Noe 429421

[GLL]

Have good a day ! :( :(

[Blammer]

cool!

[jimmeyjack]

I was bummed at the small top band.

[Lloyd Smale]

well as to the driving band being narrower that doesnt mean much to me. To be honest ive never had extreamly good luck with the original bullet and have found through the years that a small change in a bullet can sometimes make a dud design shine. Only thing i didnt like was i felt the pins were to big. I had my neighbor cut the round pins down to a smaller size. We tested alot of the recent hp designs that have came out here and find that the huge hp cavitys really arent needed and will make penetration suffer drasticaly. Its not so much a matter of how wide they are but how deap they go in the bullet. Any hp that gets close to being as deep as the front driving band will about allways blow off its nose rather then mushroom and wont leave enough of the bullet shank to give reliable penetration.

[Mal Paso]

Yea but that Ideal rear band is thinner and the bearing surface is less. On my Lyman 429421s the front drive band diameter was so small it never touched the sizing die, the middle band wouldn't size more than .430 and I had to lap them to get the boolits to drop like NOE did out of the box. I shot my first NOE Boolits today sized .431 and found I picked up 50 fps. I'm a happy camper!
There's some guys that would complain if they had too good a day!

[jimmeyjack]

I'm a happy camper!
There's some guys that would complain if they had too good a day!

I am sure there are people like that:roll:.

[DukeInFlorida]

Crank up the heat a bit more.
Then, also smoke the cavities. You'll love the results!


I am sure there are people like that:roll:. Glad you are happy with it.
However, I am NOT having a good time with the way this thing casts.

[SwedeNelson]

GLL, jimmeyjack others.

The top band got by me on this one.
If any of you don't want you mould
send it back and I will refund your money.

Having a new form tool cut with the right
band. But with the schedule like it is it will be hard to
rerun the whole buy.

jimmeyjack
You haven't stated what your problem is with
the RG but if you want to try and work it out
send me a PM and we will see what we can do.
If not send it back.

If any others are not happy just remember we
have a 100% money back on our moulds and
send it back.

What can I say!
Swede Nelson

[GLL]

Al:

The mould is a good one and the 4-cavity (solid) casts beautifully for me ! I am especially pleased with the 1-cavity HP version and all of the extra pins you provided ! I was just disappointed that the drive band was narrower than I wanted it to be !

Mal Paso simply jumped off on a tangent that did not set well with me ! I deleted all my comments so as not to give the impression I was not happy with your work !

You know that I have about 20 of your moulds and am VERY impressed with the quality ! There are five more in the pipe ! :) :)

Best Regards,

Jerry

[sljacob]

al;

I have cast several hundred boolits with my rg2 bolth hollow pt and fn, the only problem I am having is with the fn pins not falling down low enough leaving a shalow 1/16 deep hole in the nose of the boolit. As long as I inspect the pins as I close the mold they cast fine. Is this common in the rg? As this is my first rg I have no experience with them. any tips you have would be appreciated.
Otherwise I have enjoyed casting with this mold and they seem to shoot well in my rugar varcaro. Looking forward to many more noe molds!


best regards:

Jake

[Blammer]

what I do for that sljacob,is tip the mould upright, sprue on top, THEN close, helps with that a bit. Also I've sorta noticed it's more cosmetic than anything. I think it looks kinda cool! :)

[AnthonyB]

Al:
No intentions of sending mine back, but I would buy a re-run with a larger front driving band. Have I mentioned how much I would like a copy of the RCBS 44-250K at .433 or so.....
Tony

[sljacob]

thanks for the reply Blammer...i guess it must me one of those mold personality things they all seem to have ...no big thing, I did learn to tip the mold back over give it a little shake and it does help.

[Blammer]

yea mine did the same thing too,

[Mal Paso]

GLL
I apologize. I was very interested to see the comparison.

jimmeyjack
I apologize too. I wasn't clear you were having casting problems. I have the 5 cavity solid mold and don't have HP issues.

As a guy who also makes things I was very impressed with the quality of Al's work. I spent over $250 on Lyman molds and handles and each piece needed further work. I'm fairly new to this, 15,000 boolits or so and maybe the forward band should be bigger. It was criticism without actually shooting it that got me hot and part of that was my misunderstanding what you guys were saying.

Al
If you have any deals on used 5 cavity narrow band molds I'd be up for another. I've got 3 hungry 44s that need feeding. I'd also like to be on the list when you do a wider band or the RCBS version If you do it.

I have the early stages of OMS (Old Man Syndrome) and sometimes it slips out. This is a Great Forum. Thanks!

[Lloyd Smale]

Its very good of Al to make an offer like that. Just think back to when we were dealing with lee molds. Me ill keep mine. To many variables that nobody can really understand work together to make the differnce between a good swc and a bad one and id surely give it a good shake before i pass judgement on what works and what doesnt. Case in point his 429215. I looked at that mold when i first got it with that tiny front driving band and about threw it in the trash. come to find out its one of the best shooting 44 swcs ive delt with.

[HDS]

Oh dear what do we have here?

I got in on last years purchase of the 429241 and I haven't even used it yet as I've spent all year scavenging lead and alloys and equipment. It's also my first and only mold. I figured I should go for a quality mold and I was also recommended to get in on the groupbuy by CB shooters. I got the 4-cavity RG mold so I can cast both HPs and flatpoints.

It just now occured to me that, hey I am almost ready to start my first casting session, I ought to see what others thought of the bullet molds, etc.

Can someone explain to me in detail whats this about the small driving band? Is this something that'll affect accuracy? Or whats been the issue? Do enlighten a newbie to casting and bullet design.

If this won't affect accuracy or anything like that and it's mostly an issue of being 100% true to history then I can live with that.

EDIT: Well I looked on the old thread and saw some instructive pictures and while this is not true Keith style SWC* then I can't see it affecting the bullets accuracy in any way. So I'm going with keeping it. Hopefully it'll do fine as I will have to size down to .430" for my 629 to like it.

* = Because all the bands should be the same size.

[Mal Paso]

I have a 5 cavity Solid mold and the boolit is very accurate. The mold quality was very good and I was dropping keepers right away.

I was having accuracy problems shooting them as Specials ( Magnums were fine ) in my late model 629. The cylinder throats were smaller than the barrel groove. I opened up the throats and suddenly the accuracy is outstanding.

I think the larger front band helps accuracy in certain guns. The front band of my H&G 503 (MP MOLD) is just inside the throat of my Anaconda and that works really well.

This was my first custom mold and I notice an immediate increase in speed over my smaller diameter Lyman 429421. I didn't notice until later the bit missing from the front band of the NOE 429421 wound up on the base decreasing case volume and making the Alliant 2400 burn just a little bit better. The NOE front band although smaller actually touched the sizer die which the Lyman did not.

It may not be an exact Keith but it is capable of excellent accuracy and it's different enough to give me something to experiment with between 3 different 44s.

[HDS]

Okay lets hope for the best then, anyone sized theirs down to .430" I think thats my biggest worry. I'll be using a Lee sizer and panlubing.

[Piedmont]

Okay lets hope for the best then, anyone sized theirs down to .430" I think thats my biggest worry. I'll be using a Lee sizer and panlubing.

No worries HDS. This is all a lot of nitpicking. You will be just fine going down to .430", especially if nose-firsting.

I don't own this mould but ran over 1,000 from my friend's and have two different Lyman 429421 moulds. This NOE is much more of a Keith than one of my Lymans.

After casting and lubrisizing over a thousand of these I was falling in love with the look of the Keiths again and it took this thread to make me wonder about the authenticity. I have Keith's book Sixguns and have reread it off and on since 1979 and I never noticed these aren't true Keiths. So it is much ado about nothing.

[Mal Paso]

The NOE 429421 seats about 1/32 of an inch lower in the case than either the Lyman 429421 or the H&G 503. Might feed in guns that wouldn't with the other two.

Just a thought.

[crash87]

Rerun of this mold, on right now, in the active group buys.
crash87

[HDS]

Cast bullets for the first time ever today. Yes not just with this mold, but the absolute first time. I had issues with wrinkles and rounded edges despite temps on the melt and mold being within proper operating ranges. In retrospect I think the sprue plate was too cool and thats what did this. There was a lot of fiddling and testing and experimenting here as it was my first time trying this. It's definitely fun though!

The mold drops bullets at .434" but it seems to size down to .430" well enough:
http://i.imgur.com/72NG9.jpg


A few unsized ones, I noted that the tops on some have got a sort of beginning to a HP going on, thats the flat nose pins on the block seating a bit too high, not sure if thats a big deal or not, one some its the other way around:
http://i.imgur.com/1WQ6S.jpg

Well next up is pan lubing and loading a few test rounds.

[Blammer]

that "beginning HP" is how you closed the mould.

If some are indented and others are reverse you are holding the mould upside down to close some times and right side up other times. :)

Won't really matter either way.

consistency when casting is your freind.

Looks like you need to run the mould a few more times and it'll start filling out better, I'd also run the RG versions a bit hotter. (ie the mould temp a bit hotter, not the melted lead temp)

Preheating the mould and casting at a faster pace will help that.

[HDS]

Right thats true, I sometimes flipped over the mold to see if it would help a stuck bullet drop and then I probably closed it while in that position. Note to self; always close mold in upright position.

I do preheat the mold on a hotplate, I noticed that when it got towards 400F the bullets stuck a lot more, at 350-380F they dropped much easier so I kept it below that. I plan to clean the mold with denatured alcohol and see if that helps, that's what was recommended in "From Ingot to Target". Will also try smoking the mold to see what that does.

The HP pins where real bad with sticking btw, I simply could not get two of them loose and they are still stuck now, I think the only way to get them loose is to dip the pins in the melt next time. I shall have to polish them properly, perhaps bull plate on the tips will help too.

[Blammer]

smoke JUST the HP pins and that helps a bunch.

I've also put some mould prep on JUST the pins and they fell right off. Temp on the pins is your friend also. I've noticed that if my pins are cold or even not up to temp the boolits will stick something fierce! HEAT on the pins if you can.

[HDS]

Casted another 200 bullets last night, lots of sticking still. I didn't bother trying with the HP pins this time since the block itself was the issue, had to sit and rap one bullet for a good long while before it fell out. I'm not sure if I should wait longer than I do (2-4 seconds) before cutting the sprue and opening the mold perhaps.

Tried smoking the cavities towards the end but it that had a slight effect that lasted maybe one or two castings. More casting might be required to break it in, or perhaps my technique is faulty.

I took it apart for a good cleaning and noticed this, is this level of wear normal around the sprue plate?

[Blammer]

looks like you have the sprue plate on a tad bit tight.

Loosen it a bit and add some lubricant and you should be fine.

I think you're mould temp needs to be higher if they are still sticking on the pins.

[HDS]

Sticking the last time was on the block actually. I think I might be in too much of a hurry, waiting maybe 2-3 seconds before I cut the sprue and let them drop. Waiting longer might give the bullet time to shrink a bit and drop easier.

How loose should the sprue plate be otherwise, should it fall out on its own or require force to move? I was thinking after I get it cleaned I should use bullplate on the area to prevent further damage. Someone suggested paraffin too.

[Blammer]

the little pressure washer that is under the hinge pin screw. I usually tighten the sprue plate screw till that washer is about 1/2 compressed. The sprue for me is fairly loose, it will 'almost' open under it's own wt.

[SciFiJim]

Sticking the last time was on the block actually. I think I might be in too much of a hurry, waiting maybe 2-3 seconds before I cut the sprue and let them drop. Waiting longer might give the bullet time to shrink a bit and drop easier.

How loose should the sprue plate be otherwise, should it fall out on its own or require force to move? I was thinking after I get it cleaned I should use bullplate on the area to prevent further damage. Someone suggested paraffin too.

If you haven't used it yet, by all means use it. It is as good as the claims say. Also, check the underside of the sprue plate for burrs that correspond to the scratches.

[HDS]

I can't see any burrs but I definitely got metal on the underside, not sure if it's aluminum from the block or lead. Gonna see if it lets go after dipping it in the melt.

[SciFiJim]

Can you post a close up picture of the underside of your sprue plate and the metal stuck to it?

[HDS]

Best I could manage:
http://i.imgur.com/ZEf2o.jpg

[SciFiJim]

Heat it with your melt to casting temp (when lead from the melt doesn't stick to it any more). Any lead should wipe off with a gloved hand or rag. If it doesn't wipe off, it is aluminum from the mold. Considering the scratching on the mold, there is some aluminum there. There could be a burr in with the metal. Try picking it off with a razor blade held nearly parallel to the sprue plate. You might also try soaking it in a penetrating oil like Kroil. I wouldn't put it back on the mold until you have removed the built up metal.