Why my contender barrel locked up (with pics)

[Ohio Rusty]

I managed to get the new contender barrel off the older frame tonight. I was actually surprised how easy it was to get the grip off, take out the trigger assembly and see what was going on inside. Fortunately, there are others who have had the issue also, and I read their past posts. It did help to have a small and smaller punch because both of the pins that held in the trigger guard and assembly were two different sizes.

When i got the trigger assembly out and looked inside, I could see the bottom of the locking lug/bolt. I could push on the spring loaded lug with a wide, thin screwdriver. After several pushes on the lug/bolt from different angles, The barrel swung free !! wooHOO !!

In the first pic the old barrel that came with the gun that opens easy is on the left and the new barrel is on the right. You can see on the older barrel on the left, there is a flat shelf on the lug, then there is a 45 degreee angle, then there is a stair step at the the top of the angle. On the newer barrel on the right, you can see the shape of the angle is different and the stair step at the top of the angle is missing. Possibly because of the different shapes, that causes the newer lug to lock up and not release.

In the second pic, there are three barrels pictured. The original barrel is up front, and two newer barrel are numbers two and three. It is clear the lugs are different on the older original barrel and the new barrels. You can definitely see an angle difference. That is what was causing the lock up of the barrel in the frame. Looks like the barrels and frame will need to go home to T/C for a tune up and fix.
Ohio Rusty ><>
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v372/OhioRusty/lugbolt2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v372/OhioRusty/lugbolt1.jpg

[blaser.306]

are they original contenders or the newer easy open models ? my frame is an original and my wife has to get me to open it after every shot ! even with 22lr!

[Ohio Rusty]

The frame is the old original, Serial #7745. The original frame and original barrel (octagon .44 mag with hot shot shredder choke) actually open easily. ( That barrel is the front barrel in the bottom pic, and on the left in the first pic). Those other barrels I just bought in the last couple weeks. They are contender barrels, but newer than my older pistol, and have those different lock lugs. T/C will have to modify the frame and barrels to work together. I actually have another frame coming in (older, 5 digit serial number) and an original 10 inch .357 barrel that was never shot. They will all have to go to T/C. After it all comes back, everything will be working perfectly. Both of the frames are the series two frames with the selector screw under the back of the hammer..Good thing I'm doing this a few months before deer season gets here. Being so new to Contenders, I didn't realize there were so many differences in barrels and frames. I'm learning fast.
Ohio Rusty ><>

[HeavyMetal]

Stop!!

Here's the deal: you have an original Contender frame and the original barrel has the one piece locking block and possibly a decent trigger.

T/C no longer makes, or supplies, the original locking block and, as you've found out, you can't swap early frames and late barrels.

If you send it to T/C they will do an easy open conversion for you, $80.00 is what I got charged about 18 months ago.

No "freebies" fom T/C since Smith & Wesson took over by the way.

Up side is the gun will be easier to open, somewhat, down side is you trigger pull will go away. They will also remove any none stock parts and I do mean any!

I'm not saying don't do this, I'm saying be aware of what you buying!

I also have a Plan B! It just so happens I have 3 or 4 original locking blocks that I had to swap out ( at $25.00 apiece) for the new style after I payed for the easy open conversion.


Sure would have been nice had they told me about that part before I had the conversion done as I might not have done so!

Changing the locking block is 5 minutes work if you'd rather try that before you pay for a conversion PM me and we can discuss the blocks.

Might have a barrel you'd be interested in as well as some iron sights if you need them.

[Ohio Rusty]

Pm sent to Heavy metal ...... Thanks !!
Ohio Rusty ><>

[dale2242]

Ohio Rusty, I would recommend you call TC and talk to a tech there before changing to the easy open system. It may get complicated and expensive. I seriously considered doing it until I talked to their tech. I`m not saying not to do it, just get well informed about it before you do it...dale

[JSH]

From the pics you posted, the locking lugs are one piece lugs. The two piece lugs will fix it 99% of the time. Yes the angle does have somthing to do with it, but not near as much as the one piece. The two piece will give a better lock up and the flex they give across the bottom of the frame where they engage will actually have more contact. FYI the two piece are no weaker than the one piece.
I would just order a few sets of locking lugs and insatll them. I would also advise you to go ahead and get a couple of extras when ordering to have on hand. Swapping is easy, provided you have the right size punch. Don't drift the pin out all the way. Just far enough to let the lugs come free. There is a spring under the lugs, but it isn't under a lot of pressure. Just keep your thumb over the lugs when you pull out the punch.
If you take much off of the "shelf" in the frame you are asking for problems for ever. You can end up with an auto eject frame.

I don't know what is meant by the good trigger going away when going to an easy open frame. I have had about every variation of TC frame in the past 25 years, all of them were pretty easy to get a good to excellent trigger in, G2 and Encore included. Though the newest two are a bit tougher. My three easy open frames are all right at or under a pound or less with no over travel or creap. They have all passed IHMSA saftey inspections in years past with no problems.
I have no idea of what heavy metal is calling locking blocks, maybe the lugs? If they are $25 each now, that is about a 100000% mark up from a year ago. I think I paid around $2 per pair. When ordering, make sure to specify left and right. I didn't do that years ago and ended up with about a dozen lugs all for one side.
jeff

[Tom-ADC]

I bought one of the first Super 14's in 44mag many years ago, I had to send it back to the factory because it would open on every shot. You could see the scrap line from the primer down the brass to 6 o clock.
Have given much thought to getting another one.

[cbrick]

Rusty,

Before sending anything off to T/C I highly recommend an email to Jim Henry (James Henry Gunsmithing). <tccraft1@earthlink.net> As was mentioned, you may not be all that happy with anything you send off to T/C.

Jim is an exceptional T/C smith, for many years (until T/C ownership changes) T/C supplied him with free parts so he could do T/C warranty work and keep a huge number of guns out of T/C's shop. Saved T/C a ton just in shipping charges not to mention the repairs.

Any new to me T/C frame or barrels is handed over to Jim before I even load a cartridge for it or mount the barrel. He matches up the barrel(s) and frame(s) and unlike T/C you'll get back an excellent trigger and any and all after market parts. The only thing I would send back to T/C is when frames need to be replaced and then I would send only the frame. The frame bolt table can be worn and/or the frame can stretch, situations where it does need to go back to T/C for frame replacement.

I have known Jim personally for many years and vouch for him 110% for skill, integrity and honesty. He's also very reasonable with his prices. Jim is the only smith that Bob Baker at Freedom Arms allows to do trigger jobs on their revolvers without voiding the warranty. An email is free, explain to Jim what you have and see what he says. Tell him Rick at LASC steered you his way.

Rick

[Ohio Rusty]

Thanks all for all the great advise !! I appreciate Hevy Metals generosity to let me get some of the older locking bolts from him to try. He is +1 !!

Let me offer this update ..... The 14 inch .357 barrel has a set of split lugs. I just installed the split lug barrel on the gun, and this barrel won't open either !!! It ls locked up tight ........ Every version of bolt T/C made doesn't work, I have four old barrels and only one will work properly .... Holy Moly .... That is frustrating you know .... So we know for sure the ONLY spring loaded lug/bolt that will work on my frame is the old original Like I show in my pic above (the one with the stair step) . The newer old one piece lug doesn't work .... the newer old split lugs don't work. ..... sheesh ....

I'll contact your friend CBrick as now I have a big bunch questions about frames, barrels, etc. .I'm sure Jim Henry will have some of helpful advise for me.

I have a feeling if the bolts that Heavymetal sends don't work, it's going to get expensive ..... I don't know if I want to spend a half a thousand or a thousand more just to get a gun or two working ... My days of being a contender user may be coming to a close. Sigh ..........
Thanks
Ohio Rusty ><>

[dale2242]

Ohio Rusty, The reason I suggested you talk to a TC tech was for that very reason. The frames have to be upgraded to easy open before using the split locking lugs. I called TC and wanted split lugs for better lockup. They told me you could not use split lugs on the older frames, that they would lock up solid without the new easy open feature. Some times reasearch can save us a lot of problems....dale

[Ohio Rusty]

Dale2242 wrote:
They told me you could not use split lugs on the older frames, that they would lock up solid ..........

And that it did Sir ...... Since all of this, i've been considering scrappingt the idea of using older frames with the older barrels. Maybe I need to try a G2 frame .... I also fired off an email to Jim Henry per Cbricks instructions ....

Ohio Rusty ><>
(perplexed in Ohio with contenderitis .....)