Pig Boolit?

[Butler Ford]

Anyone have a suggestion for a good .357 boolit for porkers? Plans are to run it out of a Ruger single action and/or a 686 Smith.

Thanks
BF

[NickSS]

I like the Keith semi wad cullter of around 180 gr or a lee 158 gr RF.

[HeavyMetal]

I've never favored heavy boolits in the 357.

Figured a long time ago that a 150 grain boolit split the difference between to heavy, no velocity, and to light, no retained energy, so the 150 has been my go to boolit in this caliber forever!

I use the RCBS 150 SWC. You'll also find many others speak highly of this mold. Very similar to the Kieth in design, short enough that they fit all 357 revolvers, heavy enough to get the job done, light enough to have respectable velocity when it gets where it's going a very good all around design!

[MakeMineA10mm]

Wild hogs can be FUN and EXCITING. I'd take the pistol that your most comfortable with and think about both accuracy and speed of follow-up shots, as the action can be fast, and depending on where you're hunting, very up-close.

As far as a load, I'd think hard about that Keith bullet, cast hard, and driven around 1200fps. (Don't need velocity as much as penetration.) This consideration of penetration is also why I'd shy away from lighter bullets. I'd say a minimum would be 155-158gr SWCs or RNFPs (with a big meplat), but I'd be a lot happier with the 173gr Keith.

I'd be happiest with a bigger pistol, like a 41, 44, or 45. Those aren't options?

[redneckdan]

I have a copy of the 358627, which is a 215gr keith style bullet. I'd be happy to send a quantity to you if you wish. I also have a copy of the 180gr RDFN made by NEI.

[missionary5155]

Greetings
!st I would opt for a revolver that starts with a 4.
BUT if a 357 is all that is available I would want a 180grainer. I used a 180 in my Dan Wesson. It has longer cylinders than most so the 180 GC could be seated out to the first grease groove. So no matter seat the boolit as long as possible..even if you have to alter brass or use 38 special brass use the whole cylinder. Then put as much 296 in that case as possible. My Dan would take more than 16 grains ... It was very accurate and hit through the piggy...
BUT it will not compare to a .4 some mag with a 240+ grainer. Better is a .45 something revolver. Bigger is always better on a critter that will want to razor chop your hide off your body. You only have to see one angry dying piggy slash and dice to decide a 357 is not enough gun.

[Changeling]

Anyone have a suggestion for a good .357 boolit for porkers? Plans are to run it out of a Ruger single action and/or a 686 Smith.

Thanks
BF


Mr. Ford I've never shot a wild hog yet. However I wanted to know the truth about what it took, in my case I was interested in the 45LC.
On this web site if you go down to the hunting forum there are some people there who hunt pig/hog on average more than anywhere else o this web site and can give you a pretty good idea of what is necessary. Some of the answers here sound very reliable, but there are guys there who hunt them year round.
Good Luck.

[LAH]

Anyone have a suggestion for a good .357 boolit for porkers? Plans are to run it out of a Ruger single action and/or a 686 Smith.

Thanks
BF

Use the Lyman 358429. If you can't find them, I have a few. A Keith @ 1200 FPS is what I would use if I were using a 357. Go for it, life is short.............Creeker

[MtGun44]

Keith 358429 will drive straight thru. A HP may be OK, but I would go more for the cup point
or just plain old SWC. This is an accurate boolit, too. Second choice would be the Lee
158 RF which is an LBT style that is also very accurate in the .357 mag. My 586 +1 loves both
over (IIRC) 16.3 H110.

Never shot a pig with anything but buckshot, but I think the name of the game with a
pistol will be penetration.

Bill

[RMc]

When loading for my 4"S&W 686, I want a smooth balance of controlability and penetration. For my purposes a hard cast, heat treated 185 FNGC with a .28" meplate at 1100 fps fits the bill. The load I developed with the New Beartooth Bullet 185 FNGC works extremely well in delivering fast and accurate double action fire at under 50 yards. Frankly, I find it easier to track and hit a moving target with the smooth roll of a well tuned double action trigger.


Distance to chronograph screens 10 ft.
Temp: 78F Six rounds..
Firearm: S&W 686 4 inch barrel .357 Magnum

"New" 185 BTB FNGC, 13.0 grains of H4227, new Starline brass, and Winchester Small Pistol Magnum primers:

1103 FPS average, 27 fps extreme spread, Low 1091 FPS , High 1118 FPS.

This is a comparatively soft recoiling, low muzzle blast, load that leaves surprisingly little powder residue.

[Butler Ford]

Well, I thank everyone for their input. Seems some believe I may be underguned but it is still better than jumping out of trees and trying to kill them with a knife. :!:

I have a 358429 and a 358156 and a good supply of 2400 and 296 so I guess I'll just bump up the velocity a bit and give it a shot (pun intended). I'm going to make a guess here that they need to be cast pretty hard to penetrate mud and "armor".

[gon2shoot]

Well sir, that would depend on how big a knife yer gonna stick em with. :groner:

I personally prefer heavier boolits , but I seen them go down with one shot from everything from a 22 to a 50cal mini ball.
Seems to me, where ya put the shot has a lot to do with the degree of success.

[geargnasher]

I second the 358156 GC, cast from at least WW metal, perhaps a tad harder (air-cooled Lyman #2), driven hard with a healthy dose of 2400. I don't know what kind of pigs you plan on hunting, but the Russian variety we have here will laugh at you and then eat you if you don't penetrate their hide, which is like trying to shoot through an 18-wheeler tire.

FWIW,

Gear

[chaos]

Mr. Ford I've never shot a wild hog yet. However I wanted to know the truth about what it took, in my case I was interested in the 45LC.
On this web site if you go down to the hunting forum there are some people there who hunt pig/hog on average more than anywhere else o this web site and can give you a pretty good idea of what is necessary. Some of the answers here sound very reliable, but there are guys there who hunt them year round.
Good Luck.


I'm one of those guys who hunts pigs year round. I use a .44 mag. either a RCBS 44-250KT or 44-240-swc loaded moderately. Does the trick EVERY TIME! the ONLY reason I use the .44 is to penetrate the THICK WEST TEXAS scrub they inhabit. It really does not take that big a slug. Comes in handy when shooting through mesquite brush. I use straight WDWW's Not needed on open shots.

I purchased a 358429 off a member here for use out of my .357 on hogs this fall. It was 105 here today, so I haven't been hunting in about a month. Next month I plan on trying this slug on swine. I dont anticipate it will perform and different than its larger cousin on hogs.

With, the 358429 I have to trim my cases a small amount to get it to fit the cylinders of my handguns.

I aint gonna be loading it hot either. Anything that works on whitetail will be fine on swine. They are not as tough as internet lore would lead one to believe.

Hogs dont have any mystical mythical armour. Big B.S. internet legend. Old boars do get a layer of grissle/ scar tissue build up on their shoulders, but it wont stop a .22 LR.

Here is a decent post on the subject if you care to read:

http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=83165

Russian Boars, Feral hogs, Razorbacks are all the same thing. Guides/ outfitters just use different names trying to sell hunts. I have photos of hogs that range from really wild looking to Hampshires.
Any true russian genetics have been bred out of them long ago. Once they get started on a place, they breed like roaches with everything that moves.

Only true Russians are behind high fences.

Take every one you see fellas, they will flat ruin a place for hunting whitetails.

Chaos

[GabbyM]

At the velocity a revolver shoots any alloy strong enough to shoot at 357 mag pressure will punch right through a hog. I personally don't think you are under gunned.

For meat hunting I'd use the 358429, which I have in a NOE mould. You could make an expanding bullet with the gas checked 358156. But that would just blast a bigger hole. IMHO the 358429 cast from WW + 2% tin air cooled or 2/6 charged with your WW296 should punch a half dollar size hole all the way through that hog. Plain WW metal would probably expand to one caliber or a bit over. In a six inch barrel gun it may even mushroom. Whichever it does it's going to put the hurt on a hog. With a SD of .190 the 170 grain 358429 is the same SD as the 429421. The velocity is the same and there just isn't that much difference in the meplat. I own a 6” 44 mag so I'd use it but I'd not feel under gunned with a 357 mag.

If one of your two guns has a 6” barrel as opposed to the 4” length I'd use the longer barrel to hunt with. The bit of velocity may not look like much on paper but it's huge in effect plus the 6” barrels don't blast your ears so bad when hunting. IMHO 4” barrel magnum revolvers are for wearing on a belt while driving a car. Not for shooting. I wouldn't mind owning an old 4” 38 Special service revolver but that would IMO be a bit light for hogs.

Although the only running hog I ever shot was with a 9mm Model 39-2 S&W loaded with 90 grain Hornady HP's (the old kind which do not expand) over a compressed charge of Blue Dot. 175 pound hog hit behind the leg angled forwards. Exit hole quarter sized busting ribs on both sided. DRT with about three seconds of jerking. Range was forty paces. Domestic hog in a lot shot for a Kegger + barbecue. Chosen method of dispatch was to win a wager from some friends who thought there 357 mags were so much better than my pip squeak 9mm. We shot three hogs and the looser had to pay. Back then hog was high at $49 per C weight and we only made about $110 a week wage. There mistake was letting me chose the range. Plus they had no idea of where to shoot a hog and I knew it. Third guy actually tried a head shot at forty yards with a 4” barrel M27. As soon as the hog exited the (you loose circle) I hit him with a 90 grain at 1,400 fps and rolled him. I got called bad names. The shooters six gun was empty by the time his hog got out of the circle.

Many hunters gut shoot a hog then declare they need a 460 mag to down those bullet prof critters.
Mud armor is just something I've read about. Suppose that may be a reason not to use HP bullets.
I've done enough junk yard shooting with a 357 mag to have my serious reservations as to a layer of mud stopping one of those slugs. Perhaps at a low angle of attack shot. ?

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/picture.php?albumid=32&pictureid=939

[MtGun44]

Come to think of it, I guess two warthogs would qualify. Both took one shot with
.44 mag, 250 Keith over 20 gr 2400, about 1300 fps. Boolits zipped thru. First one
was a 75 yd shot, hit it about 2-3" too high, he whirled 360 at the shot, saw the bloody spot
on the far side, so knew it was too high. Ran about 35 yds and died at full speed. Second
was bigger, downward 20 yds shot thru the heart, ran maybe 20 yds and was DRT.

Bill

[geargnasher]

I didn't want to give anyone the impression that wild pigs are bulletproof, only my personal recommendation for a suitable .357 mag boolit which I would use for that purpose. My hog hunting experience has taught me to be prepared to shoot in brush (mainly juniper), to perhaps shoot them in the snout or between the eyes when they put their head down and charge, or have to shoot them quicky without having time to carfully aim. Any of these circumstances the boolits could glance off bone, and I've killed one with a second shot from a .45 ACP where the first shot never penetrated the shoulder meat. While they can be killed with a .22 Long Rifle, I'd rather have something with contollable power that will penetrate tough hide from an oblique angle and break strong bone reliably. .357 Mag is plenty of gun, no doubt about it.

Gear

[Butler Ford]

LOTS more information! Thanks and to keep the record straight, I did not miss those that offered bullets, it is truley appreciated.
Chaos, that was an informative thread and I enjoyed the pictures of the kids in the field. Reminds me of our household before they all grew up, 3 rowdy boys and 1 girl to keep them in check.

I have recently started playing with a load that seems promising; a 156 crimped in the groove nearest the base in a spl case with 296. It is a modest 1150 out of a 6inch barrel with room to experiment some more.

I grew up around domestic hogs and have deep respect for their fickle temperment and ability to hurt someone. I've only read about wild hogs but figure their gonna be about the same. Domestic a bit more fat and feral a bit more gristle in the sholder area, both shock absorbers for bullets. (I liked geargnasher's analogy of shooting truck tires)

This project is basicly for the youngest son, he wants to bow hunt pigs. I have much respect for bows and arrows however when hunting something that bites back, I prefer a "little something in reserve" and I believe that if you're going to carry backup, the backup needs to be something you'd be willing to hunt with.

I now have much more to work with thanks to the vast and varied opinions/experiences found here.

Thank You All

BF

[missionary5155]

Good morning
I have not yet stuck a pig with a broadhead but that would be a challenge... not to hit it but to know that dirt digger was gonna be real upset when that shaft thumped home.
If the bow bender is up a tree then that simplifies the follow up waiting. But down on the dirt I sure want that revolver handy. Better yet would be someone with a double 12 guage loaded with Round Ball standing there ready to be the backup.

[cptinjeff]

Ahhh.............the armor plated HOG. There IS a pretty heafty layer of grisle and it does make a difference in the boolit you choose. I have had the opportunity to do a lot of "group" hog hunts and therefore have seen them killed with just about everything....from knives to the 45-70 (including 9mm, .38 spec, .40S&W, .45ACP, 223, 25-06 to name a few that people say won't do the job). I have .44's and .45's so that is what I use but I wouldn't hesitate to shoot one with a .357 (providing the proper load!!!). A proper load will not be a "self defense type" hollowpoint (the shoulder and skull can stop these). A proper load will have a good meplat (I've seen em run a long way with small holes through both sides). I think any reasonable hardness will do. Expansion is a good thing as long as it doesn't come from a self defense hollow point (in this case) or prevent complete penetration. Remember the grisle is on both sides so a completly expanded boolit MAY not make that all important (to my way of thinking) second hole. The only time I've seen the shoulder be a real problem is with light arrowed bows (poorly placed) and self defense type hollow points. Before I was a caster, I've used the XTP's (awsome on deer) with success but always felt better and had better success when I was using a Lbt lead pill (one of the primary reasons I started casting....me being extreamly cheap another). Most cast boolits of a decent design will work just fine. Keith's, Lbt's, even a good RF if the meplat is big enough.

By the way....I'm not endorsing the lighter calibers but just stating what I have witnessed. I like the calibers that start with a 4 but I also believe in using what you have.;)

[Changeling]

First off my thanks to my friends Chaos and Cptinjeff, you two guys have shot more Hogs than the rest of us will probably ever see and I was really hoping you would make an appearance and help enlighten me and others on what it takes in the bullet /load department. I had heard that **** about the "Cartilage " amour for so long I was starting to doubt what I knew to be true. Yes, it a gristle type layer and on both sides (of course). It is on domestic hogs also if you let them get old enough like in a "Boar" used for breeding. But it doesn't take as much as one has been told to completely penetrate a large hog!

When I first started reading about "Hogs" I thought there must be something mystical that happens to wild hogs because I used to dispatch them on the farm with a .22 when we were butchering them, but those were usually between 240 and 300 lbs, not light!.
Well something does happen to hogs gone wild, they get tougher because now they have to roam for food rather than walking over to a trough where it (Hog Slop)is poured into for there fattening. Thats it, nothing Supernatural.

I'm grateful for the 2 forum experts Chaos and Cptinjef that came and set things straight!! Thanks, Guys.

[Whitworth]

I take about a dozen hogs a year, and while they are not armor plated, they can soak up a lot of lead on occasion as can many animals when pumped up on adrenaline. That said, if you do shoot a boar that has a gristle plate, it can and will test the composition of your bullets. Hogs are built a lot more densely than deer and they are definitely heavier boned. I have seen and experienced jacketed bullet failures (handguns) on small to medium sized hogs. A good flat-nosed hardcast bullet solves the penetration dilemma, not limiting the shots you can take.