WW too hard, looking for a good mix

[Steel185]

Probelm: I've been collecting WWs from around town and have poured about 250 45acp(230grn) boolits so far. I've sluged my bore (.451), and when i went to size them from .452-.451 I almost broke my bench trying to put enough pressure to push it through the sizing die, (Lee sizer kit). Which led me to thinking something is wrong with my mix, or casting process generating bullets too hard. These are straight WW, and i was water dropping them thinking i needed them to be hard 12-13bhm, seems its much higher than expected. How do i air cool? I tried a damp towel but it makes the sides of the boolits that tuch the damp towel rough and frosty looking compared to the other side.

Guidance? I ran across a guy that was moving and had to get rid hlaf his stash of casting lead. We stuck a deal and now i have 1300# of WWs, babbit lead, and sheets of what seems to be very, very soft lead from some sort of insulation on power lines or oil rig pumps (think west texas). How can i mix this to come up with good mixes. I have a 1911 for target and personal defense, and hunt boar with .480 ruger, in a revolver and carbine.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I assume you lubed the bullets before sizing ?

[cajun shooter]

First thing is that WW's that were water dropped are probably closer to the 20's in BHN. With all your lead and different alloys on hand you need to purchase a good tester. I would go with the Cabine tree as they are built like a tank and give the best readings. For normal 45 ACP loads all you need is straight WW dropped on a towel that will give you a BHN of around 10. You might add some tin for mold fill out.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Okay, here is the easy way to solve your question. Firstly, straight ww alloy is absolutely fine for your purpose, if you need softer go 50/50 with the sheet lead and ww. Water quench is really not necessary, since you are not driving them over 2000 fps you really don`t need to water quench or use the damp cloth routine. Air cooling is just that, when you open the mold and drop the boolet onto an old towel simply let them lay there and cool. Lift a corner of the towel to roll them away from the drop area every now and then. When cool to the touch you can either go ahead and lube/size them or let them sit in a container for a latter time, aged, to lube/size.Robert:cbpour:

[WILCO]

Were you using the right sizing die and not one that was too small??

[462]

When I used to water quench, a friend tested some boolits, using a Lee tester, and they measured 29 BHN.

[fryboy]

straight ww's will run 9-12 BHN easy ..one thought on water quenching size as soon as u can cuz they'll sit there and age harden for a bit afterwards and u do have to lube them to size them ( but anything slickery will work ( including dawn dishwashing liquid ))

[RobS]

How do i air cool? I tried a damp towel but it makes the sides of the boolits that tuch the damp towel rough and frosty looking compared to the other side.

Use a couple of soft towels that are dry. To make a softer surface I actually cut a piece of carpet the size of my table top that I cover it with a big towel. DO NOT just lay a hot bullet onto the carpet..............some carpet fibers melt and will do just that on the surface of a hot bullet.

[skeettx]

YES.

I use the soft towel system and it works wonderfully, I submitted a picture of my set up with the towel in the May picture submissions

Mike

[Steel185]

i forgot about aging them, i did cast them and didn't get around to sizing them for about a month. I did lube a hand ful to run them throught the sizer.

I'll melt these down and work on a hardness tester and try the air cooled method. I didn't realize it was that simple. I found the cabine tree hardness tester, again its so simple i can't see how it works. Acording to the producer's site, you run it down and read the dial? don't you have to apply a set amount of presure? Then measure the divot pushed into the surface? I'm probibly making it much too hard, I like the cabine tree design and price, I don't see how to use it.

Thanks for all the help. I love this forum!

[fryboy]

i dont use the cabine tree i have a lee , over complicating things is easy to do so relax and enjoy it ( after all isnt that what it's about anyways ? )

air cooled really makes everything super easy ,well with a decent alloy that is and ww is more than decent ,as often stated size is king !!

[SciFiJim]

I had a similar problem with .357 boolits being hard to size that took a while to figure out. It turned out that the pusher rod was not fully in the shell holder holder on the press and was actually bearing against the inside of the sizing die. Once I figured it out, it was much easier to size the boolits. Sometimes its the things you think it can't possibly be.

[starbits]

I've sluged my bore (.451), and when i went to size them from .452-.451

I do believe that you want the boolits to be .001 bigger than your bore, so you shouldn't be sizing them down to .451 anyway.

Starbits

[StarMetal]

Couple things. You've been told to size the bullet as soon as possible after casting them. By I few days they become very hard to cast because they have aged and become harder especially if you water dropped them. I size all my 45 acp bullets to .452. I have match tuned 1911's I shoot them from and have no problems with that size. Just to be sure take the barrel out of your gun and load one round and try it in the barrel. If it chambers fine and is flush with the barrel hood you are good to go.

A good mix is what you have been told 50/50 WW's/lead.

[lwknight]

seems its much higher than expected. How do i air cool?
Just drop onto a dry towel to air cool.

[Steel185]

I'll go throught and double check everything, and try again. I will air cool next time and see how that helps.

thanks for the help everyone.

[fredj338]

AS noted, just air cool & size to 0.452". Straight ww, AC, is about all my various 45acp see.
The CT tester uses spring tension to produce a dial readout that gets converted to BHN on a chart. Very easy & repeatable to use.

[Eagles6]

I agree with some others here that if your bore slugs at .451 you'd want to size .452. Straight WW should be good but 50/50 WW/PB should be fine for .45 ACP velocities and would stretch your stash considerably.

[gray wolf]

I thought I could add some wisdom to all this, I can't.
I am glad someone picked up on the .451/.452 thing.
Boy I gotta watch you guy's.

LOL--Sam

[Barnowl]

Here is an Excel spreadsheet for calculating lead alloys.

Kevin

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...782#post723782

[jr81452]

your link is broken barnowl. you see how it says "/show...782" you need to link the entire address so the "..." is not in it.

[lwknight]

Just look for other Barnowl threads. That link is in several of them.

[Steel185]

The sizing issue is my fault, my bore is .451 and I'm sizing to .452, so all is good. Jus typed it in wrong. I barrowed a tester and te boolits are 24bhn after water droping them, he ingots i used tested to 12bhn. So air cooling should be just fine and this explains the difficulty i had getting them through the sizer.

Now I'm working on my next batch that will be air cooled.

[Cowboy T]

24 BHN?? Yep, that'd explain it! :-)

I use straight WW, air cooled, for .38 Special as well. Similar pressures as .45 ACP, and it works great. BHN with my Lee tester is between 11 and 12.

[DukeInFlorida]

I use a 50-50 mix (50% wheel weights and 50% pure lead) for the slower flying bullets (vs faster = rifle). And, I air cool them, by dropping onto a towel, as has been suggested. They resize perfectly for me. And, shoot like a dream.