55 Cowboy and an M375 Marlin.

Tom

[ammohead]

Will a scoped Marlin 38-55 drop a deer at 200 yards. Or Plus?
Looking at the Lyman 250 grain mould bullets I have cast up.
Maybe need one that's gas checked too for faster velocity.
TIA,
Duke

Hi Duke,

Cast boolit loads aren't famous for "dropping" animals at any distance. Unless of course you neck shoot or earhole them. My experience with lung/heart shots is hardly any kind of reaction at all at first then they stagger a bit and fall over dead. The lower velocity lacks the hydrostatic shock that you find with jword bullets at much higher velocities. The good part is that you don't see the massive amounts of bloodshot meat either. You can usually eat right up to the hole!

I plan on using my legacy 94 on a doe antleope in about a week. I will be sure to post the results.

ammohead

[scrapcan]

I will say unequivocally yes it will do what you ask. I have done it with a 1903 vintage winchester 1894 26 inch barrel rifle a couple times. bullet was a lyman 375449 w/ gascheck. I aim for a shot to vital area (heart/lungs). The bullet hits as expected and after much practice before hand. the first buck went 10 steps and hit the dirt, second a few years later was DRT shot that took the heart.

If you learn the trajectory and can judge distance, the round will do what you ask. But it is not as forgiving as a flatter shooting round in a scoped rifle.

[KirkD]

... the first buck went 10 steps and hit the dirt, second a few years later was DRT shot that took the heart.

Where you able to recover the bullet from either deer, or was there complete penetration?

I've only taken one Whitetail deer with a vintage 38-55. That one was at 75 yards and had complete penetration with a cast bullet and a muzzle velocity of 1,490 fps.

[scrapcan]

First deer yes. The slug ended up just under the skin on off side leg after it broke shoulder blade ( off side leg was back as deer had just stepped forward to open up the vital zone. I may still have the slug from the first deer in the junk box. Second deer it went to never never land and had a leak on off side.

[NickSS]

I ran into a hail mary shooter one time while hunting black tail in the Olympic mountains. I spotten a guy leaning on the hood of his pickup truck blasting away and the opposite side of a blind canyon. The range was nearly a mile. I could not even see what he was shooting at until I got out my spotting scope and looked hard. I saw a group of about six deer including one nice size 3 point buck feeding on the hill side. They did not know they were being shot at. Around that time this nimrod runs out of ammo and comes over to me ans asks if I have some 7mm Mag ammo that he could borrow. I told him I did not and he got in his truck and drove down the hill. I drove around to the other side of the canyon and looked over the side and about 50 yards down hill from me were the deer still feeding. I unlimbered my Marlin 30-30 and shot the Buck in the head and down it went. I climbed down to him and tied a rope oround him and towed him up to the logging road with my truck. Such was my experience with Hail Mary shots.

[Artful]

200 yards is not a hail mary shot - with good scope and range estimation a 38-55 should be able to connect - as far as killing power I don't know - I have shot deer with my 375 big bore but it was 220 j word bullet thru the heart about 150 yards and it did the job but then again with that hit I'd expect a 357 to do it as well.

When harvesting a game animal my thought is plan not for the broadside perfect shot but the worst shot your willing to take - thru a leg bone quarting onto you. Will it have enough power to do it then.

[home in oz]

Sounds like a good long way to me-at least for Joe Average hunter.

[KirkD]

I practice shooting at 200 yards with my open iron-sighted vintage 38-55 and can easily put 5 shots into a 6" circle if I have something to rest on or brace myself on.

[roverboy]

I found this load for .38-55. Its a 265 gr. 375296 hollow point with gas check. 34 gr. IMR3031 at 1863 fps. This is a powerful load. Loads like this should be awesome.

[fishhawk]

friend shot a 10 pt whitetail at about 20 yds with his 38-55 94 winchester, good lung shot when the buck took off he let it have another cause it was running away with his antlers! buck never knew he was there untill the shot and the buck ran about 75 yds. so if your asking if it will drop one in it's tracks not unless its spine hit in my opinion. steve k

[405]

"Will" a 38-55 do it? NO ONE knows. "Can" a 38-55 do it?- sure. I just love words like "drop", "thump", "dump", etc. in hunter jargon.

[scrapcan]

Also one must define what they are saying is a hail mary shot.

Those shots I mentioned earlier were not hail mary shots. I scouted the area, I knew the ranges to where the animals bedded, and I know how the rifle shoots with the loads used. A lot of preparation went into hunting with the model 94 in 38-55. I put the same effort into hunting with a contender super 14 in 30-30. Teh animals deserve the humane kill also.

If I had not done the preparation I would say one should not go this route, but with preparation it will do as it is asked.

and for the record I have seen a lot of hail mary shots at under a 100 yards from rifles that sit in the cabinet or closet until they are drug out for hunting season and not even shot prior to going afield. slob hunters are out there in every game field. One just has to make up their mind to not be one of them.

[KirkD]

friend shot a 10 pt whitetail at about 20 yds with his 38-55 94 winchester, good lung shot when the buck took off he let it have another cause it was running away with his antlers! buck never knew he was there untill the shot and the buck ran about 75 yds. so if your asking if it will drop one in it's tracks not unless its spine hit in my opinion. steve k
That probably applies to any cartridge, but I would not take this incident as indicative of what all 38-55 shots will do. The one Whitetail buck I shot at 75 yards was running flat out. He hit the ground instantly. Shot was through both lungs.

Some animals go down right now and some do not. I had a large Whitetail doe running toward me in heavy brush. At 15 yards I took my first shot with a 12 Ga shotgun slug. The deer kept running with no indication of being hit. I fired again as it passed me at 8 yards, another slug with no indication it had been hit. As it ran away from me, still showing no signs whatsoever that it had been hit, I sent one more slug in. This time I saw a lot of blood spray out of its side, just behind its front leg. I stood there and watched the deer continue running away and at about 75 yards from where it was when I took the first shot, it keeled over. Upon gutting it, I saw that all three slugs had gone into the vitals, with one shot punching through the top of the heart and another shot punching right through the bottom of the heart. If a 12 Ga slug, with its legendary stopping power at 8 yards, does not even make a running Whitetail doe flinch or betray any sign of being hit, in spite of the fact that it has a full 12 Ga diameter hole through its heart, and it already has another 12 Ga diameter hole through its vitals, then do not expect a bang flop with every shot, regardless what cartridge you may be using.

[Bret4207]

My apologies if I offended anyone. A "Hail Mary" shot IMO is a shot taken by a person unfamiliar with his rifle or handgun (or bow) at ranges he's only sort of guessing at with little expectation of success. I've seen a lot of people who can't keep their scope sighted 30-30 on paper at 50 yards off hand, or anywhere in the scoring rings at 100 with their 338 superdupershoulderbreakingtacticalextrememagnum. OTH I've seen a few guys with old ratty looking 257 Roberts, 280 Remingtons and 30-06's that were good to go at any range they felt they could shoot at with their open sights!!! It's a matter of practice, range estimation, familiarity, and self discipline.

My oldest boy and I have had these "discussions" before. We haven't come to blows yet over his taking several Hail Marys (and loosing my brass) each year, but it's getting close.

[Nrut]

DN,
It is more a function of your ability to hit the deer properly than your scoped CB in 38-55..
If I was going to be taking 200 yard shots at deer with a 38-55 I would use a range finder as I can't judge distance worth a hoot much past 100 yds...
good luck!

[scrapcan]

Bret, I should have not posted anything in this thread to begin with, but we are on the same page.

Having said that thanks for defining what you meant. I was sure of what you were saying, but I like to make sure we are calling the same type hunter the same terms! I can assure you we are. These are the same pople who take their gun to someone to have it bore sighted and then off they go to kill an animal without firing a shot.

I hate to see any of that type of hunting or shooting. But that is the joy of living in a place where we still have a few freedoms.

carry on!

[Lloyd Smale]

Ive shot deer with 300 mags that didnt drop at the shot at 200 yards so i wouldnt bet the farm on it. If your asking will it kill it? No doubt if you put one in the vitals.

[Good Cheer]

Yep, a flat enough shooting load can be a really really big consideration for 375 CB's. They'll kill if you can connect accurately. I ended up using a 45-70 case instead of a 30-30.

[45r]

I think it would work with practice at that range but I'd rather use a 45-70 with 350 or 420 grain boolits.

[Good Cheer]

Yep, you need the energy one way or the other. Mine was to use a 375 bullet (283 grains of wheel weights) with a 45-70 case to get a flat trajectory with plenty of bullet.

[Screwbolts]

Will a scoped Marlin 38-55 drop a deer at 200 yards. Or Plus?
Looking at the Lyman 250 grain mould bullets I have cast up.
Maybe need one that's gas checked too for faster velocity.
TIA,
Duke

Morning all, after reading the first line of Duke's question, I believe most have missed his question. "Will a scoped Marlin 38-55 drop a deer at 200 yards" I believe with the proper launching system and hitting the deer just right it should take it off it's feet or drop it. :bigsmyl2:

I hope someone sees some humor in this besides me.[smilie=s:

Now I believe that a properly placed Cast Boolit projectile from a "scoped Marlin 38-55 " will kill anything hit with it as long as the shot is placed in the vitals and it penetrates the vitals causing them to leak!:cbpour:

Ken

Central NY

[jimmeyjack]

( Quote " You need a 45-70" Quote)You guys must have some BIG armor plated deer:veryconfu. A 38-55 loaded up to near max and using a scope for good shot placement would drop any deer PERIOD! Shoot, if you are competent with irons the same would apply.

[Pioneer2]

The oldtimers praised the 44-40 for game/deer out to 200 yards in the then new Win 73............. I have my Grandpa's 1894 38-55 and it took a lot of deer out to 200 yards with jacketed 255gr loads at 1600fps.Typically running 100 yards with no heart or lungs and piling up,I'll be trying Lyman's 265grGC now that I picked up some .375 GC's from a recent gunshow...Harold

[Hardcast416taylor]

If I remember the story my dad told me about hunting whitetail deer with one of these cartridges back in the `20`s, it went like this. "I jumped a nice buck out of some tag alders and it took off running up this small hill. I finally shot at it as it broke over the hill top. You know that heavy ole slug had such a slow velocity that it followed that deer over the hill top and hit and killed it 20 yards down the other hillside"!Robert:groner:

[roverboy]

If I remember the story my dad told me about hunting whitetail deer with one of these cartridges back in the `20`s, it went like this. "I jumped a nice buck out of some tag alders and it took off running up this small hill. I finally shot at it as it broke over the hill top. You know that heavy ole slug had such a slow velocity that it followed that deer over the hill top and hit and killed it 20 yards down the other hillside"!Robert:groner:

I love stories like that. My uncle told me a story about shooting at a running squirrel 4 times with a .22 auto rifle and missed it everytime. He said when he stopped shooting it fell over dead from a heart attack.

[KirkD]

My grandfather said that the 44-40 was so slow, you could catch the slug with a baseball mitt.

[405]

If I remember the story my dad told me about hunting whitetail deer with one of these cartridges back in the `20`s, it went like this. "I jumped a nice buck out of some tag alders and it took off running up this small hill. I finally shot at it as it broke over the hill top. You know that heavy ole slug had such a slow velocity that it followed that deer over the hill top and hit and killed it 20 yards down the other hillside"!Robert:groner:

Agreed! Too good. Note to self, "I have to remember this one".

[GabbyM]

trajectory will do that if you get lucky enough to make a hit.

Was a fire tactic used to great effect in Cuba with our Gatling gun artillery. Said to be the most effective weapon we had. Japanese used it against us with the 8m machine guns as they set up guns on the back sides of hills to sweep beaches with indirect fire. Not much of a one shot sporting practice but probably the heart of his tale. No question it did happen a few times. All to be told ten fold.

[Four Fingers of Death]

I would say that the big lead boolit would sail through and it would stagger off and bleed out and fall in short order.

Estimating the range however may be another issue. 25-30 yards out either way would probably mean a bit of diiference in trajectory. Picnic plates tell no lies.