Need opinions on a 8 lb. powder purchase

[zardoz]

Hello to all:

I've got two rifle cartridges I would like to simplify on powder choice. I'm not a benchrest shooter by any means, but I desire a good combination of flexibility, performance, and of course accuracy. As with any choice like this, there are trade-offs which I am prepared to consider.

One is the .223 Remington, and the other is the .308 Winchester.

For the .223, I want to stay with JHP in the 55 to 69 grain area. No cast.

For the .308, I want to stay in the range of 150 to 180 grain JHP, and then some 180 grain cast boolits.

Another criteria is loading data from Lyman books, and the Lee cast boolit loads.

Right, I've sort of narrowed down my choice to either BLC2 or Varget as probably being the best to cover the above range with the most flexibility.

Which would be the best in your opinion, or are there other powders that could apply to the above selection criteria. If so, why (in a nutshell)?

Thanks for any advice on this. I'm mainly a pistol loader, and have a wide range of the faster powders for those. I don't want to get into a situation of having two dozen different rifle powders, each specific to a certain best load. Would rather have an 8 lb. keg of one rifle powder, and go from there.

[jonk]

I've had good luck with BLC2 in both cartridges, though I've never used it for cast.

[izzyjoe]

blc-2 and varget are both good powders,but i think something like imr4895 will serve you well,as whould 3031,4064,4320. all these cover both cals.very well. so many choices so little time. lol:razz:

[Doc Highwall]

I use Varget for match shooting for both my 223 Rem and 308 Win out to 1000 yards. I use 25 grains with a Sierra 80 gr and Fed 205M primers in the 223 Rem and 46.5 grains with a Sierra 155 gr and Fed 210M in the 308 Win. For cast I am using AA5744.

[wiljen]

I really like 3031 in the cartridges you mention although I will admit stick powders are fun to load in the .223 due to the neck size. If I had to pick between the two I'd go varget as I always found it less persnickety than BLC-2. Ball C-2 will create some fantastic loads, but miss it by .1 grain on either side and it goes to ****.

[c3d4b2]

Reloader 15 is also on option if Varget is hard to come by.

[Lloyd Smale]

335 or benchmark or aa2230 will do fine with both

[jmsj]

I wanted to do the same thing in the same calibers about 15 years ago. I too was shooting only jacketed bullets back then. The two guns I was loading for had 20" barrels or less, I found Winchester 748 to work out the best for me. A .223 Rem. Savage tactical and Savage 99 both shot sub MOA. Plus the two Winchesters I have like Winchester748 for the Speer 130gr. flat point. jmsj

[zardoz]

Thanks for the replies.

I was leaning towards Varget, but looks like that one is going to be tough to get right now.

I like Alliant powders for a lot of my pistol loadings, and have a pound of Reloader 15 I had purchased for some trial .223 rounds with heavier jacketed. I did not see any of the cast boolit loadings on .308 for that powder though, like there was with BLC2 and Varget in the Lee manual.

335 is listed though in Lee cast section, but loadings for it seem to be missing for .308 jacketed above 150grain weight in the Lyman book. There are several jacketed loads in the Lee book for the .308.

Best I look at some of the manufacturers data to round this out.

OK, I'll grind all this through the brain mill for awhile, and see what pans out in the availability arena. Not an urgent need, but I do want to make a decision I can live with for 8 lbs.

[MtGun44]

W748 is great in both, meters like water.

Bill

[No_1]

Call the manufacturer and see what they have to say. The have tons of load data on hand. I have done this many times before when I could not find published load data.

Robert

[Lloyd Smale]

I agree. I left that one out because its the same thing as 335. Varget is a good powder but i quit fooling with it because it doesnt meter real well using a progressive press. QUOTE=MtGun44;896514]W748 is great in both, meters like water.

Bill[/QUOTE]

[MtGun44]

I don't think that H335 is exactly the same as W748. H414 is the same as W760, IIRC, but
I don't think that Hodgdon has an 'exact same' for W748. BLC2 and H335 are very close
to each other and fairly close to W748, but I almost certain that Hodgdon doesn't market
a version of W748. Of course, they DO market the real Win 748, since they market all
Winchester powders these days. Any of these ball powders will meter well and work well
in the two calibers specified. The deal would be which could you get an 8 lb keg cheaper?

Bill

[parrott1969]

Accurate 2520 is pretty decent in 223 and excellent in 308

[Uncle R.]

I don't think that H335 is exactly the same as W748. H414 is the same as W760, IIRC, but
I don't think that Hodgdon has an 'exact same' for W748. BLC2 and H335 are very close
to each other and fairly close to W748, but I almost certain that Hodgdon doesn't market
a version of W748. Of course, they DO market the real Win 748, since they market all
Winchester powders these days. Any of these ball powders will meter well and work well
in the two calibers specified. The deal would be which could you get an 8 lb keg cheaper?

Bill

H335 is certainly different but I've long thought that BL-C2 was 748. I don't have any inside information on it though...

[Lloyd Smale]

Ive found blc 2 to be slower then either. What has to be kept in mind is lot to lot variations of any of the three. As far as what your looking for any of the three will work fine. I personaly do like 748 a bit better. I think because less of it was sold then 335 that there was less changes in lots and its been the most consistant over the years.

[RU shooter]

Another vote for reloader 15 ,I too have shot both cartridges with the bullet weights you listed and have nothing but good results.,My rifles seemed to care for it more than Varget, and meters alot better.

[excess650]

Neither BLC2 or H335 are the same as WW748. I had used all 3 in a Rem 700VS 223.

[MtGun44]

I use much more W748 than the others, altho I just bought a bunch of surplus WC844
that is supposed to be close to BLC2, not had time to try it yet.

Bill

[zardoz]

I see a fairly good deal on 8 lbs. of WC846 on the Hi-Tech ammo site, and it mentions that it will cross-reference with BLC2 and W748. Hmm.

It also indicates that WC844 will cross reference with H335.

Both are pull down from Israeli ammo. Is this something that would be advisable, or should I steer clear of this sort of thing? No telling how old the stuff is, or in what condition.

W748 looks to be very good for my intended purpose, and is available. I could get it cheaper looks like, by buying 8 lbs. at Powder Valley, and paying HazMat and shipping, than a nearby vendor plus their mark-up plus my gasoline. CCI large rifle primers seem to be a good price there as well, available, and they will ship powder and primers on the same HazMat I have found.

Decisions, decisions.

[7of7]

Accurate 2520 is pretty decent in 223 and excellent in 308

Works very nice in my Weatherby 30.06... 45 gr, and it is shoving them out at 2779 fps, with very good groups... if I could hold it in the same place... (my trigger isn't to smooth..) I would end up placing the bullets about 3/4 inch apart... one on one side of the line on the target, and the other on the other side of the line on the target... just couldn't seem to hold on the line when it fired.. They were going right where they were supposed to... as I remember what I was looking at when I fired..

[ETG]

Blc2 and WC846 load the same. Went through 16 pounds of WC846 with no problems in 223, 308, and 3006. Varget is almost impossible to find - been waiting for almost a year for the 8 pound jugs to be available. Now I'm using H4895 with good results. Not sure about cast as I haven't loaded any yet.

[ETG]

I see a fairly good deal on 8 lbs. of WC846 on the Hi-Tech ammo site, and it mentions that it will cross-reference with BLC2 and W748. Hmm.

It also indicates that WC844 will cross reference with H335.

Both are pull down from Israeli ammo. Is this something that would be advisable, or should I steer clear of this sort of thing? No telling how old the stuff is, or in what condition.

W748 looks to be very good for my intended purpose, and is available. I could get it cheaper looks like, by buying 8 lbs. at Powder Valley, and paying HazMat and shipping, than a nearby vendor plus their mark-up plus my gasoline. CCI large rifle primers seem to be a good price there as well, available, and they will ship powder and primers on the same HazMat I have found.

Decisions, decisions.

I've bought a lot of powder from Hi-Tech - never had a problem. As far as age, I'm still using powder I bought in the mid 70s.

[wiljen]

I use much more W748 than the others, altho I just bought a bunch of surplus WC844
that is supposed to be close to BLC2, not had time to try it yet.

Bill

My 844 is a good bit faster than Blc-2 so be careful with that assumption.

[357maximum]

BLC2/H335/W748 are very close to the same powder chemically, but each powder has it's own amount of "deterrent" on it and varying amounts of graphite which may or may not be the same as the deterrent.

[Wireman134]

My 7.62mm Tanker Garand likes AA2230C, said to be similar to AA2460. Also WC846. Both excellent ball powders cheaper than Win. & Hodgdon commercial.

[MtGun44]

Thanks wilgen, but that was just a brain fade on my part. I have some W844 and it is great,
but I MEANT to type W846T that is close to BLC2. I have been using the W844 in 5.56 loads and
getting really good results. Have not had much time to try out the W846T yet.

My bad.

Bill

[leadman]

I use Wc845 in my 223, and my 6.5TCU. Works real well.

I also use H4895 for 223, 25-35, 30-30, 7.65X53, and 30-06 with jacketed and cast. Hodgdon states that the max listed load of H4895 can be reduced by 60% so this gives it a very wide loading range.

AA2520 works well with jacketed but I have not used it for cast.

[bdutro]

Nobody has said anything about Ramshot TAC or IMR 8208?

Wow.

[iron brigade]

i just picked up 8lbs of imr4895 for my howa 308 heavy. rifle likes varget, but it was 2.00 more a lb. loaded some up and it meters excellent. will see how it shoots today.

[scb]

I use BLC2 for both. Meters very consistently (as I'm sure others probably do) in my progressive loader. Started using it back when it was cheap.

[StarMetal]

The 844 I had was very much like H335.

[fryboy]

Blc2 and WC846 load the same. Went through 16 pounds of WC846 with no problems in 223, 308, and 3006. Varget is almost impossible to find - been waiting for almost a year for the 8 pound jugs to be available. Now I'm using H4895 with good results. Not sure about cast as I haven't loaded any yet.

HODVARG-08 * HODGDON VARGET - 8 LBS. (in stock) Yes $135.50

http://www.powdervalleyinc.com/

i scan that site twice a week ( for good reason) i posted it on another site that i usually hang out at too lolz

[Lloyd Smale]

ive found tac to be very close to 846/blc2. Exterminator is close to 2230.
Nobody has said anything about Ramshot TAC or IMR 8208?

Wow.