Newbie question...Staightt WW boolits made-whoops?

[squirrellnuttz]

Hey all,


I just got my new (used) casting gear. I went a little western on the casting on the first day. I started up just playing with my new stuff and ended up casting 350-400 .357 dia. 124 gr. boolits destined for a 9mm. Also a batch (around 150) of 160 gr. Lee .312 boolits (Destined for low velocity 1000-1100 fps. .303 loads). All out of unalloyed WheelWeight material.Temp set at 750 f. Lyman mould, supposed to cast a .357 boolit @ 121gr. #2 alloy.

So, now what? Because I added no tin to the mix, should I throw them back, cast and release? Or heat treat and quench them and go ahead and lube, size, load, and use them?

This was my first on my own batch of cast anything, so any advice would be appreciated. Love this site. Tons of info.

[Daddyfixit]

I use straight WW for my 9mm's and 38's with no problems. I haven't cast for rifle yet

[Suo Gan]

Assuming you have the right size boolits, I'd shootem! If you look at what the big boys are doing at the CBA, most of em are shooting ww at the mathces. Personally I cut mine 50/50 with pure, and add 2% tin and then water drop them. They run about 17 bhn. A heavier boolit suits me fine. For hunting use I air cool them, or anneal the heads with the base in a pan of water. And they don't have to be low velocity if you are using a gas check should be able to go well over 2000 fps with no trouble.

If you have not slugged the bore of your 303 (Brit?) I would do so BEFORE going to the range. Most Brits have grooves well above what you will get from your mold.

[littlejack]

Squirrllnutzz:
Welcome to the Castboolits.
There is absolulutly nothing wrong with straight ww metal. The addition of tin if you want/need, is only to help fill out the mould cavity. I've cast and shot many, many thousands of ww boolits and have never water dropped, or heat treated any. For handgun, I see no need at all. If you have good cavity fillout and the boolits look good, they ARE good. Cast away and start shootin.
Jack

[squirrellnuttz]

Thanks for the responses, guys. greatly appreciated. My boolits filled out very well, of course there were a few that ended up back in the pot due to wrinkles (mold not up to temp?) some pinholes in bases ( I think I had the sprue plate a little too close to the bottom pour spout)

I'm thinking of using gas checks on the .312 boolits. i have a bunch, and they do fit on the base of that particular design. However, Sicne I'm using these in a .303, I want at least a .312. i have no sizer as yet for this, and haven't yet slugged my barrel. So I think I will use them as plain base low velocity to start.

ANother question- I've never used a Lee sizer before, only a Lyman type- would a Lee type sizer kit crimp on a Hornady gas check onto a bullet (Lee) that was designed for a gas check? I think it should, but am new to this and don't know.

[303Guy]

squirrellnuttz

Firstly, good to have you aboard!:drinks:

Secondly, one has to remember that the 303 (Brit?) is female! You have to pamper her in all sorts of strange and illogical ways to get her to perform for you. But perform she will.

So, is it a 303 Brit? Which one do you have? How is the bore? Is it a two groove?

For shooting a gas check design boolit without the gas check, you might improve your odds with a heavy coating of waxy-lube. At least a wax wad in the form of the boolit base being dipped into molten wax to form a wad of sorts. And if it doesn't help it will at least lube your bore.

Do you have a means of capturing fired boolits? It helps to see what's happening but is not always so easy.

:drinks:

[Suo Gan]

The Lee sizer will seat the gas check. But a gas check will not cure an improper boolit to bore fit. I highly recommend that you slug it before you shoot it as it does not take much time and or specialized equipment. Assuming you have a micrometer or even a set of calipers, a soft faced mallet a wood dowel and a spare five minutes. I am not a SMLE expert by any stretch, but the one that I owned had a groove diameter of .315. To put it simply it will probably save you time and money (driving to the range and fees) to just slug it and then you know. In my Mosins (312") I have used 314299 and SAECO 305 and got good results. If it is beyond .313-.314 you will either have to get a custom fat thirty mold, lap your current mold (I have not had good success here and it takes a loooong time), or Beagle a few thousandths with foil tape. The reason you can shoot .312 jacks out of a larger bore with accuracy (mostly) is because it is made of harder metal that is able to grip the rifling. With a 'small' lead alloy boolit, the boolit will twist in the bore and sheer off alloy causing the boolit to skid down the bore and hot gases will blowby the small boolit, coating the bore ahead of each fired boolit with a fine mist of lead particles, that are nicely flattened into the grooves by the passing boolit. Then when you look down your bore and see you have no visible rifling you will proclaim that lead alloy boolits lead your bore!!

[squirrellnuttz]

Picked up a couple of soft lead egg sinker at Wally World this afternoon- and slugging is going to happen later this evening. Oh, and it's a jungle carbine (minty).

[squirrellnuttz]

Ok, so now I've attempted to slug my barrel. I'm running into a bit of an issue. I had a bunch of the above mentioned .312 boolits, so i fattened one up by piching it tin a vice to .320, it only went in the muzzle 1/2", lead piled up behind. I tried this several times with several boolits, I squished one to .315, tried again. 3/4'' in and stop. Tried one unsquished @ .312, almost all the way in, and mushroomed lead stopped it about 1/8" from fully entering bore.
I must have broken about 20 4" pieces of dowel trying to start these slugs on their way.
So I found a piece of O buckshot .320 to start. Shazzam all the way through.

Now the fun part. This barrel has 5 grooves. I put my digital caliper on one groove mark on the bottom, and directly opposite my bottom caliper jaw on the top side there is only a land mark, measuring this way it says my bore is .309 i'm only getting to measure on groove mark + 1 land mark. Anybody got an idea how to get my proper bore size from this?

I've tried rolling the jaws to catch both groove marks, but I'm getting measurements from .308-.314. Weirdness.

[Suo Gan]

Well, The easiest way might be to have a machine shop measure it with their V mike. There used to be a fellow at the CBA that did this for free, but I do believe he is retired now. Not sure if anyone has filled his shoes. There are various and sundry ways of doing it with po mans tools. Look here:http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=9243&highlight=measuring+groove+barrels

[squirrellnuttz]

Hey thanks for the reply Suo Gan. Appreciated.
And also thanks a bunch to all you fellas who replied to my questions, and for the welcome to the forum here. It's a heck of a pool of knowledge on the subject.
Good to be here.

[Three44s]

According to Marshal Stanton of Beartooth Bullets you could send your slugs to them and they would measure them.

Three 44s

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Did you Lube the barrel or the slug ?

to measure a slug from a barrel with an odd number of grooves:
tightly wrap the slug with one layer of aluminum pop can metal.
measure, then subtract the twice the thickness of the aluminum pop can metal.
Jon

[63 Shiloh]

I have had a few 'Jungle Carbines' or MK 5's over the years.

The best thing I did for an improvement in accuracy was to ( and this may offend purists!) remove the cone flash suppressor.

I also placed a strip of rubber from a car floor mat about 3cm wide, 6cm long and 3mm thick under the barrel; its just short of the front lower fore grip.

In regard to bore diameter, I have SMLE's with bores as large as .318", slugging the bore will will give you the measurement needed. Hopefully its within range of not needing a custom mold.

Good luck!

[squirrellnuttz]

I had lubed the barrel with a healthy dose of fluid film prior to starting slugging.

63 Shiloh, thanks for the accuracy tip! Just getting to know this old girl...I've only put jacketed rds. through her so far.

Of course I went and bought a .312 Lee mold, prior to slugging. gonna try beagling it....won't go as is.

[WHITETAIL]

squirrellnutz, Welcome to the forum!
And ask away.
The guys and gals here are great.:veryconfu

[fredj338]

It's tought to slug w/ a WW alloy bullet. Try a slightly oversized, pure lead slug, lubricated w/ Imperial or other good lube.

[frkelly74]

Personally, I would load up a few as cast with the gas checks held on by liquid alox and shoot them just to see. Yes they all come off when fired, I think of them as sabots. If it doesn't work well then go to all the trouble to find out what is going on. Your slugging indicates that your bore is not real oversize. Have some fun, if you feel that the bullet is undersize after trying a few ( don't load up hundreds at first ) then Beagle some a little. Beagling Is probably the most useful technique I have picked up here so far, It is so low tech and practical that I wish I had thought of it. And Like I said , HAVE FUN!