Bore conditioners?

[crabo]

Anyone use anything like S&W Friction Block or Tetra Gun Bore conditioner with their cast boolits or full length gas checks?

[Bass Ackward]

I have in the past.

About all you can say is that they change bore condition for awhile since lead with antimony will bring you right back home anyway. The negative is that if you have the gun broken in well, then all the loads that you developed before will generally be .... gone.

Of everything tried, I still use molly in some of my lube, especially for the fast action stuff. (heat)

[cajun shooter]

Even though this is 2010 we still have snake oil salesmen wanting to sell you some new miracle product. Not to say that some may be of some small use but for the most parts nothing but the basic natural products that have been available for many years is all that is needed. Go to a museum and look at all the guns that were fired in battle that still could be used today.

[Doc Highwall]

I shoot cast bullets lubed with the BullShops NASA lube and after I clean the gun I put some NASA lube on a patch and coat the bore with it before shooting the first shot.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

OK, I'm not going to get into a pro/con go around over this, so you can look it up and make your own choice.

There is a Product called "ER" or "Energy Release" which you can look up on the net.

It has been checked out by one of the universities here in Ideeeeeeeeho, and seems to be on the up and up. They did a series of tests and photographs which seemed to prove their point.

It is not, in and of itself a lubricant, Meaning it is not to be used as an oil or lube fluid such as motor oil, auto trans fluid or hydralic fluid etc., but is ment to be used as an additive for such fluids on a continuing bases.

First time around the dosage is bigger, followed by lesser amounts used in later oil changes.

It is NOT like teflon coatings which coat the surface of metal, but rather under heat and pressure bonds into the molecular structure of the metal.

Like I said, check it out for yourself.

I have used it for a number of years as a component in my home grown boolit lube and can see no negative effects. Has it been positive? Hmmmmmmmmmm?

Figure each time I pull the trigger, I am applying a bit of ER under the Heat and pressure required for application, and have on occasion coated a clean barrel before firing.

Well, I am not of the mind set to do an extensive set of tests so unless someone is of a mind to do so, I will never know anything other then there are no negatives seen.

Have heard some great claims, but???

It is surely a lot less messy then STP, and is just one more thing to experment with.

Keep em coming!

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[BABore]

I prefer an initial firelapping of 320 grit Clover lapping compound at 600 fps.

I am still evaluating a new-to-me 22 Hornet that I cleaned down to bare metal, then applied a coating of Ultra Bore Coat as directed by the distributor. It deposits a water-like coating containing a ceramic compound to the pores of the bbl. It's not supposed to affect accuracy at all. Just makes the gun easier to clean and foul less. Never supposed to have to be redone.

My Hornet would foul like a normal one to begin with. maybe 100 or so rounds with jacketed and I would begin to see accuracy degrading slightly. Cleaning was a PITA and took 10-15 patches to get it really clean. After coating it took 3-4. No difference in accuracy or velocity.

I'm pushing cast at full jacketed speeds and haven't had any fouling issues at all. Always wary, I'm still withholding final judgement, but it sure looks good so far.

[sergeant69]

i prefer to hand the gun to the wife and say "here, clean the damn gun". ya'll believe that, right? ask her urself. her email is www.noiain'thatdumb

[mike in co]

Even though this is 2010 we still have snake oil salesmen wanting to sell you some new miracle product. Not to say that some may be of some small use but for the most parts nothing but the basic natural products that have been available for many years is all that is needed. Go to a museum and look at all the guns that were fired in battle that still could be used today.

this may be why you "enjoy" ssas verses real guns....stuck in the past....


there have been several developments in bore and bullet coatings in the past few years.

i know of no one that has tried the latest and greatest with boolits.
a guy on the group buy forum wants to try a bullet system on boolits...so go look there.

there is a proven track record with both moly and tungsten...and now with boron nitrade.

so wake up and move forward...when you quit learning...you are already dead..just occupying space.


yes snake oil salememen..scam artist hyped moly as a lot of thing it was not. what it is is a bullet/bore coating which allows one to shoot the SAME , LONGER. PERIOD.

[StarMetal]

+1 on what mike of co says. Many gun people are car people and many car people are gun people. Sure there are cross over for some products, but in general guns aren't cars. You'll notice a wide range of auto lubricants mixed with bullet lubes because many motor heads have experience with them in car engines. I agree that many of the lubricants are good for parts of firearms that have metal rubbing metal, but not for inside the bore. Even in engine oils there are ash ratings and lots of engine manufacturers only guarantee their engines with certain low ash oil ratings. Y'all might look at what chemicals the oil industry adds to their gasoline to burn cleaner and keep the valves cleaner such as Shell adds to their premium gasoline.

Now that man has been exploring Space they found that there is a whole new requirement for lubricants. Extreme heat and extreme cold, not to say vacuum and no gravity. This is where the boron lubricants come from. Felix and I talked about me making a bullet lube with some sort of boron grease which was very expensive and I never done it.

Most of my friends that are varmint shooter, like prairie dogs, and shoot high volumes of ammo in pursuit of them went the moly route and the general consensus among them was they don't use it anymore. I'm hearing a totally different thing about the boron nitrade.

Personally myself I haven't tried any of them, but I can tell you for sure all the rifles I own that have a chromed bored clean much faster and easier then a plain bore.

[Bass Ackward]

And ALWAYS be wary of what guys put in lube.

Why an idiot once sent me bubble gum for lube to try.

I used it cause it chewed like ****. :grin:

[357maximum]

And ALWAYS be wary of what guys put in lube.

Why an idiot once sent me bubble gum for lube to try.

I used it cause it chewed like ****. :grin:

I think you were supposed to eat the stuff and then wait 12 hours in order to blow the bubbles.[smilie=l:

[303Guy]

I developed a lube for myself because I wanted something to 'glue' hornet bullets into and unsized case neck. I eventually found what I wanted and it works real well and it does contain an auto product - STP. I get zero copper fouling in a rust damaged bore and good accuracy, high performance for a hornet and indefinate case life. I tried this same lube on plain cast and works there too but no miracle lube - just OK. For me it ain't broke so I aint gonna fix it!
However, shall be testing some wax wad sheeting that a fellow poster kindly sent me.:drinks:

[jh45gun]

[quote]this may be why you "enjoy" ssas verses real guns....stuck in the past....[/unquote]



so wake up and move forward...when you quit learning...you are already dead..jsut occupying space.


yes snake oil salememen..scam artist hyped moly as a lot of thing it was not. what it is is a bullet/bore coating which allows one to shoot the SAME , LONGER. PERIOD.


So whats wrong with being stuck in the past? Seems like most of us are here since we are using CAST BULLETS.

I like the older gun designs which is why I like my lever guns and others. I would not own a new short magnum or probably any magnum for that matter except I do have a 22 mag. Just my preference as Standard cartridges work plenty well for me. Others may prefer the magnums and the moly and coated bullets that's great if that's their bag. For me I do not need them. Only guns I do not cast for now is a 6.5 Swede and a 7mm and that could be changed if and when I find molds for them.

[mike in co]

[QUOTE=jh45gun;915719][QUOTE=mike in co;915670]


So whats wrong with being stuck in the past? Seems like most of us are here since we are using CAST BULLETS.

QUOTE]

read this line again...

"so wake up and move forward...when you quit learning...you are already dead..just occupying space."

just because i am here does not mean i am stuck in the past....i also shoot modern competitive br...nra action pistol, 3 gun....etc, etc......

i shoot some of my mil surplus rifles with cast boolits....but move to modern jacketed hollow point match bullets for serious competition.


there i smore modern knowledge on these boards that stuff from the past...stuff that had no fact, and was proven wrong here....
cast is not past....

mike in co

[StarMetal]

And ALWAYS be wary of what guys put in lube.

Why an idiot once sent me bubble gum for lube to try.

I used it cause it chewed like ****. :grin:

Sure wasn't any automotive products in that bubble lube. If you would have chewed that we'd be rendering your body down for tallow. :kidding:

[StarMetal]

there i smore modern knowledge on these boards that stuff from the past...stuff that had no fact, and was proven wrong here....
cast is not past....

mike in co

Hmmmmm that has a nice ring to it to me for some reason. :Fire:

[Char-Gar]

I have read the pros and cons on this subject and don't really have a position. When I come home from the range, I push a couple of wet patches (Ed's Red) through the bore followed with a dry one. I then put a little Break Free on patch, push it through and put the rifle up.

It will take me three to five rounds before the rifle is back up to peak performance but that doesn't bother me. I just fire five warm up shots before I get serious.

[Doble Troble]

Somewhere here I read a thumbs up for running a patch of thinned Lee Alox down a clean barrel. I've been doing it. I *think* it helps. I'm not willing to stop using it long enough to *prove* it works.

[JeffinNZ]

What's wrong with bullet lube and powder residue for a bore conditioner?

[Three44s]

I have no trouble merging new technology with boolits.

But it's got to work ...... if it does not lay eggs or give milk ...... toss it out!

As I broke in my stainless .44 mag revolvers to lead ....... I did the following:

I polished the internals with USP bore paste everytime I cleaned bore and chambers.

At first, I used Tetra Gun for the final treatment. But I also had encountered CorrosionX at about that same time.

CorrosionX was a game changer!

Three 44s

[crabo]

I have no trouble merging new technology with boolits.

CorrosionX was a game changer!

Three 44s

How so?

[RugerFan]

What's wrong with bullet lube and powder residue for a bore conditioner?

Lots of us doing that. I do a lot of hunting and can't afford "fouling shots." The first shot needs to go in the critters boiler room. I generally don't rod the bore on my hunting irons during the fall unless I get rained on.

[44man]

I have found what works every time. I first clean with Hoppe's when and if I decide to clean and it might be after a years shooting. I dry the bore and use M-Pro 7 to get all the carbon out. It is water based so I flush with hot tap water and dry. A blued gun gets another patch of Hoppe's, then wiped dry. For long storage I put some M-Pro 7 CLP in the bore. Stainless just gets dried and put away.
One shot and the gun is good to go for another year. No magic elixirs, no coatings, no leading, no snake oil.
If a bore is one that can rust, put some good gun oil or CLP in it but wipe dry before shooting.
I don't like Teflon, moly or any other junk.
The saying I love most is a bore needs "seasoned" like a skillet. :mrgreen: Others say it takes 100 rounds before a bore is right----OH MY, where does that come from? Some fellas need a voodoo priestess to bless a gun. :roll:
I shoot once down range then all shots will be in a group. Just need to get rid of slippery.
If I have a clean gun at the start of hunting season I shoot once and never clean again. My guns need to be dirty for hunting. And that is all you need.

[Bass Ackward]

If a bore is one that can rust, put some good gun oil or CLP in it but wipe dry before shooting.
I don't like Teflon, moly or any other junk.


:groner:

You bin drinkin again?

What a bore needs depends on what condition it is in and how your are heating it up or not. Some designs that carry less lube can require a build up or a seasoning. Some loads can require leading too. Hardness plays a big part in that. Shoot rocks and you don't have to deal with that so much.

By the way, CLP has Teflon in it. Next time, read the can before you stick it down range for target practice. :bigsmyl2:

[runfiverun]

clp makes break free and those floaty things are teflon.
if i'm gonna keep a bore wet it's ed's red but it's a continuos wet thing.
and is balanced with the lube. soft lube. [snicker]
a lube starred and antimonially washed bbl is clean and conditioned,why mess it up?

[44man]

:groner:

You bin drinkin again?

What a bore needs depends on what condition it is in and how your are heating it up or not. Some designs that carry less lube can require a build up or a seasoning. Some loads can require leading too. Hardness plays a big part in that. Shoot rocks and you don't have to deal with that so much.

By the way, CLP has Teflon in it. Next time, read the can before you stick it down range for target practice. :bigsmyl2:
CLP means cleaner, lubricant, protectant and M-Pro 7 has NO Teflon. There are many brands, not just one.

[Bass Ackward]

From the WEB site:

Vital to maintaining weapon reliability and performance by removing layers of fouling, embedded carbon, and conditioning the bore to help prevent future build-up.



Significantly cuts cleaning time


Improves accuracy and reliability


Conditions to reduce future fouling


Removes carbon, lead and most copper fouling


Key part there is conditioning the bore. That ain't done with peanut butter.

[44man]

Seasoning is a myth. If all is proper to start, one shot to remove any oil is enough. Lube does not build up and lead should never build up. Anything in the bore should be shot out with the next shot.
Once carbon and a good lube is in the bore, nothing sticks to steel so Moly is a waste and Teflon is not good in any form. I would not apply any of this stuff to a clean bore before shooting anyway.
Lead should never build up and no more lead should come out of a barrel after 500 shots then comes out with the first, done right there will be no lead at all.
Carbon never gets worse either and as far as I can remember, isn't carbon a lubricant?
I HAVE heard of Moly building up with jacketed in rifles and it turned out to be bad and hard to remove. Those moly coated bullets went the way of the Dodo bird.
I don't want ANYTHING packed into my barrel steel.
I slugged my .44 when I bought it at .430". Now at 60,000 heavy loads and uncounted light loads, it still slugs at .430". Uncounted jacketed and cast, can't say how many of each.
Only three things ruin a barrel. Rust, cleaning rods and heat from shooting full auto or hot rifle loads that erode throats from heat. Setting a barrel back still leaves a good bore but full auto means scrap.
Junk put in a barrel is trying to fix a problem that should not exist in the first place.

[44man]

From the WEB site:

Vital to maintaining weapon reliability and performance by removing layers of fouling, embedded carbon, and conditioning the bore to help prevent future build-up.



Significantly cuts cleaning time


Improves accuracy and reliability


Conditions to reduce future fouling


Removes carbon, lead and most copper fouling


Key part there is conditioning the bore. That ain't done with peanut butter.
M-Pro 7 is great and continues to clean as it sits in the bore but the rest is Hype. Hoppe's left in a bore does the same thing.
It is a good product but no fancy claims are needed. The stuff is super just as a CLP.

[44man]

clp makes break free and those floaty things are teflon.
if i'm gonna keep a bore wet it's ed's red but it's a continuos wet thing.
and is balanced with the lube. soft lube. [snicker]
a lube starred and antimonially washed bbl is clean and conditioned,why mess it up?
Break Free makes CLP, not the other way around. I find it works good for lubing my lathe ways. It does not go in my guns barrels but will lube other parts OK.