Can we have a hollow point expansion picture thread?

[frankenfab]

Or has there already been one? I would love to see a thread with pictures of before and after expanding and the mold, too.

[Blammer]

185gr 45ACP at 750 fps out of my Kimber pro carry
from my NOE 230gr "ball" RG2 mould
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g81/blammer8mm/Cast%20boolits/45ACP/DSCN8032.jpg

[Blammer]

out of my 360 Dan Wesson at 1700fps
NOE 360180 Dish HP

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g81/blammer8mm/Cast%20boolits%20fun/DSCN7697.jpg

[Blammer]

out of my 45acp
NOE 452316 HP's

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g81/blammer8mm/Cast%20boolits%20fun/DSCN7669.jpg

[geargnasher]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15918&d=1253321017

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15917&d=1253320401

My contrubution. Lyman 452374 Devastator hollow point, ACWW+2%Sn at 12.5 bhn, .45 ACP at approx. 850 fps.

Gear

[lwknight]

I'm a firm beliver in, that a small amount of tin aiding greatly in weight retension.

[geargnasher]

I'm a firm beliver in, that a small amount of tin aiding greatly in weight retension.

Yes, I did a little work to get those results. They will blow all to pieces with WW-levels of antimony without a balancing amount of tin. If you push them too fast they still blow up. Nothing beats 20-1 for a good hollow point handgun alloy, but I don't like to make it special if cheapo WW will work.

Gear

[GLynn41]

I love the dish HP --I have a Mihia 197 gr .41 devastator HP -- I wonder how I can get the dish thing for mine-- I am sure NOE makes good stuff and so does Mihia-- I will try to catch one out of my nomral .41 -- my .41/454 will go about 1750+ might be easier to catch -- the ones I have got from dirt -- blow away the the nose like a Nosler part -- which is not so bad

[Dannix]

Well, decided to not hijack this thread, but ask them in a new thread (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?p=942109) instead. Some nice pics here! I'm seriously considering a BRP 4-cav, all HP for my 9mm.

[RugerFan]

Mihec .452-200 Cramer HPs, 5.0 gns of Salute (Russian Unique), M1911A1. Shot a few into a dirt bank at about 5 yards. My bullets average weight after lubing/sizing is 204.4 gns (8 BHN). This recovered bullet weighed 202.3 gns with a diameter of .820”.

http://i331.photobucket.com/albums/l449/wolf913/MP45HP_1.jpg

http://i331.photobucket.com/albums/l449/wolf913/MP45HP_3.jpg

[fredj338]

SOme of my favorites:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/45-215gr.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/44-272-1K.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/44-272.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/136hp-1050.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/9mm-136-1200.jpg

[Dannix]

Mihec .452-200 Cramer HPs, 5.0 gns of Salute (Russian Unique), M1911A1. Shot a few into a dirt bank at about 5 yards. My bullets average weight after lubing/sizing is 204.4 gns (8 BHN). This recovered bullet weighed 202.3 gns with a diameter of .820”.
Alloy?

[303Guy]

Here is a 147gr 303Brit HP boolit fired into soft, fine sand.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/20gr2205_146PP.jpg

Here is a 208gr boolit fired into soft, fine sand along with an unfired example.
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-610F.jpghttp://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-611F.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-607F.jpg Weight retention is around 98%.

A lower velocity hollow point fired into wet rags.
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-535F-1.jpg

[quack1]

Don't know what you're looking for but here are after pictures of Lyman 225462 and 225438 used on groundhogs. AC wheel weights with a little tin hollow pointed on a lathe, approx .085 diameter hole drilled to first grease groove. Both right around 2000fps.
http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll300/1quack1/firstcasthpkill22-25075yds.jpg
http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll300/1quack1/51grhpcast22-25020yds.jpg

[Fenring]

The left three are .44 Devastators cast from air cooled clip on WW's and launched at 1650fps from my Ruger 96/44. All they were recovered from pigs ranging from about 25kg to 60kg. No shot was longer than about 30 metres and the bullets were just sitting under the skin on the off side. Average retained weight was 165gr. They started out at 275gr.

The last bullet is the Lee .44 flat nose solid that started out at 315gr from the same alloy, launched at 1500fps. That bullet hit a boar of about 50kg at maybe 15 metres, and was found in the layer of gristle "armour" almost directly opposite, just under the skin. 313gr left!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v616/Fenring/Shooting/Goodooga%202010/P1050767.jpg

[Ben]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=42960

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=30029

[ghh3rd]

The last bullet is the Lee .44 flat nose solid that started out at 315gr from the same alloy, launched at 1500fps. That bullet hit a boar of about 50kg at maybe 15 metres, and was found in the layer of gristle "armour" almost directly opposite, just under the skin. 313gr left!

Hope this is the Lee .430 310 grain Round Flat Nose boolit, cause that's what I've been casting, although I haven't had the opportunity to point one towards a hog, yet. Mine have been leaving my Ruger SBH at about 1380 fps with 21.5 gr of W296.

[Fenring]

It is. :)

[Butcher45]

.452 Devastators (to small for my .454 barrel) shot from my air rifle at about 750fps. Recovered from saturated phone books (the bottom one with the calipers may have been shot into water.....same difference expansion-wise). Cast by BlackJackHill before they went under. Extremely soft lead (the box was labeled "207grain").

I just now weighed the middle one in the top picture that was recovered from the books (shot almost three years ago), and it appears to have retained %100 of its weight (208grains).

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x65/butcher45/DSCN5688.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x65/butcher45/DSCN5667.jpg

[RugerFan]

Alloy?

50/50 pure lead/WW

[cbrick]

CWW +2% Sn, Lyman 45 Devastator fired at 800 fps straight down into water. I did this test more to test for the boolit coming apart than for expnsion, water is a very hard medium. Of the three of this alloy tested one came apart. All in all I would call this a success.

Rick

[zomby woof]

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/7617101_8323.jpg

[joel0407]

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/7617101_8323.jpg

Thats one hell of a mean looking bullet. :shock:

[Dannix]

Winchester ranger, right?

Expanded JHP pics are a dime a dozen. This is the Boolits subforum. ;)

[gray wolf]

Put a handle on it and use it for a club.

That thing looks mid evil

[zomby woof]

Winchester ranger, right?

Expanded JHP pics are a dime a dozen. This is the Boolits subforum. ;)

Black Talon 44 mag.

I couldn't help it, i love that picture. I shot it into several milk jugs of water.

[Shooter6br]

Mihec 200 g out of my 45acp into water jug 7 yrds 20-1 alloy

[MT Gianni]

Any possibility of all pics including alloy, velocity and recovery medium?

[fredj338]

Any possibility of all pics including alloy, velocity and recovery medium?

MIne are posted in the pic but test medium is wetpack.[smilie=p:

[Longrange]

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/7617101_8323.jpg

when did you dip into my Tallon stash?

[frankenfab]

Thanks for all the great info everybody! I don't have a hollow point mold yet, and I really got fired up about it after pics I have seen in various threads. So I says to myself, "self, I gotta git me one of those there hollow point molds".:bigsmyl2:

I thought it would be neat to have a reference thread like this.

Looks like my 1st hollow point mold is going to be a Mihec .44/.444. I can't wait!!

[303Guy]

Holy ... ummm ... cow, zomby woof. That has to be the meanest looking boolit ..ulp.... bullet I ever seen!:holysheep (Even if it is an un-holy j-word!)

[Moonie]

303Guy, yes, government thought the same and not long after they came out the government decided they would be LEO/Military only. Too bad, it was a great bullet that Winchester had done alot of research and testing to develop, lots of new patents on it and innovative technology went into it.

[Dannix]

If I recall correctly, apparently it was so mean looking the liberals got freaked out. So Winchester pulled it from the market before any decision was made. Today's Winchester 'Ranger' sure looks similar. iirc Winchester technically sells them to LEO/et al by choice, but you can still get some rather readily, just not at Walmart.

My current source...or used to be. Apparently the guy is moving on:
http://bellsouthpwp2. net/s/c/scgunguy/rangerlist.htm

Edit: tds-us.com is another source.

[Buckshot]

:hijack:

................Winchester named then "Black Talons" and yes the media and liberals had a cow with Winchester's photos. "Why those things would be like a 'buzz saw' going through a person. Of course they'd be effective but the media/politico's fright of the 'Buzz Saw' deal had no grounds. They envisioned it at some stated 100K+ rpm literally spraying blood and flesh across entire parking lots as it traversed the poor person it hit. It was entirely too deadly for them. Our Ca Senators, Babs Boxer and Diane Feinstein both stated the ammo companies needed to created 'friendlier ammo', or similar idiotic words to the same effect, but I digress.

From a 45 ACP having a 16" twist the slug would make 1 revolution as it passed through a 16" wide person. No visually sensational 'buzz saw'. Winchester bowed to the wacko's and pulled them. Then repackaged them and quietly sold the exact same technology under a different name. I recall places having the original Black Talons and advertising them for truly sensational prices. They were simply SO wicked :-)

...................Buckshot

[exile]

I recently saw some Black Talons in .40 S & W for sale in a local shop. The price they wanted for them was obscene.

exile

[303Guy]

Well, this is not exactly a Black Talon but it is an expanded hollow nose cast boolit fired into wet paper at low velocity.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-384F_edited-1.jpg

I'd say the penetration of this 245gr torpedo would be quite respectable.:rolleyes:


... as it traversed the poor person it hit. It was entirely too deadly for them.Yes of course, you wouldn't want to hurt someone when you shot them!

[leftiye]

FWIW, I tried annealing the noses of some devastator .44 call boolits that I had cast over the weekend. I painted the mouth of the hollowpoint cavities with 300 degree Tempilaq.

First, I - thinking that drawing the heat away from the bases was a good idea to keep them from annealing - set the boolits atop a 1 1/2" thick piece of aluminum in a bread pan in water up to the top of the top driving band, and put it all in a 500 degree oven. No dice! The Tempilaq wouldn't melt, even when I put the oven on broil.

So I set the boolits in a 6" diameter can lid with water up to the top of the first driving band, and put it in a toaster oven set on broil (450 degrees radiant heat from above). Too bad. Even with the water boiling the 300 degree Tempilaq didn't melt.

So I heated an aluminum plate to 400 degrees on a kitchen stove burner (tested with an IR thermometer), and painted a line on the ogive about halfway up the ogive, and set the boolit nose down on the hot plate. It took a while (surprisingly long), but the tempilaq melted (finally). I immediately removed the boolit from the plate (it was too hot to touch).

I suspect this annealed the boolit nose (it got softer) however, it might have annealed more than I wanted to make soft. I have a Saeco hardness tester which can't be used except on a flat nose boolit (filed flats maybe, but the boolit still won't fit sideways in the tester). I'm going to go to a softer alloy - these were straight wheelweights which had been heat treated, and see how that works out. More later.

[303Guy]

I do believe the only way to anneal boolit noses is to stand the boolit in water and flame heat the exposed nose. Another trick is to anneal the whole thing then quench only the base. That would likely be better as the annealing can be done over an hour or more. Not difficult if the batch of boolits are held in some sort of separator plate that allows only the bases to hit the water and keeps the ensueing steam away from the noses - maybe even to keep the noses from cooling as long as possible.

[JIMinPHX]

This picture shows a variety of HPs. The top row shows a pair of factory loaded .32acp that may as well have been FMJ. As you can see, there was zero expansion. I've had the same results from some Russian 120-grain HP Makarov ammo.

The middle row shows some .223 boolits that I make for coyote hunting. The HP is drilled with a 3/32 bit. The alloy is about 13bnh. The hollow area blows apart & fragments pretty violently as soon as they hit their target. The body of the boolit mushes down to about twice it's original diameter. I seldom recover these from coyotes. They usually pass right through unless I get a quartering shot. I usually launch them around 2,000-2,300 fps, depending on the particular load. They're pretty effective on small to medium game.

The bottom row shows some factory .38 specials. As you can see, performance varies.

[JIMinPHX]

Anybody that tells you that a .380 will not expand, just isn't hitting a hard enough target.

[leftiye]

Thas whut the problem is with some of the harder alloys fired into sand. They mushroom in sand - but probly nowhere else (except rocks, etc.).

303 guy -The guy at Tempil told me I wouldn't get a good temp reading if I applied direct flame. If you are going to stand them in water, you're probly right - nothing but a direct flame would do the job. So, either we have lack of temp control, or maybe we anneal a bit more than we want.

[303Guy]

Here's a fancy boolit! It's a as cast soft front bit/hard rear bit boolit.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-226F-1.jpghttp://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-010F-1.jpg

The front bit was knurled after seating hence the knurling where the frosting once was.

[rollingblock]

Retrieved this out of a red stag. Don't remember the load but was probably only 1200fps or so. Soft lead bullet. This was from about 20yrs ago and was not getting much velocity at all without bad leading. Have learned a little bit since then but still have a long way to go. No longer have 45.70 but found this boolit amongst some junk during a clean up.
The gouges on the side of the bullet are from plowing through several ribs.

[Blammer]

I'd stand the boolits up in a bowl or tin, then heat treat, after heat treating, pour cold water in up to the place you want.

[JIMinPHX]

You can see an expansion picture of a 1 oz dead soft slug hitting a steel plate after going through over a foot of crumb rubber here - http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?p=952697#post952697

[Charlie Two Tracks]

MP 359-125 mould
http://i32.tinypic.com/jab604.jpg

[BoolitBill]

Charlie Two Tracks,
Since I have that mold I am curious. What was your alloy and what did you shoot it into for the expansion media?

[Charlie Two Tracks]

The alloy was Isotope lead from Muddy Creek Sam. I shot it into clay soil from about 15 feet. I loaded the boolits into .38 revolver cases and had 3 grains of Bullseye behind them. They also leaded the forcing cone fairly well. It's a work in progress. The one on the right must have hit a rock or another boolit.

[RobS]

This is a bullet from a forum member that I had played around with. It is from a recent MiHec mold, the RCBS 45-270-SAA copy. From my understanding 45 2.1 gave him the HP dimensions and as designed the pentagon HP is to shed off the first few inches of penetration. As expected the bullet did as Bob envisioned.

Not much expansion, but some, as I had the bullet in the upper 14 BHN and drove them out at around 1125-1150 fps. Test was done on 4 jugs of water or 18" of H2O and then the bullet lodged itself into the back few pages of a 1 1/2" damp paper back book. Bullet was cast from 50/50 lead WW alloy with around 2% tin and heat treated to reach the stated BHN.

http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt206/RobS01/SIDE-162Gr.jpg

http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt206/RobS01/TOP-463.jpg

It would have been better to have a softer alloy for more expansion. Expansion none the less was decent considering the BHN at .463 and bullet retention was 162 grains. This bullet would be a pretty decent one for thin skinned animals.

[Good Cheer]

This is a 40 caliber muzzleloader, 1:16" twist, fired into a gallon jug of water with wet paper behind it. The bullet has a short hollow point.
http://i791.photobucket.com/albums/yy192/SNARGLEFLERK/narrowlands.jpg

[BrianB]

I do believe the only way to anneal boolit noses is to stand the boolit in water and flame heat the exposed nose. Another trick is to anneal the whole thing then quench only the base. That would likely be better as the annealing can be done over an hour or more. Not difficult if the batch of boolits are held in some sort of separator plate that allows only the bases to hit the water and keeps the ensueing steam away from the noses - maybe even to keep the noses from cooling as long as possible.

The base quenching sure sounds good. I softened about 100 bullet noses while the bases were submerged in a water pan last weekend and it seemed like it took forever!
Not to mention the fact my wrist needed a break every once in a while from the weight of the Bernz-O-Matic. Sheeez! Why didn't I think of base quenching?

[RobS]

Again I'm using the same pentagon HP, but this time a bit softer boolit and at a slower velocity. They were 9 BHN and begain life at 271 grains. Velocity this time was 1074 fps resulting in .5175" of expansion and as before the boolit's nose shed off and ended with a weight of 158 grains.

About 18" of jugged water was utilized and as the boolit passed through the H2O it lodged itself just inside of an inch of wet cardboard pieces.

http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt206/RobS01/158gr51759BHN50-50.jpg

[RobS]

This one I shoot in my 45 ACP or down loaded 45 cal revolver loads. The boolit started out at 238 grains and has a very large HP cavity. Again 18" of jugged water was untilized and the boolit made its way through them and settled just a bit inside of some wet carboard pieces, probably an 1/8". The boolit did happen to hit the edge of the metal trap I had set behind the H2O jugs so half of it had been sheared off, but expansion was very good at .8005 and retained a weight of 199.6 grains despited loosing darn near half of the expanded nose. Velocity on the tested boolit was 832 fps and it was cast from WW alloy with 1% Sn added and at a BHN of 10.


http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt206/RobS01/200gr805010BHNWW-1Sn.jpg

[RobS]

This one is my own cast boolit from a BABore 454-283-Keith SWC mold which is a very close design to the RCBS 45-270-SAA. Moving along right at 1218 fps it's a nice load for a lot of N. American game. Boolit weight with lube was 284 grains and after being shot the retention was very good at 281 grains. Making its way through 22" of jugged water, the slug kept on trucking and worked through 1 1/2" of damp cardboard then also about 8" of damp sand before coming to a rest. The boolit was cast from WW alloy with 1% Sn and had a BHN of 10. The widest expansion on this slug measured right at .5505

http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt206/RobS01/281gr550510BHNWW1Sn.jpg

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

Alloy about 68% ww, 29% recovered range lead, and 3% tin . . . or there abouts . . .

Only 24 hours since cast, loaded in 38 special cases with 5.5gr Unique, shot out of a Ruger Security Six 357 mag with a 4" barrel at about 10 yards into water, penetrated 14" of water.

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/359640RoundHPinwater1.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/359640RoundHPinwater2.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/359640RoundHPinWater3.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/Learn2shoot.jpg

[AbitNutz]

This only confirms my life long resolution not to be shot by hollow points or any bullets in general.

[JIMinPHX]

This picture shows a variety of HPs. The top row shows a pair of factory loaded .32acp that may as well have been FMJ. As you can see, there was zero expansion. I've had the same results from some Russian 120-grain HP Makarov ammo.

The middle row shows some .223 boolits that I make for coyote hunting. The HP is drilled with a 3/32 bit. The alloy is about 13bnh. The hollow area blows apart & fragments pretty violently as soon as they hit their target. The body of the boolit mushes down to about twice it's original diameter. I seldom recover these from coyotes. They usually pass right through unless I get a quartering shot. I usually launch them around 2,000-2,300 fps, depending on the particular load. They're pretty effective on small to medium game.

The bottom row shows some factory .38 specials. As you can see, performance varies.


A board member recently PM'd me & asked me to expand a little on the boolits that I used here. The .223s are Lyman 225415 with a 3/32" HP that was drilled to a depth just short of where the driving bands start. The alloy was recovered bird shot + 1 or 2% tin, probably 2%. The boolits were air cooled.

The more tin you add, the more the boolits tend to hold together as they expand. The more antimony you add, the more they tend to fracture. Antimony makes them harder, especially after heat treating. Tin doesn't really add a whole lot of hardness.

Recovered bird shot is pretty close to being the same as wheel weight alloy except that the bird shot usually has a pinch of added arsenic in it as well, which helps with increasing hardness via heat treating. WW will heat treat as is, but adding a little bird shot makes them come up a bit harder sometimes after heat treat. Pure lead will not harden from heat treat. Adding only tin to the pure lead will not do much for adding hardness with or without heat treating. Adding a few percent antimony (as WW have) will add some hardness when you air cool the boolits & a fair amount more hardness when you water drop or heat treat. Heat treating takes too much effort for me. All I ever do is water drop out of the mold if I want hard boolits. Wheel weights will usually come up around 12bnh if you air cool them & somewhere in the low 20's if you water drop them.

I probably would have had better mushroom performance if I mixed in some 20:1 lead:tin alloy & then water dropped to get back up to the same 13bnh hardness. I'm guessing that if I used about 2 or 3 parts 20:1 & 1 part of my bird shot +2%, that I would have a better mushrooming alloy. I only used what I did because that material is what I had plenty of & it performs well in general. I did not custom tailor this alloy to this application. I was not trying to make the perfect mushroom.

Those boolits were shot into crumb rubber, which duplicates expansion in soft animal tissue about as closely as anything that I have found so far.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=23823&d=1279529702

[MtGun44]

Back to the Black Talon comments, which were a bit off topic, for sure.

I believe that the current Winchester Ranger SXT is the exact same bullet without the
black coating. "Restricted" to "first responders", but this is mostly marketing hype.
You can find it at gun shows all the time, no problems getting it if you want it, not
illegal except in those sad, insane little places that make all HP ammo illegal. How
bizzarre.

"talons" are irrelevant - the darned thing is smashing through at 800-1400 fps, what in
the heck more are some tiny little points going to do?

Bill

[fredj338]

This is a bullet from a forum member that I had played around with. It is from a recent MiHec mold, the RCBS 45-270-SAA copy. From my understanding 45 2.1 gave him the HP dimensions and as designed the pentagon HP is to shed off the first few inches of penetration. As expected the bullet did as Bob envisioned.

Not much expansion, but some, as I had the bullet in the upper 14 BHN and drove them out at around 1125-1150 fps. Test was done on 4 jugs of water or 18" of H2O and then the bullet lodged itself into the back few pages of a 1 1/2" damp paper back book. Bullet was cast from 50/50 lead WW alloy with around 2% tin and heat treated to reach the stated BHN.

It would have been better to have a softer alloy for more expansion. Expansion none the less was decent considering the BHN at .463 and bullet retention was 162 grains. This bullet would be a pretty decent one for thin skinned animals.
Rob, at vel above 1000fps, you need to have a more ductile alloy. These are 25-1 alloy fired into wetpack:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/44-272.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/9mm-136-1200.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/45-215gr.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/452-268-1K.jpg
I am not sure water dropping is helping w/ that much antimony still left in the mix. I have to experiment a bit more w/ 50/50 mixes & water dropping, but lead/tin mixes are quite ductile & run fine into the 1200fps range.

[Markbo]

One thing's for sure. I gotta get me some more moulds! :lovebooli

[Bardo]

Dug this thread up after no one has posted for almost a year. Just got this mold back from Erik it was a Lee 2 cavity 356-102-1R it dropped at about 104 gr. But after it got hollow pointed it drops boolits at 90 gr. That is with 66% WW 33 % pure lead and 1% tin. I think it was going about 900 fps out of my sig p238. I shot it into wet telephone books from 5 yards and it penetrated 4" into it. The hollow points all opened about the same at .660"

Bardo

40698

[fredj338]

Dug this thread up after no one has posted for almost a year. Just got this mold back from Erik it was a Lee 2 cavity 356-102-1R it dropped at about 104 gr. But after it got hollow pointed it drops boolits at 90 gr. That is with 66% WW 33 % pure lead and 1% tin. I think it was going about 900 fps out of my sig p238. I shot it into wet telephone books from 5 yards and it penetrated 4" into it. The hollow points all opened about the same at .660"

Bardo

40698

Nice expansion but I don't think I want to rely on 6" of penetration to stop a BG (about what 4" of wetpack = in balistic gel).

[Rangefinder]

All right. I know they're already in a couple other threads, but...

165gr HP'd SWC in 40S&W at about 950fps...
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/hillsjim/DSCF9636.jpg


Self explanitory, but fired from my Mosin at about 1800fps.
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/hillsjim/DSCF7023.jpg

70gr .32ACP running abot 700fps.
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/hillsjim/DSCF5794.jpg

[Bardo]

Nice expansion but I don't think I want to rely on 6" of penetration to stop a BG (about what 4" of wetpack = in balistic gel).

Not ideal but better then a sling shot or a butter knife. I would perfer my 45's for power but not wieght. I actually usually carry this in my front pocket when I'm hiking. Its small enough I dont notice it but still fun to shot and not so loud. I usually dont carry hearing protection. So it works for what I got it for.

Bardo

[Boolseye]

9mm 124 gr TL TC (Lee), 7 grains #7 (1000fps), hand drilled with Forster HP tool,
shot into wet phone books. 10-12" penetration, .5" + final measurement. 50/50 range lead/pure

[mdi]

Please, be sure to mention what the bullet was recovered from, or what it was shot into...

[ku4hx]

Lyman original #2 alloy. I forget the mold numbers but the GC was ~215 grains and the other two were ~245 grains 44 Magnum. They were not HP, but this was typical expansion.

[MT Gianni]

Rangefinder, Did you HP that Lee 40 cal tl mold or the boolits?

[Michael J. Spangler]

this needs to be a sticky

[Rangefinder]

MT, I HP'd the mold. You can actually see the step-by-step of that project itself in the Mold Maint. & Design section as a sticky "HP'ing a mold without a full machine shop".

[bowhunter]

http://http://i1220.photobucket.com/albums/dd445/olskool1/IMG_3116.jpg i know it aint cast lead but this is bullets recovered from deer. they were 300 gr. hornady xtp hp. fired from my 1977 444s marlin. most shots were around 75 yds.

[thegreatdane]

Here's my recent test:

38 Special
4.5gn Unique
~160gn MP 359640
Fed primers
Crimped in the long groove
Lubed with Magma Red
Smith and Wesson Bodyguard 38
fired into Wet Newspaper

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c66/drobberson/Forum/IMG_2012_02_12_6089S.jpg

I call it a success; however, there were a few that barely expanded, so my current load is 4.7gn Unique. They shoot well.

[snuffy]

These are from the M-P group buy 45-200 cramer HP mold. These were cast from pure lead with 2% tin.

http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/cannont2ifolder/websize/IMG_0383.jpg

http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/cannont2ifolder/websize/IMG_0382.jpg

Left is the round HP, right is the penta HP.

http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/cannont2ifolder/websize/IMG_0379.jpg

This is the round HP sitting next to where it stopped in the test tube wax media.

http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/cannont2ifolder/websize/IMG_0378.jpg

Then the penta point, it took a right turn in the last inch of penetration.

Load was 5.5 of W-231. I haven't clocked it with the chrony yet, but estimate it @ 800. Oh, it's my Springfield Armory 1911. Weight retention was nearly 100% average, with only one having lost any weight.

[Bardo]

This is from the M-P group buy 45-200 cramer HP mold with penta pins, like the post above. This is out of a 1911 at around 900 fps into a milk jug then into about 8" of wet telephone book. The alloy was 66% WW 33% pure lead and 1% tin.

Double click on the picture to enlarge.

42172

[dubber123]

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh83/dubber123/IMG_3149.jpg 50/50 WW-Pb, 850 fps. from a 1-7/8" .38 spl. The weights listed are as recovered, they each only lost 2-3 grains of weight.

[dubber123]

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh83/dubber123/uncle004.jpg I haven't figured out how to catch one of these yet... 50/50 WW-Pb, 520 gr. HP @ 1,400 fps. :)

[white eagle]

Mihec .452-200 Cramer HPs, 5.0 gns of Salute (Russian Unique), M1911A1. Shot a few into a dirt bank at about 5 yards. My bullets average weight after lubing/sizing is 204.4 gns (8 BHN). This recovered bullet weighed 202.3 gns with a diameter of .820”.

http://i331.photobucket.com/albums/l449/wolf913/MP45HP_1.jpg

http://i331.photobucket.com/albums/l449/wolf913/MP45HP_3.jpg

that is exactly how mine look :bigsmyl2:

[Dannix]

What boolit is that? I looks like a pretty serious hitter.


http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh83/dubber123/uncle004.jpg I haven't figured out how to catch one of these yet... 50/50 WW-Pb, 520 gr. HP @ 1,400 fps. :)

[Markbo]

How about a little more information. What cartridge is that?

[Michael J. Spangler]

Bringing this thread back from the dead.
This is MP 359-640 160 grain penta pin. Fired in a 1 7/8” barrel. A 4” barrel and an 18” barrel.
Alloy was pure with about 1.5% tin if I remember correctly.


278800278801

[bld451]

MP 235 gr HP at 1050. 8.5" blackout in 10% gel. 50/50 pure/WW. Modified (longer hp on right. 279319

[bld451]

Mp 311-140 at about 2000 from same 8.5" blackout. Small hp pins. Seated out to crimp just on the forward end of the grease groove. Feeds great and about 2-3" groups at 100.279321279321

[Michael J. Spangler]

293319293318
MP 460-420

First one is the cup point loaded fast. Second is the penta loaded slow.
Great weight retention. It seems the cavity design/speed matters a lot more than the alloy.

[Michael J. Spangler]

306583

MP 359-125 with the penta pins. Sport pistol powder.
CZ P-01 Omega.

Bullet shown beside a 147 HST for comparison.
Only 10” of penetration in bare gel but super consistent from shot to shot. I’m thinking if I slow this down a bit or maybe try the same alloy with the regular round hollow point it might slow down the expansion and get better penetration.

I have to compare the hollow point pins though because the round is very similar size. I’m guessing the round expands a little slower than the penta due to not having the sharp corners that turn into petals.

Oh and retained weight was virtually 100%.
I didn’t weight this alloy before shooting but the harder alloy was about 129 grains. This being softer I figured it’s a few grains heavier. The recovered mushrooms weight 129.5 average. Close enough.