Cleaning guns with paper towels

[joeb33050]

I've been reading about cleaning guns with paper towels-Bounty is recommended- over on the "Arbiet Macht Frei" site. Yesterday at the range I cleaned 2 rifles with paper towels, ripped off a strip and wound it around an undersized brush as I do withh cotton patches. Dipped it in solvent and pushed it through.
But.
I was told by several/many machinists that paper is hard to cut, very abrasive.
In the '60's at Carter's Ink we cut ~1 1/2" of carbon paper with a normal-looking shear, all day long. That's how we cut carbon paper to the 8 1/2 X 11 size. The blade was changed every Friday afternoon, sent for resharpening. After zillions of pieces of paper were cut.
I'm not sure that paper has much kmore abrasive stuff in it than cotton.
Unless somebody can tell me why not to, I'm going to Bounty for a lot of my cleaning.
Comments?
joe b.

[Trailblazer]

Can't be any worse than paper patched bullets.

[Bass Ackward]

Joe,

Some paper does, some doesn't. I ruined a barrel by paper patching with the wrong paper. It was a worse abrasive and did far more damage than fire lapping I can tell ya. Pressure was the culprit.

But as with anything else you read, you have to apply some common sence and decide what is acceptable to you. Is a paper towel abrasive? Probably. So is antimony. So are bore brushes. If not for the brush, then for the crud in it that guys will never wash out. Are we going to filter antimony out of cast? The key is pressure. Some guys can shoot lino and not have a problem. But benchresters use the small cases to up the pressure and lino shortens barrel life considerably.

I never use paper towels to patch, always cotton. I spray all surfaces with Pledge or Favor and wipe it off with a paper towels of all brands. I have blueing that is worn from holster wear. I have scratches from falls and dings. But I defy anyone to look at one of my guns and say that guys blueing or stock finish has been ruined from paper towels.

So if it don't hurt the outside ............... Just remember this is an ongoing time trial test that has 30 years behind it. I might be wrong and break through my bore after 110 or 120 years. I will be glad to report back if you promise to stick around.

[KCSO]

I know that when yo finish a blue job and really want to shine it up you wipe down the gun with oil and a rough paper towell. I've never tried it on a barrell as I use old flannel shirt material.

[abunaitoo]

Try the blue paper towels that service stations used to use.
Remember when they used to pump gas, check your fluids,check your tires and wipe your windows???? It's those blue paper towels.
You can sometimes find them at Walmart or Kmart.
They work great. There strong, and don't leave lint behind.

[tomf52]

I second Abunaitoo's choice of blue paper towels. Tough, no lint, and cheap. Buy 'em on a roll at Walmart. You have patches forever that do, in my opinion, a better job than the cloth patches.

[joeb33050]

Can't be any worse than paper patched bullets.

I wonder how many shots modern day patched-bullet shooters shoot out of one barrel in a year. I suspect not many. Maybe 500 to 1000 is typical. Ned Roberts, in "The Muzzle Loading Cap Lock Rifle", writes about bore wear with both paper and cloth patches, and states that a grooved lubricated bullet allows the gun to be shot for 30,000 to 50,000 shots. He doesn't like patches in target rifles. See the end of Chapter VI, "The Target Rifle And Target Shooting".
joe b.

[powderburnerr]

Joe ,
in the last 2 years I have put most of 100 # of powder through my rifles using paper patch bullets the majority of them through a 45 2&7/8 . one is a 30 inch bull barrel and the other is a 26 inch hunter . I use a 90 gn load with 500s and a 100 to 105 gn load with 550s they are more consistant than any grease groove bullet i have shot to date. in my opinion.
i do not have fliers out of the group with the patched bullets I have with grooved bullets. ........ Dean

[blysmelter]

Old thread this, but anyway. Modern industri is using marbel slurry instead of chemichals in order to produce white paper. IE-the white paper contains marbel. For this reason-dont use kitchenpaper or paper towels for cleaning you glasses or optics, it will scratch.

[Jim]

Hobby level woodworkers use craft paper to put the final shine on a piece. They either put a piece of it on an orbital sander if the work is flat or hold it on a piece spinning in the lathe. I've also been told many times that cutting craft paper and/or cardboard will dull a utility blade quickly.

[Bret4207]

Isn't there silica in wood pulp?

[no34570]

Joe,

Some paper does, some doesn't. I ruined a barrel by paper patching with the wrong paper. It was a worse abrasive and did far more damage than fire lapping I can tell ya. Pressure was the culprit.

Bass Ackward
That's interesting about paper patching ruined your barrel and a shame:(
Could you please tell me what sort of paper it was?I hope not the 9# Onion skin I got from Buffalo Arms:( which cost me an arm and a leg to get here to Australia(oh and a few other little goodies)[smilie=1:
Thanks
no34570
:castmine:

[arkypete]

Dis is sumthing I know a little bit about.
White kitchen towels lint like crazy, the brown roll towel like you find in public restrooms, don't!
Take a brown papwer bag lay it on table top and rub a washer across it, the effect will show up early if the washer is blued. Most wood based paper makes a really good abrasive.
Most paper is made from wood, really good paper is made from cotton. A side note, clean burning smokeless powder uses cotton linters rather then wood linters, less ash.
Jim

[Bass Ackward]

Bass Ackward
That's interesting about paper patching ruined your barrel and a shame:(
Could you please tell me what sort of paper it was?I hope not the 9# Onion skin I got from Buffalo Arms:( which cost me an arm and a leg to get here to Australia(oh and a few other little goodies)[smilie=1:
Thanks
no34570
:castmine:


Ya know, that was back in the late 60s early 70s. Twernt any special paper so it was what ever I had on hand and may have been mostly news print. News print performed many functions in rural America back in those days. But I was a total novice then and the prevailing attitude was, what went in the back came out the front.

[no34570]

Bass Ackward
Well that has put my mind at ease a bit.
I know when I first started Paper-patching I used every paper I could find andthe best was a paper that I cannot get hold of here in Australia anymore was a 50% cotton content,it was real good.
Cheers
no34570

[VTDW]

Back in the day I found the Sears & Roebuck catalogue to be mildly abrasive and not very absorbent.:mrgreen:

Dave

[pdawg_shooter]

I have been paper patching since the early eightys and havent ruined a barrel yet. I use green bar computer paper with great success. As for pressure one of my loads launches a 150gr PP over 3300 from a 300RUM. Shoots into 3/4 inch at 100.

[no34570]

I have been paper patching since the early eightys and havent ruined a barrel yet. I use green bar computer paper with great success. As for pressure one of my loads launches a 150gr PP over 3300 from a 300RUM. Shoots into 3/4 inch at 100.

pdawg
That is bloody good mate:mrgreen:
The best accurate load I got to date with my 45/70 is a 330gr fired at 1990fps with a grouping of 1.4 inches at 100 meters,It lifts pigs off the ground when you shoot them,really bowls them over:-D
Cheers
no34570

[no34570]

Back in the day I found the Sears & Roebuck catalogue to be mildly abrasive and not very absorbent.:mrgreen:

Dave

I wonder how you'd go using the real soft dunny paper(Toilet)?????
It's pretty soft and absorbent[smilie=1:
no34570
:castmine:

[VTDW]

I wonder how you'd go using the real soft dunny paper(Toilet)?????
It's pretty soft and absorbent[smilie=1:
no34570
:castmine:

Real hunters use camo TP.:mrgreen: Those Sears & Roebuck catalogues just smeared it around so it would dry faster.:kidding:

Dave

[exblaster]

If abrasives are so harmful for my firearms will I have to stop using primers? Primers contain glass and glass is very abrasive. Should I change to a flint lock and stay away from primers? What about dust on the bullet? Is there no hope?
I think some ware is an unavoidable part of using firearms,so all we can do is to try not to aggravate the problem of bore ware. I use paper towels to remove stubborn
fowling and have not had a problem. I also use mercury to clean the bore of firearms but let's not go there.
The point of this rambling is to do all things in moderation and we will do well.

Exblaster

[felix]

Silica? Maybe. A good test is to burn the paper. If the ashes crackle and pop, then prolly the solid remaining contains something like a silica, a component of some such that does not burn, but melts instead. If you can easily blow away the ashes, then you can say the paper is kosher for any gun purpose. Kitchen towels anymore have never scratched my plastic glasses, especially when wet with water. BA is correct in saying that pressure with heat is the problem. Besides, folks have been shooting for years in dusty conditions, and have been using things like Simichrome, JB paste, Flitz, etc. to rub down the barrel internals, as well as high antimony boolits (with low tin). My BR gun has had its throat extended by a considerable amount over 15K rounds, using very high pressure rounds with high antimony boolits. Yeah, primers are loaded with abrasive reactors. ... felix

[Ricochet]

With the camo TP you can't see if there's anything on it, so one swipe's all you need.

What rifling twist is in that .300 RUM?

[NVcurmudgeon]

The most recent count shows 14 firearms used mostly or entirely for shooting cast boolits. In a good year I might fire 4,000 cast boolits, an average of 285.7 cast boolits per barrel each year. That doesn't seem to be enough bore wear to worry about. But I'll stick to cotton because I know me. As the poster child for Murphy's Law, I would worry more about leaving a paper towel patch, or piece of one, in a barrel.

I have worn out only two barrels, both with jacketed bullets and cotton patches.

[floodgate]

exblaster:

"I also use mercury to clean the bore of firearms but let's not go there."

By coincidence, I just got a 1953 brochure from Lakeville Arms, makers of the Harvey "Prot-X-Bore" zinc-washer-base and "Jugular" half-jacket pistol bullets. It contained the following: "As a special service to our customers, we are stocking mercury (difficult to obtain in some localities) in one-pound containers, sufficcient to clean dozens of barrels....the mercury can be used over and over until amalgamation of the lead and mercury makes the mercury approach a semi-solid when it ceases to be of further use."

Lower down: "ONE SHOT CLEANER.... The one shot cleaner consists of a non-polar capsule containing a special mercuric amalgam....The capsule is loaded behind any bullet in any caliber rifle or revolver with light loads of pistol powder. When the gun is fired, the special alloy of mercury is vaporized and deposits itself on the entire length of the barrel, saturating all leaded surfaces. The gun is laid aside for approximately one hour and then swabbed out with any ordinary patch, leaving the barrel slick, clean and free from any lead. The non-polar capsule eliminates any possibility of the mercury compound attacking the brass case or the base of the bullet."

GEEZ, THEM WUZ THE DAYS!!!

floodgate

[9.3X62AL]

exblaster:

By coincidence, I just got a 1953 brochure from Lakeville Arms, makers of the Harvey "Prot-X-Bore" zinc-washer-base and "Jugular" half-jacket pistol bullets.
the base of the bullet.

floodgate

Seems like it's about time it arrived. Talk about unresponsive customer service! :-)

[Whitespider]

Back in the day ...............................

Dave

:redneck: :mrgreen:

[The Dust Collector]

I have been paper patching for my 45-70 & 375 H&H for more years than I care to remember. When I first started, the "old timey" (onion skin) typing paper was plentiful in both 100% & 25% cotton content. It was cheap as well and I purchased several reams at the time. As years passed and my shooting increased my supply dwindled. Before I ran out, I started looking around for an alternative paper since that onion skin was no longer locally available.
My research lead me to trying various manufacturer's forms of tracing paper. Some were good , some not so good, and some that are down right bad. The only tracing paper that I have found to be consistant from tablet to tablet and has very good qualities for patching (I patch wet by the way) is made by Mead and it is their ACADEMIE Tracing Paper #54200. This paper is very common, and the last couple of tablets I purchased was from Wal-Mart. It's priced at about $2.50 for a 40 sheet tablet. I find that this paper is more than acceptable substitute for the onion skin. It has almost the same toughness that the 25% has when wet. I think anyone trying this Mead tracing paper would like it. A commercial source for newly manufactured onion skinyou can go to a web sight by the name of The Papermill Store.
http://www.thepapermillstore.com/product.php?productid=9304
I've tried this paper as well, and I find no difference from my "Old Timey" paper. "Old Timey" is the definition told to me and used by an office supply store that has been in buisness in my town as long as I can remember.
The brown papers (craft types and paper bags and such) mentioned earlier are cheaply manufactured. Less effort is put into these than let's say copier paper. These are abrasive as well. The silicates and natural contaminates have been removed verses the brown papers, BUT the whiter the paper in this case, copier, the more titanium dioxide and certain types of clay has been added as a whitener and stiffener. To be transparent as in onion skin or tracing paper is, the cleaner the paper and the purer the cellulose making up this paper.
I hope that this may help someone, as I spent much time and cash experimenting with various papers.
You Servant DUST

[Ricochet]

Has anyone considered coffee filter paper?

[Char-Gar]

A few years back, I visited a place in San Antono Texas that remanufactured ammo for police departments and others. The owner gave me a trip through his small plant. When the brass cases came back in, the first step was to clean and polish them. He did that in bulk by placing the cases in a cement mixer with shreded paper towels. The fired cases came out looking like new.

Sooo.. Paper towels are abrasive, to some degree. I also use paper towels and hot water to clean my cast iron after cooking. With well seasoned cast iron that is all that is needed. A cotton rag and hot water does not clean cast iron as well as the Bounty paper towels.

You can also polish sliver with newsprint or a paper towel. It doesn do as good as a true polish, but it works well enough for most purposes.

The above is not science of "paperology" but I will stick to cotton patches to push down the bore of my rifles.

[Char-Gar]

A few years back, I visited a place in San Antono Texas that remanufactured ammo for police departments and others. The owner gave me a trip through his small plant. When the brass cases came back in, the first step was to clean and polish them. He did that in bulk by placing the cases in a cement mixer with shreded paper towels. The fired cases came out looking like new.

Sooo.. Paper towels are abrasive, to some degree. I also use paper towels and hot water to clean my cast iron after cooking. With well seasoned cast iron that is all that is needed. A cotton rag and hot water does not clean cast iron as well as the Bounty paper towels.

You can also polish sliver with newsprint or a paper towel. It doesn do as good as a true polish, but it works well enough for most purposes.

The above is not science of "paperology" but I will stick to cotton patches to push down the bore of my rifles.

[Single Shot]

Real hunters use camo TP.:mrgreen: Those Sears & Roebuck catalogues just smeared it around so it would dry faster.:kidding:

Dave


The best camo TP is the ones found on the three leaf plants with the little white berries.:twisted:

[Ricochet]

The best camo TP is the ones found on the three leaf plants with the little white berries.:twisted:
Those plants sure are camouflaged well, from the number of folks who turn up broken out and don't know they've come in contact with the stuff.

Early season deer bowhunters might just want to put those leaves all over themselves, to be really well camouflaged.

[exblaster]

Early season deer bowhunters might just want to put those leaves all over themselves, to be really well camouflaged




Deer eat those plants with the three leaves. You might get a nasty deer bite if you use them .

Exblaster

[Char-Gar]

Speaking of cleaning barrels with mercury.. "Back in he Day" we would get some empty capsules from the drug store and fill them with mercury. These would then be loaded in with the powder (a small charge), a bullet seated and the round fired. We would them let it sit a while and the lead could be removed with a patch.

Tody the EPA would throw a fit at the idea.

[BOOM BOOM]

hi,
I believe that primers, J boolits, & cast boolits not to mention ram rods are all more abrasive than any paper towel. They work so I often use them.

[Ed Barrett]

A few years back, I visited a place in San Antono Texas that remanufactured ammo for police departments and others. The owner gave me a trip through his small plant. When the brass cases came back in, the first step was to clean and polish them. He did that in bulk by placing the cases in a cement mixer with shreded paper towels. The fired cases came out looking like new.
.

I think the inside of the cement mixer was a little abrasive too. Maybe the paper was just to hold the dirt that was knocked of by the steel of the mixer. Just a thought.