Heavy Bullets in the 38 Super.

[KCSO]

In looking for a lighter recoiling 1911 for extended shooting session I picked up a 38 Super. The extra weight and the lighter loads makes it a ***** cat to shoot, but I just wasn't too fond of the 124 gr. cast bullets I was using. I got to looking at my moulds and saw a Lee 158 RNFP and wondered how it would do. The answer is very well! I have been loading 158 gr. RNFP bullets with varying charges of Bulls Eye and have been getting great accuracy. My best groups so far have been in the 8-900 fps range and are running under 2" in my gun. Feeding with this bullet has been 100% and leading has been non existant using Carnuba Red lube. Recoil is still moderate enough that I can shoot and enjoy 250-300 rounds in a days shooting. I have found that a LOT of 38 Super load data is either BS or some folks think flat primers are the norm, I saw one recommended load that listed 4.3 of B/E under a 160 bullet. That load under a 158 in my gun was WAY to hot and 3.9 is about my max load. I hope to start on loading unique under this bullet soon. I am working on a collet to hold the bullets in my lath so I can hollow point the bullets to varying degrees, then when I get what works best I will convert one hole of the two cavity mould to a HP.

[45 2.1]

Take a look at this one, the 358-136 PB.
http://www.brp.castpics.net/P1.html
I designed it to be 129 gr. hollow pointed for use in the 9mm Largo. Hollowpointed it is a very wicked boolit. Several oppossums have been turned into parts with it so far. Works fine in the 38 Super, 38 Auto, 9mm Largo, 9mm Luger besides the normal 38 Special/357 Mag applications.

[Buckshot]

http://www.fototime.com/94E23D0AC147FC1/standard.jpg

..............This feeds and shoots very well in my Witness. It's the RCBS 38-162, but I didn't spend much time working with light or moderate loads, as the one shown does about 1260 fps.

............Buckshot

[shooterchris]

I'm with you KCSO. I shoot mine as light with a bullet I cast out of a lyman mould, and it sounds real similar to your bullet. I have shot mine as light as 2.5 gr of bullseye. I have a light mainspring in my super and for punching paper it's a joy to shoot. Paper targets and steel plates are the reason I bought it.

[MtGun44]

If you want hot loads, I have shot about 70,000 rounds of 7.1 W571/HS7 under 158 gr
LSWCs in any case except Winchester of any kind - ++P does not help.

This load was pressure verified as max but safe by Hodgdon and published at one time.

Makes 185,000 power factor safely and accurately. Case life in an unsupported chamber
is unlimited - but NO Win brass - any other kind is fine.

Bill

[KCSO]

I really like the looks of that 136 r slug, I might have to get one of those. A 158 at 850 fps is not exactly light but I may boot it up a little with Unique. B/E is pretty sensitive as to charge and a little goes a long way. If I can get the accuracy i want with a velocity at or just over 900 fps I will figure I have just what I need. I am not about to shoot any more expensive jacketed slugs if I don't have to.

As a side note the fully supported barrel in the 38 super makes a world of difference. I had an old super from Colt years ago and it wouldn't stay on a car door at 30 yards. Ths one is holding excellent groups to 50 yards.

[MtGun44]

From what I have read, the issue with the old Colt barrels was not having a step
at the front of the chamber for the case to headspace on. There was a tiny rim step
machined into the hood, which was tiny radially and, of course, only existed for
about 20% of the circumference of the case. The 'semi-rimmed' design was theoretically
going to headspace on this tiny vestigal rim on a 20% portion of the chamber. . . . .

This lead to headspacing on the extractor or boolit in the throat, and this very inconsistent
headspace was apparently the root cause of the old guns' inaccuracy.

Mine is unsupported, but is a Wilson LE Comp gun with a chamber cut with a normal step
for headspacing like a .45 ACP. Very accurate. Since I had to make major caliber
for IPSC, I never worked up any "normal" loads, everything ever fired was absolutely
full throttle, but the gun is still in great shape after about 70,000 rounds. Of course,
zero bore wear is apparent -- 99.999% boolits.

That gun has a .357 groove diam and needs .357 or .358 boolits. With the 9mm 124
Hornady JHPs it will do 1400 fps, just a touch behind a full house 125gr .357 Mag load.
It would be a decent self defense gun, but has only been used as an IPSC shooter over
the years, pretty much retired now.

Bill

[45 2.1]

From what I have read, the issue with the old Colt barrels was not having a step
at the front of the chamber for the case to headspace on. There was a tiny rim step
machined into the hood, which was tiny radially and, of course, only existed for
about 20% of the circumference of the case. The 'semi-rimmed' design was theoretically
going to headspace on this tiny vestigal rim on a 20% portion of the chamber. . . . . Bill

The early 38 Autos and the later post '29 Supers all had this problem. The solution was the 358480 boolit loaded to jam in the throat at the proper depth. Very accurate loads were had doing that. One caution is to stay away from high end Bullseye loads as they top over from fine to overpressure very fast.

[casterofboolits]

I started playing with the 38 Super in the early 80's for IPSC. This was before the "Power Factor" was introduced. We built a ballistic pendulem and the super kicked the 45's butt with a Lee 140-SWC.

The "Power Factor" was introduced and had to go back to square one. I started useing a Magma 160-RNBB sized 357 with Blue Dot and this made major in a standard Colt barrel without buldging the case or any pressure signs.

Next step was a supported barrel with a Saeco 158-SWCBB sized 357 designed by Wilson for the Super. This made major, fed fine, and made nice round holes. I used this boolit until I had to quit due to health problems. Saeco also has a 145-RNBB and a 145-SWCBB that are good boolits for the Super. I have Saeco eight cavity molds in all three.

Blue Dot was my magic wand for the Super. Blue Dot also works well in the 380 and 9mm.

[Groo]

Groo here
My old smith used a 38 super for pins..
The load was a 158 gr sjhp rem bullet with AA7 powder- starting load in manual...
A good starting point..

[bobthenailer]

i have 2- 38 supers on the 1911 platform. one with a nowlen barrel and the other with a kart barrel and 3- 9mms in all guns the saeco #929 a 145gr/swc/bb is the hands down most accurate bullet ! i also have 3 other moulds ! a saeco#377 124 gr tcbb / #384 122gr rnbb and a rcbs 124 rngc. in the 9mms i have to use the thinner remington brass as i size bullets to 0.357 dia for all guns including the supers