IMR 4895 Vs H4895

[mtgrs737]

I am sure that this has been done many times but I can't find a thread using the search function. I have a 30-06 Garand and other 308 milsurp rifles to load for and was thinking about laying in a supply of either powder for that purpose. Is there any real world differences in the two powders? Thanks in advance for your replies.

[GabbyM]

H gives higher velocity in your 30's.
For cast boolits at times we like volume to fill a case before velocity gets to high. Thus faster in some cases may not be better.

I've only used Hodgdon myself.

[sqlbullet]

Load data is very similar, but not the same. As GabbyM mentioned, Hodgdon is slightly faster. I don't have my Hornady manual here at work, but IIRC the Garand data for the two is nearly identical. Maybe .5 grain difference at max...

[mtgrs737]

Is there any advantage to one or the other in the30- 06 Garand or the 308 for mil. surp?

[wiljen]

You might wanna search a bit, I seem to remember this one coming up before.

[Shiloh]

Is there any advantage to one or the other in the30- 06 Garand or the 308 for mil. surp?

From what I have heard from the high power guys, both brands perform very well. Other than slightly faster with some lots of Hodgdon's.

SHiloh

[GabbyM]

Is there any advantage to one or the other in the30- 06 Garand or the 308 for mil. surp?

I think there is something to the Extreme (brand name) coating Hodgdon uses for temperature insensitivity. It seams to work for me but this could be a placebo effect. Supposedly it's been tested to work. No testimonial here but I've bought into the advertising.

[atr]

4895 is one of my favorite powders and I have used both the Hodgen and IMR brands...
I dont push my loads to the limit so I use the same powder charge for either brand....
I have not found that the point of impact at 100 yards is significantly different, using the same charge weight, between the Hodgen and IMR brands

[c3d4b2]

I think there is something to the Extreme (brand name) coating Hodgdon uses for temperature insensitivity. It seams to work for me but this could be a placebo effect. Supposedly it's been tested to work. No testimonial here but I've bought into the advertising.

This is my understanding also.

[mtgrs737]

I have read that also, I was wondering if there is anything to it or just advertizing hype.

I assume both meter about the same?

[GabbyM]

Short of a whole bunch of side by side testing you end up taking someones word for it.
I know WW760 and H335 I use is more sensitive than the stick powder H-Extream. But that doesn't prove much.

With Hodgdon now operating IMR and all the 4895 being new supply after a year of not being on the shelf. One would wonder if it's not all from the same pile. H is supposed to have extra graphite for flow. It's also more black stuff comming out. But maybe that's a good thing? Not worth loosing any sleep over.

[leadman]

The Extreme feature of H4895 does seem to work as my loads seem to give the same pressure indicators hot or cold. And I have shot it from about 20' to 115'.

The current size of the stick that is H4895 looks to be shorter than IMR4895, especially the old surplus stuff.

[Tedly]

FWIW I've not compared the two against each other side by side in the same cartridge/load data. What I can say is that I've used H4895 in 4 different milsurp cartridges and very quickly stumbled onto a load with superior accuracy and very little searching or tweeking of the charge weight. For a soft point jacketed load in the 150 gr. weight it is my go to powder for 7.5x55 Swiss , 8x57 Mauser , 7.62 x 54 R Russian and 205gr. 8x56R Steyr/ Hungarian Mannlicher. All guns wear iissue irons so you know the difference in group sizes is emphatic.Some time back I used IMR 4895 in a Ruger No.3 30/40 Krag and will prolly re run those loads nowa days with H 4895 when I get a chance. Arriving at an accurate load so quickly is not just luck IMHO , I believe it has alot to do with the consistency of the propellent. Just my .02

[Lloyd Smale]

same here. Unless your pushing right to the ragged edge the burning rate is pretty much the same. I think its more a matter of lot numbers then the differnces in the two brands.
4895 is one of my favorite powders and I have used both the Hodgen and IMR brands...
I dont push my loads to the limit so I use the same powder charge for either brand....
I have not found that the point of impact at 100 yards is significantly different, using the same charge weight, between the Hodgen and IMR brands

[skeet1]

I suspect that since Hodgdon is the supplier of IMR and Winchester powders that eventually a lot of the line will go by the wayside because they are in essence the same powder. Other powders like 296 and H110 / H38 and W231 / IMR 4831 and H4831 and so on. It only makes good fiscal sense.

Skeet1

[Kraschenbirn]

FWIW, just before the 2008 "buy anything related to guns" panic, I switched to H4895 simply because Graf's happened to be out-of-stock on IMR4805 at the time I placed my order. I'd read several places that the Hodgdon was a tad faster than the IMR so figured I should run up some test rounds of both .30-06 and .308 before loading any quantity of either. In my Garand, I found that backing off by one grain (47.5 gr down to 46.5 gr) gave me the same velocity with a slightly lower SD but in the .308, 41.6 gr of either powder behind a 168gr Sierra MK yielded virtually identical readings (and accuracy).

Bill

[mtgrs737]

Thanks for all the replies gentlemen, I ordered a couple of 8lb. kegs of H4895 from Powder Valley. They had both but it appears that the Hodgon powder has some small avantages in kernal size and temp. insensitivity. Thanks again!

[leadman]

Looking at the data on Hodgdon's website IMR4895 will usually produce more velocity in a medium caliber cartridge. I do like the way H4895 is stable at different temps and measures better in my Redding measure.

[riverwalker76]

I use H4895 on a regular basis just because it's easier for me to get than it's IMR counterpart.

However ... when I'm fixing up loads for my '06 Garand in jacketed bullets I pick up IMR so that I can duplicate the military load data. My favorite load for my International Harvester is Lake City LR brass, 160 gr. Hornady HPBT Match, and 49 gr. of IMR 4895. I can shoot them through the same hole at 50 yds. and 1" groups at 100 yds.

[mtgrs737]

Wow riverwalker I can only hope that my garand will do anywere that good, with my eyes I doubt that I can even see that group let alone shoot it! I have a few pounds of the IMR stuff and I will do a comparison where it counts, at the range. Thanks again for the replies!

mtgrs