RG4 casting

[kirb]

This one is kicking my butt 314-129 rg4 I have tried every thing I can think of to get this mould to cast, 600 boolit 21 that I would shoot. I have tried 20-1, ww, ww+tin ww+ lino pure and lino all temp from 600 to 800 can’t get fill out around the pin have a hard time getting boolits out of the mould with the high tin and lino and 725 temp I get fining and still no fill out at the pin. I have tried bottom pour pressure and drop, ladle and ladle pressure pour. I have 3 more rg4 on the way if I can't figure this out I need to change my orders. Going to try with the flat nose pins this weekend any help I am like dumbo by name and all ears

Kirb

[LAH]

No clue..............Creeker

[RobS]

Kirb:

I have a 4 cavity hollow point mold and I am using straight WW with it, but it takes a good deal of heat to have it fill out right and have the bullets not stick. I usually cast at 790 to 810 degrees with a multi-cavity, non hollow point aluminum mold, but I work the alloy temp at 900 degrees with the hollow point mold. I open up the mold on its side while at the same time working the handles hinge pin/bolt as I open it and this has made it easier to get the bullets to release. It takes me longer to unload this mold vs a non hollow point one so my casting cycle rate is slower and is why I have to cast at a hotter alloy temp.

I also preheat my mold on a hot plate to around the casting temp or real close to it anyway so this may be of help too. It is what works for me, but I've found that casting with a 4 cavity hollow point mold has its challenges, but I figured them out fairly well and can manage a good casting rate with it now.

[Bret4207]

I'm not following all the OP, "600 boolit 21 ?", but it sounds like your mould is cool. Pot temp and mould temp are 2 different things. Cast faster. Every second the mould is empty it's cooling.

[RobS]

Brett:

I agree that mold temp and alloy temp are two different things.........he is having a hard time getting the bullets to release thus making more time in between each drop. He needs to heat up the alloy so his mold temp comes up has casting with one of these molds takes longer for the bullets to drop. It is much different working one of these molds vs a non hollow point one.

[RobS]

I'm not following all the OP, "600 boolit 21 ?", but it sounds like your mould is cool. Pot temp and mould temp are 2 different things. Cast faster. Every second the mould is empty it's cooling.


I think he means he cast 600 bullets and he would only shoot 21 of them as he is not satisfied with the fill out etc.

[dragonrider]

Two things that have always worked for me is "lapping" and "heat". Lap your mold and bring your heat up to 900. To lap it, remove the sprue plate, it will get in the way, and center an 5/16ths nut over the cavity, eyeball it as close as you can. Pour lead through the nut until it reached the top. let it cool, remove the casting and do another, repeat until you have four. These casting are now your laps, use one for each cavity. Coat with a fine lapping compound, insert into the mold and turn it repeatedly with whatever means you have, a wrench, drill with a nut driver turning slowly. When you first put the compound coated boolit in then mold, the mold will not close, keep light even pressure on the handle as you rrotate the lap and it will close. When done clean in hot water with dish soad and a scrub brush. put it back together and try it out.

[RobS]

kirb:

here is another link although it takes a bit of time before people realize that the original poster's mold was a multi cavity hollow point mold. Towards the bottom of the thread there are some other suggestions.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=83827&highlight=RG4

[RobS]

Two things that have always worked for me is "lapping" and "heat". Lap you mold and bring your heat up to 900.

+1 on the lapping, I had to do the same thing with my 4 cavity HP mold too. I mentioned 900 degrees as well since my casting speed changed (slowed down).

[Trapshooter]

After trying everything else I could think of, I've had success sometimes from smoking the mold with a Bic lighter. Not a heavy coat of soot, just a fine surface coating. Seems to work better on a cold or cool mold, before it's up to temperature.

Trapshooter

[Wayne Smith]

Given that the problem is mold fill out around the pins and everything else he has tried I would suggest starting with pre-heating the mold making sure that the pins are preheated. Any time you put down the mold put it on the heating element. Problems with fillout around the pins with adequate tin in the mix are almost always a result of cold pins, not a cold mold.

[RobS]

Problems with fillout around the pins with adequate tin in the mix are almost always a result of cold pins, not a cold mold.

Yes this is true if you are talking about a pull pin hollow point mold...........................now when you preheat multi cavity HP mold to get the hollow point pins hot??? You are actually just bringing the entire mold up to temp. There is no way with this style of mold that the hollow point pins are going to be at a higher temp without the mold being a higher temp as well for the hollow point pins are essentially part of the mold. So if the pins are cold and a person wants to get the pins hotter then the mold will come up to a warmer temp too. The mold is not like a pull pin hollow point mold not even close other than the fact thay make a hollow point in the bullet.

Two of us have worked these molds and we both suggest adjusting the temp (ironically we suggested the exact same 900 degrees) at a hotter than normal alloy temp so the mold and pins retain a casting temp that allows the bullets to come out as intended. Now that is what works for us and we both have worked a pesky mold like what the original poster has and with similar issues that he is having.

FWIW

[kirb]

Thanks Guy I will kick the temp up. I have had it to 800 will go up to 900 see if that will help thanks for the advice and help.

Kirb

[ph4570]

First session I had fill out issues until I got the mold good and hot. Alloy was 775 degrees and was clip-on WW with a pinch of tin. The next session began by heating the mold on a hot plate. That resulted in good fill out after a couple of casts. My mold is a 4 cav 360-180.

So, +1 on preheating mold.

[Char-Gar]

Check the size of the hole in the spru cutter through which the alloy is poured. I have had "issues" with more than one SAECO molds due to this. If that is the case, open up hole with a drill and deburr.

[Hickory]

Two things that have always worked for me is "lapping" and "heat". Lap your mold and bring your heat up to 900. To lap it, remove the sprue plate, it will get in the way, and center an 5/16ths nut over the cavity, eyeball it as close as you can.

Kirb;
The above treatment is unnessary. I would not try this procedure and only as a last resort. The only problem I have had with my mould is the boolit sticking to the hollow point pin.
I have the same mould in a 2 cavity. The trick is getting it hot enough
I leave mine setting on the pot for quite a while (about 10 full minutes) before casting.
I have also removed the hollow point pins and polished them with some 600 grit wet/dry sand paper, you can get this from a automotive store. This helps the boolit to fall off the pin, you can coat the end of the pin with the sprue plate lube that came with your mould. When using the sprue plate lube, a little is a lot.

[crabo]

Kirb, did you ever try the flatnose pins?

[Hickory]

I think Kirb is out casting.
I don't see where he is on line.

[Blammer]

I lightly smoked my pins with a match or butane lighter and they dropped right off and out.

[Dale53]

I have not had serious drop off problems with my MiHec hollow point Cramer Style moulds but others have. I did try some NEI mold release and it worked beautifully. I definitely recommend that for hollow point pins of whatever make.

FWIW
Dale53

[kirb]

Flat nose pins work fine cast and shoot very well in 3 different firearms. Tomorrow after noon I should have time to work on the pins chuck them up in the lathe and give them a spin. Thanks for the help guys the input will be used. like I said better make them work have a couple more on the way.

Kirb

[Blammer]

before you spin up any parts try this.

get the mould hot, preheat, get lead hot

open mould with sprue on the top. Close the mould with sprue on the top, then try to cast.

Always turn the sprue to the top of the mould THEN close it, then pour.

I usually have to wait to a count of 4 or so until the sprue hardens, then wait 5 or so seconds more then crack the sprue, turn mould upside down, open and tap out boolits.

This is important, turn the mould until the spue plate is on the top THEN close the mould. This will let the pins settle to the bottom, not extending them too far into the HP cavity where they may have flat sides and hang up the boolit for release.

That's what I would do.

[JesterGrin_1]

I have the 44/444 300GR HP Mold by MiHIC or something like that. But as the others have said the mold has to be HOT Also if you use a bottom pour pot do not direct the stream straight into the sprue hole but hit just inside the opening of the sprue plate and let the lead swirl in. This worked great for me after 60LBS of trying lol.

[crabo]

I did two things. The first was to deburr the slot where the pins go. That allows the pins to move freely. I also apply a little Bullplate to the slot and pin heads. I also put a single drop of bullplate on my q-tip and coat the pins with it when they are hot.

It also sometimes helps to open the mold, let it cool for a few seconds, then drop the bullets out of the mold. It allows the boolits to shrink just a little before you hit your hinge pin.

[Cord]

I had a lot of trouble with the MiHec .41 Brass Cramers releasing from the pins.

I chucked the pins up in my drill press, and used 0000 steel wool to gently
polish them, but when I looked at them through my 16x jeweler’s loupe I saw
that the steel wool was making very tiny rings of different sizes around the pins,
I think it’s because the wool is bunched up unevenly in the form of a pad.

Starting over with a new set of pins, I ripped some soft pine into ¾ x ¾ sticks
18” long and used contact cement on the smooth sides to attach emery paper
in 240, 360, 480 and 600 grits, making "polishing sticks."

This worked much better, and the sticks keep my hands away from the chuck,
I just gently hold the stick against the taper, move down and roll it over the tip of the pin.
I also move the stick sideways to feed fresh paper to the pin, kind of like a gentle stropping.

Then I went to an automotive paint supply shop and for .92 each bought ½ sheets of
even finer emery paper in 1000, 1500, and 2000 grit and made sticks of those.

I finish off with a strip of old T-shirt smeared with white automotive polishing
compound, but I don’t think it’s really necessary.

The end result is a mirror finish, and the rounded tips look like a cat’s eye gemstone.
At the proper high heat, I just roll the mould over and the boolits drop off the pins.

It wasn’t hard at all and I think the pins are still almost identical and remain at
the large size, and same taper profile, that 45 2.1 designed them to be. YMMV.

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