fix for leaking Lyman 450 sizer

[keyhole]

My Lyman 450 sizer, which I bought new back in the 70's, is finally leaking lube so bad it is not usable. It is coming out of the seal on the bottom of the casting.
I just put a glop of Perma Gasket between the bottom of the casting and the hardboard piece of wood to which it is bolted. It is drying now so will try it tomorrow.
Frankly I am skeptical that this will work. The bottom of the casting is not exactly flat plus the steel cylinder(?) which fills the hole protrudes below the casting a 1/32" or so. So the surface of the sizer bottom and the piece of wood do not fit together as close as would be desirable. I tried to get enough Perma Gasket applied to fill the void but I am not even sure it will take the pressure.
Has anyone had experience fixing this better than what I am doing? What about sending it back to Lyman for repair?

Thank you for your thoughts

Keyhole

[cheese1566]

When I had mine, I draw filed the bottom to get the high points off- but nothing too extreme. Just enough to bolt to aluminum heater blocks without fear of cracking the casting.

In between the blocks and sizer, I used a thin bead of Permatex #1 (hardeneing?) and let it set.

I did use a heater so not much pressure was required in my set up.

[dragonrider]

I had mine for a long time, recently autioned off here, and when I got it the bottom was not flat at all and as a result of that the plug did not fit right, I always thought it not being flat was an anamoly of the one I had but apparrently not so. Anyway years ago I machined the bottom flat and made a new plug to fit better and while not perfect it was way better. I also would place a gasket of thin cardboard like that used for primer boxes, or thin rubber and usually had no problem after that.

[geargnasher]

If you don't use a heater, draw file it, cut a gasket the size of the mounting flange on the sizer out of the side of a 12-pack soda carton (very tough material), coat in on the sizer (up) side with Pematex anerobic sealant, bolt it down tight against a good, hard, flat base and walk away for 24 hours. You will have to use power tools to remove this later, but it won't leak.

Gear

[dominicfortune00]

The Prefessor had a thread about a fix he did for his leaking Lyman sizer a while back.

[keyhole]

Thanks to everyone who responded.
As predicted, the Perma Gasket "fix" did not work at all. The gap between the base of the 450 and the wood piece to which it is mounted was too great. The Perma Gasket never dried after 1 1/2 days and it leaked unabated. After removing the still wet Perma Gasket and cleaning all surfaces thoroughly, I then tried applying a good helping of epoxy (2500 psi-type) plus a thin cardboard paper cutout. The paper cutout more or less filled in the imperfections of the casting base. After letting it dry overnight, the epoxy was definitely hardened. I was surprised when this setup leaked also. I did not try to file the base flat. I don't have access to a milling machine so hand filing is about the best I can do. I guess that is the next step if I can get the epoxy glue base off. Since I had this so long and figured I got my money's worth, I ordered a 4500 yesterday. If I can fix my old one, it will be a backup.
Again, everyone has helpful input. thank you

Keyhole

[geargnasher]

Use a propane torch and a putty knife to remove the epoxy. Protect your lungs and eyes while doing so. Draw file the bottom with a medium bastard, slowly and carefully. It won't take much.

I haven't seen what the Perfesser's fix was, but he's a dandy with machine tools so I'm sure it is effective, check it out.

Gear

[JIMinPHX]

It surprises me that those things ever don't leak, even when they are new. That gland design is kind of "basic" to say the least. I think that they should have an o-ring or something in them.

[shootinxd]

Try using a little JB Weld,then a lapping compound to seat then in.

[oneokie]

There is an O-ring on the steel plug. Clean the lube from the sizer, use a socket nearly the size of the plug and drive it back in place. Use a center punch to stake the plug in several places. Use soda or beer carton cardboard to cut several circles smaller than the recess in the base of the sizer, and check for height. When you have it thick enough to be level or slightly higher than the base flange, cut a piece the size of the base and bolt everything to a board or piece of metal.

[les265]

I bought a used 450 a few months ago. When I mounted it to my workbench, I put a thin O- ring on the small round recessed area on the bottom of the sizer where the plug is before bolting it down. So far it has been working without any leakage.

[John J]

here...take a look at the parts breakdown and see what parts you should replace

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/bullet-casting/pdf/LyC_BC_LS_4500.pdf

and heres the price list

http://www.lymanproducts.com/store/page151.html

hopes it helps

John J

[yancey]

If you go to the link that John J just posted , There is a complete assembly parts no,2745817
The price is not on the link, but it is $16.00 " If you need the extra parts"

( I just put in an order for one yesterday"

[keyhole]

I'm guessing that the "Seal Plug O-Ring* 2990623" needs to be replaced. Thank you for sending the parts diagram and price list.
I imagine that you need to remove the Seal Plug* 2990546 to get at the seal plug. Anyone had experience doing this?

Thank you to everyone. All your responses have been very helpful.

Keyhole

[JIMinPHX]

I finally got sick & tired of my 4500 leaking lube out from around the center pin in the die, so I made a little improvement. I made a new center pin with a couple of O-ring grooves in it. I also made the new pin a little longer, since I like the boolit to be pushed fully out of the die for easy removal. It seems to work well.

[NWFLYJ]

I have an older sizer also, think it is from the 70's. I was leaking worse andd worse. So I took it to work with me to fixer up. I figured I had every "o" ring known to man but I was wrong. Seems that airplanes and lube sizers have no "o" rings in common. So on the way home I stopped it the ole Home Depot and found them in the plumbing section, in the faucet rack. I think the total cost was 3.00 +/-. Mark

[hunter64]

If you don't use a heater, draw file it, cut a gasket the size of the mounting flange on the sizer out of the side of a 12-pack soda carton (very tough material), coat in on the sizer (up) side with Pematex anerobic sealant, bolt it down tight against a good, hard, flat base and walk away for 24 hours. You will have to use power tools to remove this later, but it won't leak.

Gear

I did the same only I used a drill press and drilled and tapped an aluminum base to the bottom of the sizer. Took some cardboard from a soda carton and used the base and the holes where I mounted the screws as a template. I then silicon-ed and mounted the cardboard to the sizer and the aluminum base to make sure both surfaces were sealed. It has been about 5 years now and not a drop has come out of the bottom.

[keyhole]

After digesting everyone's suggestions, I thought I would try and get to the root of why it is leaking, rather than struggle with ways to contain the leak. I took out the pressure screw, removed the partial stick of lube and gently drove out the seal plug from inside with a large wooden dowel. Voila! It's no wonder the old girl is leaking so bad. The O-ring ("Seal Plug O-Ring* 2990623") shown in the diagram kindly furnished by John J had completely disintegrated. I found 3 pieces but there are more somewhere inside. If I can't find the right replacement one at Home Depot or similar, as suggested by NWFLYJ, I'll order one from Lyman. Thank you to everyone, all your ideas and thoughts helped.

Keyhole

[gee-gaw]

An o-ring from Harbor Freight fixed my leaky 450, will probably work for yours too.
Wayne

[liljohnnie]

I finally got sick & tired of my 4500 leaking lube out from around the center pin in the die, so I made a little improvement. I made a new center pin with a couple of O-ring grooves in it. I also made the new pin a little longer, since I like the boolit to be pushed fully out of the die for easy removal. It seems to work well.
That is a great idea. Just one more reason i need to get a lathe.:cbpour:

[keyhole]

Success! (I hope)

I was on vacation this week so had time to work on the old 450. I wanted to replace the "Seal Plug O-Ring* 2990623" with something I could find locally, as a couple of others on this thread have done.
The first O-ring I tried was the correct inside diameter but was too large outside diameter. This prevented the seal plug from seating in the bottom of the lubrisizer casting. Another O-ring from NAPA auto parts was a smaller outside diameter. This allowed the seal plug with new O-ring to fit in the casting recess. It took a few moderate raps with a hammer (hammer striking wooden dowel placed on the deal plug). It fit snugly, which was encouraging.
This afternoon I sized 300 429421 44"s. Lube was fairly soft. There was no leakage. I am very happy about how this all turned out. Thank you to everyone who offered thoughts and comments.
---------
JIMinPHX- The 4500 I bought a couple of weeks ago to replace what is now the back-in-service 450 has the same issue you mentioned about the post being too short. I like your fix. Do you sell these? I don't have a lathe or the ability to make something like your design. thanks

Keyhole

[Elkins45]

The first day I got my new 4500 I sat the base on a sheet of gasket material and cut out a footprint gasket for it. When I later moved it to a different location on the bench I could see where there was some slight wear from the bottom of the threaded rod turning, but there has never been any leakage at all.

[JIMinPHX]

---------
JIMinPHX- The 4500 I bought a couple of weeks ago to replace what is now the back-in-service 450 has the same issue you mentioned about the post being too short. I like your fix. Do you sell these? I don't have a lathe or the ability to make something like your design. thanks

Keyhole

Sorry for the delay in responding, I just saw this now. I can make some of those up if you need them. It's not that hard. What size(s) do you need?

[ReloaderEd]

I just received "O" rings from Lyman I ordered on their website. The included an in inside seal for the plunger and rings for the newer H&I dies. while I was at it I got a new ratched handle the new one is a lot better than the original.
My Lyman is a 45 lubricator/sizer with new guts for the 4500 someone put in it before I got it.
I have used one for 55 years and hope to have at least 24-30 left. I have had at least 3 of the older units given to me. Factory parts are better than messing around with self made stuff. Be Safe.....
PS has anyone tried the lube heater for the hard lube?

[imashooter2]

PS has anyone tried the lube heater for the hard lube?

Lots of options. Mine is the press mounted to a piece of .135 steel with a yard sale flat iron sitting on it.

[HATCH]

I was given a Lyman 45. It was completely reworked prior to me getting it.
I haven't had any issues with it besides its slow
Basically I have to turn the lube screw almost every time. I can turn it a lot but then when I size the first boolit it pushes out a lot of lube under the boolit.
So I just turn it a little bit each time I put a new boolit in. It works. It isn't super fast. I plan to replace it with a Star Sizer later this year. I don't do a lot of boolits but my time is valuable so I need to do the most efficient method possible.

[keyhole]

To JIMinPHX

Thanks for getting back to me. I'll have to take stock of what size(s) I need and email you in the next few days. Hopefully that will be OK.

Thank you for your willingness to help.

Keyhole

[JIMinPHX]

Whenever you are ready, drop me a PM & we can work out the details.

Regards,
Jim