RIP, 1903a3 stock (opinions wanted)

[ilcop22]

Howdy,

This afternoon, and unfortunate event occured. While firing some M2 ball, my straight stock split from the underside behind the trigger up through the top portion behind the receiver. Given its condition, it's no longer safe to use.

I purchased this rifle from a friend's late grandfather, an old time gun collector. As far as I could tell, he only stored his 1903s (among other military rifles) in a wood cabinet in his basement workshop. I suspect the years of humidity and moisture played a roll in the death of the stock.

I'm now faced with a dillema as to which stock to purchase since the issued stock, a piece of history, is now out of the question. Are there any you may recommend? Does Boyd's make a decent 1903 stock? I think I will change from straight to a "C" stock. Please post your opinions here.

Thanks!

[TNsailorman]

Don't be in too much of a hurry to write that old stock off. I have repaired stocks myself that had splits in them in the past. Unless it has been reduced to splinters, it still has life. It is amazing what you can do with a little glass bedding compound . Once the stock has been properly repaired, it may split somewhere else, but once that glass hardens, its will never split in the same place again. There are people on this site that can do a great job for you and at a far better price than a new stock. Try doing a search of the old topics of discussion and I am sure you can find one. My advice and something to consider. James

[docone31]

If it has not seperated, then you can drill in and dowel it with T-86 Epoxy. Fairly straightforward.
If it has seperated, then you can still dowel it.
Boyds makes a great stock though. I have one and it is good for me. Good wood.
I had to inlet all of it. Worked out all right.

[NickSS]

I had the same thing happen on a 98 mauser. I fixed it like the old time armorers did. The first thing is to spread the crack as much as possible. mix up some epoxy and force as much as you can into the crack. Clamp the stock with a c clamp. Drill a slightly undersized hole and drive in a brass 1/8 inch rod cut to length. I put some epoxy and the rod before I drove it in. This repair was done 10 yars ago and I have fired hundreds of rounds through it since then. By the way if your rifle just sat for a long time the wood is probably dry. After repair give it a good coat of boiled linseed oil and rib it in and let dry. The army had its soldiers to linseed oil the stock every year.

[Curlymaple42]

Yeh, epoxy that sucker! Be a little careful about drilling and putting rods and dowels in though. I take that on a case by case basis. Sometimes you weaken the joint by doing that. Regardless, glue it with epoxy first, then reinforce it if it needs it.

[docone31]

I have had good luck with a 1/2" or larger dowel for a cracked wrist.
I started it under the wrist cap, and ended it in the inletted action. I then relieved the material to fit the reciever.
If the dowel, and hole are just right, the area is repaired and the fix is invisible.
Lots of alternatives out there. The main thing, if you are going to Epoxy, DO NOT get the short time Epoxy. 24hr is minimum. Maximum strength.
No 5 min stuff, or crazy glue, although it does have its applications.

[ilcop22]

I work as a gunsmith, and I do old wooden stock repair. Trust me, she's toast.

Any suggestions for replacements?

[RU shooter]

The C stocks are a bit more money but they sure do have a better feel when shooting I replaced my scant stock with a older C take off this spring,I forget the guys name but he is over at gunboards.com he has a few in various price ranges and conditions. there is also Boyds and the ones sold by Dupage trading although I have heard of fitting/inletting issues from both.The CMP E store also sells replacement stocks they may be better?


Tim

[flounderman]

You can mend it with brownells acraglas and it will never break. the only problem would be if it is too oily inside the crack. spread the crack, get as much epoxey inside the split and clamp it and leave it a day. I have 2 sakpo stocks that were broken completely in two at the wrist, and the acraglass is holding them together. I wouldn't bother with the pin. take it off the gun, glass the crack and clamp it. when it dries, trim the excess and put it back together and use it. I have about 55 years of experience working with gunstocks and this will work.

[madsenshooter]

I just repaired a split at the wrist Krag stock. I drilled three holes from the bottom of the wrist, through the split. I then mixed up some runny epoxy and used a veterinary size hypo to inject the epoxy down the holes and into the crack. A little up and down flexing of the stock's wrist made sure it was well coated inside. I then screwed the whole thing together with brass screws countersunk so that I could put wood plugs over the screw heads. I think the stock, cartouched 1895, will be good for another 115 years! It went together well and the crack is nearly invisible. You can make out my wood plugs, but I'm a shooter, not a collector, who cares!

[akajun]

As was previouly stated, dont write that stock off.

Go to Gunboards or Surplusrifleforum and look at Candyman's posts on stock repair. CHances are he can repair it where you will never know its been broken and his prices are more than reasonable. He also likes to trade and is especially interested in cast bullets for 3006 and 762x54.

He is also a co worker of mine and I can vouch for him.

[Jack Stanley]

If the stock is toast then it won't hurt it a bit to try Gorilla glue to stick it back together and then use accra-glass or bisonite to bed the action .

If ya just really want a new stock , there is a man in Pennsylvania who's name is Kokolus . I sells some of the best drop in replacements I've ever seen and he was highly reccomended to me . I sent him a couple blanks of cherry and he made a 03 and a A3 stock for me that I can't find a fault with .


I do have a spare straight stock that I believe to be a Smith-Corona .


Hope your project works out well .

Jack

[Multigunner]

I work as a gunsmith, and I do old wooden stock repair. Trust me, she's toast.

Any suggestions for replacements?

I wouldn't count it out quite yet, though I've sometimes found wood too far gone for any permanent repair.
I've done some repairs to century old sewing machine cabinets and seen the worst that oil perishing can do to wood.

If properly dgreased, all oil cooked out by hanging over a heat source, like a space heater in winter , soaking up oil as it comes to the surface. Then soaking in a strong solution of trisodiumphoshate, let dry and recrystalize a dozen times or more. One can often recondition the wood to allow a strong bond with acraglass gel.

I can see your point looking at this from a gunsmiths point of view, the time taken to do it right would be a good deal more than the result would be worth if charged according to the book. Labor itself is not so much, but the process takes weeks at a few minutes actual work per day, and regularly monitoring the recrystalization of the TSP several times a day.
Actual work takes a couple of hours at most but stretched over weeks at best.

I've started with stocks so oil soaked the surface was like a sponge, in the end they were as solid as new wood.

Still if the rifle in question were mine I'd find a good stock and switch it over, then tinker with the old stock as time allows. How the finished repair turned out would decide whether the barreled action went back in the old wood or remained in its new home.

[Multigunner]

If the stock is toast then it won't hurt it a bit to try Gorilla glue to stick it back together and then use accra-glass or bisonite to bed the action .

If ya just really want a new stock , there is a man in Pennsylvania who's name is Kokolus . I sells some of the best drop in replacements I've ever seen and he was highly reccomended to me . I sent him a couple blanks of cherry and he made a 03 and a A3 stock for me that I can't find a fault with .


I do have a spare straight stock that I believe to be a Smith-Corona .


Hope your project works out well .

Jack

I have a couple of pieces of rock hard walnut a friend gave to me near 20 years ago to try my hand at making a replacement fore end for a No.4 rifle. I found replacement wood before starting on this project.
I did make a stab at making a fore end using a softer wood just as a test, and found it was no easy task using hand tools and drill press with rotary rasps and wood files.
I'd seen a few mentions of duplicate stocks being made to order and have been considering sending these pieces of walnut and a No.4 fore end off to have a couple of semi finish inletted fore ends turned out.

Replacement furniture for the Enfields is alot easier to find these days, but those rock hard perfectly seasoned pieces just call out to be turned into a custom target grade fore end.

I'll look into this, though it will have to remain on the backburner for now, along with a few other projects I'll be lucky to finish before the final trump.

[leadman]

I read in an old American Rifleman that most of the cracks to this area are caused by the stock touching the tang of the receiver. The article said specifically to make sure it is not touching.
My son had a Ramline stock on a 98 Mauser split in this same area and it was touching in this area.
If I remember right there is a guy on the CMP forum that also repairs stocks. That board would also be a good source for a good used stock.

Call DuPage as he does not like e-mail. He has inventory that is not on his website and is a good guy to deal with.

[ilcop22]

I can see your point looking at this from a gunsmiths point of view, the time taken to do it right would be a good deal more than the result would be worth if charged according to the book.

Still if the rifle in question were mine I'd find a good stock and switch it over, then tinker with the old stock as time allows. How the finished repair turned out would decide whether the barreled action went back in the old wood or remained in its new home.

Exactly my point of view. The time, money and effort involved to do it right would cost more than a new stock would. I intend on keeping and restoring the old stock in time, when time becomes available. For now, the musty old stock (those of you residing in the upper midwest will know what decades of improper storage in this climate does to wood stocks) will go on the to do list. I'll be looking into the recommendations given thusfar.

[garandsrus]

The CMP replacement stock is pretty nice...

John

[madsenshooter]

If the stock is toast then it won't hurt it a bit to try Gorilla glue to stick it back together and then use accra-glass or bisonite to bed the action .

If ya just really want a new stock , there is a man in Pennsylvania who's name is Kokolus . I sells some of the best drop in replacements I've ever seen and he was highly reccomended to me . I sent him a couple blanks of cherry and he made a 03 and a A3 stock for me that I can't find a fault with .


I do have a spare straight stock that I believe to be a Smith-Corona .


Hope your project works out well .

Jack

Though I'll admit it does stick stuff pretty good, have you ever used Gorilla Glue? It expands as it dries, I read a post somewhere about a fellow that used it on a stock and it's expansion cracked it even further. (Hmm, must not have had it clamped). I've used it on some small cracks, let it expand above the crack then sand it back down, but I wouldn't recommend it for major repairs, Accra-Glass or any quality epoxy from a major manufacturer, such as Devcon, Loc-Tite or 3M would be a better bet IMO.

[Jack Stanley]

Yep , I have used it and while it does work I don't know as if it is the best for every crack . I've done handguards with Gorilla glue and clamped them with a rubber band and a C-clamp to a block of wood to keep it from moving . For the most part I prefer accra-glass though I do use Micro-bed on some stuff

I think it just depends on the crack to fix what would work best .

Jack

[LIMPINGJ]

Contact Ben one of the members here. He can most likely fix it for you.

[ilcop22]

I feel a little silly for not having noticed this when I purchased the rifle or even when it cracked. Admittedly, though, I was more interested in the serial number and bore than the stock at the time.

Upon close inspection tonight, I noticed something odd about the crack at the wrist. Took out my trust exacto-knife only to discover that, yup, the stock had previously been repaired. I pulled out a bunch of rotten... something... from the cracks on the top and bottom of the wrist. Looking further, I found that the damage was worse than I had noticed when it cracked at the range. It turns out, all I really did was finish splitting the glue that was used to fill the cracks in the stock (some of them). I suspect the crack was cut wider and filled with some sort of adhesive, as there is no play whatsever when I compress the stock.

I also noticed the stock had been refinished and I assume only rough sanded given the swirl marks under the finish. I think I'll be getting a CMP replacement.

[PatMarlin]

Definitely contact Ben.

[Calamity Jake]

I work as a gunsmith, and I do old wooden stock repair. Trust me, she's toast.

Any suggestions for replacements?

You can get new manufacture/less metal or a pull off from the CMP.

[ilcop22]

I went ahead and ordered the CMP replacement stock. I'll either store the stock for a later repair date or just sell it to someone willing to take the time to repair it. Thanks for all the tips, gents.

[jonk]

What, no pics?

[Shiloh]

Fixable. Epoxi works wonders.

SHiloh

[MtGun44]

If the old repair involved removing material and filling a lot with crappy glue, it may be
beyond any reasonable repair.

+1 on make sure you have a positive clearance at the wood to metal interface of the rear
reciever tang curve. This looks unsightly but without a significant gap here, the stock will crack from recoil. This is at the extreme rear of the action.

Bill

[ilcop22]

MtGunn44, I'm gonna make certain of that when I fit the new stock. It looks like that was the cause of the initial crack and my furtherance of said crack. She looks to me like they cut out the old wood. I'm sure it's fixable, but I have enough stocks in line already.

[ilcop22]

I've uploaded a few pics of some of the damage to the stock. Other cracks are difficult to photograph. The split in the trigger area is through-and-through with most of the wood removed from the split. On the top side of the wrist, the wood has also been removed. The bottom split I haven't messed with. All cracks are non-compressable and thus far, it appears the wood has been removed and glue was filled in place. Damage doesn't look too bad in the photos, but like I mentioned before, I don't have the time or energy to fill or repair the cracks to make her shooting condition again.

Left to right: Top wrist, underside trigger, bottom wrist.

[MtGun44]

Most of the WW2 guns have quite a gap at the back, before I knew why, I thought it was just
crappy war emergency production tolerances. Not found elsewhere in the inletting tho.
Typical to see 1/8" clearance in the rear inletting. Looks bad and is probably a lot more than is
needed but you do need a positive clearance.

Does look pretty comprehensive. Probably fixable if it were the last stock in the world, but
it is not. Some people take this as a challenge, others replace and go on.

Time and money are directly interchangeable commodities. Each person has a different
exchange rate, and even then, the exchange rate is different for different projects - adjusted
by any available 'fun factor'.

Bill

[Ben]

Ditto X 10 Bill's advice ! !

[ilcop22]

Your equation is probably the best written I've seen, Bill.