50-70 sharp 1863

[silverado 38]

Hi everyone,

I'm french and i apologize for my school english.
I have a 1863 sharp new model conversion in 50-70, i've forced a home made lead bullet in the 6 groves barrel to mesure it and it appeared that the barrel is .530". The standard 50-70 size is .515 and i doesn't find any mold in .530" in usualy seller. A freind told me that i can maybe use smaller size minié bullet. Does somebody have resolved a similar probleme.

éric

[EDK]

Your english is fine. My french is via a year in viet nam.

Try shilohrifle.com/forums for some general information. Steve Brooks lathe bores moulds...don't remember his web site...and he could PROBABLY make you a mould in the diameter you need. He's a nice guy and a world class shooter to boot...makes great moulds and custom knives.

There have been some articles on the 1863 cartridge conversions. The arsenal and Sharps Rifle company weren't too picky about dimensions when they converted those war of northern agression (civil war to you yankees!) surplus rifles to 50/70 government.

:Fire::cbpour::redneck:

[Bob S]

Eric,

Are you certain that the chambering is 50-70? I have had a bunch of 50-70's and they all run .512-.515"

The first cartridge conversions of the Sharps carbines was to the No. 56 cartridge, sometimes called 56-52 Spencer, and some of these may have found their way to France during the war with Prussia. The groove diameter that you quote would be appropriate for that cartridge, which was a nominal .535"; it was also the groove diameter for the original Sharps linen cartridge arms, called "52 caliber". The tip-off would be the firing pin ... 56-52 was a rimfire cartridge. A chamber cast would help.

Probably a little known fact ... the barrels on the first Spencers were in fact Sharps cal 52 barrels, provided to Spencer by Robbins and Lawrence. Hence, the first Sharps cartridge conversions didn't require the barrel to be sleeved ... they could use the "Spencer" cartridge simply by chambering for it, with appropriate modifications of the breechblock and provision of an extractor.

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[oldhickory]

Welcome to the family. As stated above, you could have one of the Spencer rimfire conversions. Should be easy to tell by pulling the block and looking at the firing pin position. If so, all is not lost! I'm sure someone can make you a centerfire block for shooting, (you will have to make cases from .50/70's though, we've been doing that to shoot original Spencers here for years).

If I remember right, when the Gov't converted Sharps carbines to .50/70 they re-lined any barrel over .520 and didn't bother with any under that. The lined barrels have 3 groove rifling and can give a good account of themselves on the target range. I've never owned a conversion with the 6 groove barrel, so I can't say about them.

If it is indeed a rimfire conversion, (and you want a shooter) I would sell it and buy a 3 groove .50/70 conversion, (you might make out on the deal since the R-F conversions are rarer). A decent "shooters" grade Sharps conversion here in the states would run around, $2000.00-$3000.00 (American of course) from what I've seen lately.

If your gun is a center fire .50/70 with an over size bore, it could be relined but would reduce it's value being done recently.

[silverado 38]

hi
I comfirme that it is a centerfire bloc moreover i have an original benet 50-70 cartridge and it work perfectly in the chamber.
http://nsm03.casimages.com/img/2010/05/31//mini_1005310900081073566141417.jpg (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1005310900081073566141417.jpg)

http://nsm03.casimages.com/img/2010/05/31//mini_1005310900291073566141419.jpg (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1005310900291073566141419.jpg)

[oldhickory]

I would first try a soft lead boolit of as close to the groove dia. as you can get and load with black powder. See how it works out for you, it may bump the boolit up enough. You may be able to polish out a LEE 50/70 mold...

[rhbrink]

A whole new can of worms but you might take a look at the black powder paperpatch forum you may be able to patch up a boolit to fit. Might save lapping out a mold or new custom mold.

[NickSS]

When the government had the Sharps carbines converted to CF 50-70 they relined bores over a certain diameter. The liners have three grooves. Some of the carbines were not relined as they had tight enough bores for the government. Some times these conversions are known as 52-70s to collectors. They still used to same 50-70 ammo but as the bullets were soft lead and had I believe a hollow base they bumped up and provided adequate accuracy. You can get a custom mold that is .530 but you should check your chamber first as it may not be able to take a shell with a .530 bullet. I would try a 50 cal mini ball type bullet cast from soft lead. That would probably be you best bet.

[shunka]

Greetings Monsiuer Silverado -
I would suggest that you try the Lee Minie 54 Cal. .533-410M #90473
as seen here
http://www.leeprecision.com/html/catalog/blackpow.html

They work well for the U.S. Civil War Re-enactors shooting original percussion 52 Sharps carbines.

good luck -
shunka

[MtGun44]

Pure lead and black powder will do today what it did in the 1800s - bump up undersized
boolits to fit the bore and AMAZING amount.

Bienvenu, monsieur!

Bill