Bulgarian Makarov

[ke7chv]

I am relatively new to handguns, and am looking to buy my first. Due to economic influence, I've instinctively looked for the cheapest. Currently for my consideration is the Bulgarian Makarov 9x18. Ammunition being readily available at $110/500rds for 95gr, is the additional selling point. But as always, I wanted some other opinions before purchasing. Also for consideration is a Czech CZ-82 Makarov, also in 9x18.

[.357]

i loved my mak! i cannot more highly reccomend it, buy all the mags you can find!

[mike in co]

i loved my mak! i cannot more highly reccomend it, buy all the mags you can find!

there are four guns you should consider.

the bulg mak

the polish p83

the cz 82

and the p64

all are 9mak

the p64 is 8 plus 1 i think,
the bul mak is 8 plus 1
the cz is 12 plus one going from memory( too lazy to pick mine up and count)
and the p64 is 6 plus 1

bulg mak is about 260,
the p83 is 230 i think....
the p64 is 160
and the cz can be as low as 190

all shoot he 9mak round wich is potentially 10% more powder than a 380


mike in co

AND WHY IS THIS IN THE RIFLE SECTION ??

[garandsrus]

The PA-63 is a great little Mak pistol also. It is almost a clone of a Walther PP. A year or so ago the price was $95. Now it's up to about $180.

John

[223tenx]

Just don't assume all that shoot a 9x18 Mak parts are interchangeable because they are not. Only the original Makarovs are. For instance the Czech is not an original Makarov. There is a lot of info on Gunboards.com forums. There is even a Makarov forum. I'll agree that the P-64 is a neat little carry pistol ( I carried one for two years while I worked at Makarov.Com), but the operative word is little. It's a hand stinger and usually has a pretty strong double action trigger pull. Shoot one before you buy it if you can.

[excess650]

A 9x18 Bulgarian Makarov is a MILITARY RIFLE?

[mike in co]

Just don't assume all that shoot a 9x18 Mak parts are interchangeable because they are not. Only the original Makarovs are. For instance the Czech is not an original Makarov. There is a lot of info on Gunboards.com forums. There is even a Makarov forum. I'll agree that the P-64 is a neat little carry pistol ( I carried one for two years while I worked at Makarov.Com), but the operative word is little. It's a hand stinger and usually has a pretty strong double action trigger pull. Shoot one before you buy it if you can.


more like none...

the p64 is easily tamed with a haevier recoil and lighter main spring..available from wolf gun springs.

i have three set up that way, two have the firing spring from the kit.

what he said does apply to the p63..with an alloy frame...not much fun.

my suggestions were based on his desires for an inexpensive hand gun with inexpensive ammo.

three of the guns are cheaper than the bulg mak...but shoot the same inexpensive ammo.

i did not see anyone suggestion the guns were interchangable..........

mike in co

[dualsport]

I'll add one to the list, a Firestorm .380. Neat little gun, a little more money, and no cheap surplus ammo though. I'll admit I haven't shot mine yet, 10 day waiting period, but I really liked the feel and trigger better than the milsurps I tried.

[223tenx]

We had people come in daily looking for "Polish, Czech, etc "parts for their Makarov. Just stating a common misconception that if it shoots the 9x18 it's a Makarov.

[mike in co]

[QUOTE=223tenx;887643]We had people come in daily looking for "Polish, Czech, etc "parts for their Makarov. Just stating a common misconception that if it shoots the 9x18 it's a Makarov.[/QUOTE


no one said you had to be intelligent to buy a gun..........



i would not compare the average gun owner to people on these forums.


i would say most of US know what we have.



mike in co

[doubs43]

There's a loaded Bulgarian Makarov within 12 inches of my keyboard as I type this; I've had it for a number of years and it's a fine handgun. It's loaded with Blazer Gold-Dot hollow points. It's frequently my carry piece when I do carry. I can highly recommend it.

I also have a CZ-82 that I like and I don't think you can go wrong with either. Those in VG or better condition are still in the $200 range.

While not as common - or as inexpensive - as the Bulgarian Mak, if you can find an East German Makarov, you'll have the best Makarov ever made IMO. Once as easy to find as the Bulgarian Mak is today, the E. German Maks are being horded by their owners because they are such fine pistols. Should you be lucky enough to stumble across one, jump on it!

[223tenx]

Well Mike, If my post keeps one person from making that mistake then I feel justified in posting. No offense intended to anyone on this board.

[9.3X62AL]

<------Proud and happy owner of an East German Makarov. GREAT pocket pistol, basically The Walther PP From Hell.

[azrednek]

I partial to the CZ-82, love mine but haven't had much luck shooting cast with it yet. I can get some respectable groups shooting the low cost steel cased ammo I pay about $11.00 per box for. I'm also fond of my Polish P-64, especially liked the low price from J&G. The double action trigger on my P-64 borders on ridicules but the trigger in the single action mode is nice. J&G offers spring kits to reduce the double action pull but i believe they are currently on back order.

If price is a big factor in your selection and you don't have allot of experience with a handgun. Take a peek at the surplus S&W 38 Special revolvers on J&G's website. I've bought two of the S&W's. Both showed considerable holster wear but they appeared to not have been shot very much.

I have to admit I have the advantage of being with in driving distance of J&G's warehouse. When buying long distance it is always a **** shoot when dealing with surplus goods. You might or might not get a good one. If you consider buying from J&G, call them during the week. Their show room is packed on weekends and the sales people are rushed and not very generous with their time. During the week they are a little more laid back and don't mind spending a little time with you on the phone.

http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php/handguns/polish/p/polish-p64-9x18-makarov-double-action-walther-ppk-style-very-good-condition/cPath/16_385/products_id/2453

[Multigunner]

For all those who have Makarovs, PP or PPK Walthers, Bersa 380 and similar pocket size autos I suggest to look into the Crosman imported Walther brand PPKS CO2 powered 177 BB gun.
I'd bought one for use as a film prop due to its realistic blowback slide action (we add muzzle blast and report using CGI) and found it an excellent little bakyard plinker with much the same feel, including recoil, as the real pocket autos of the same general size.

The controls aren't quite the same, its single action rather than double action and the safety is not in the same place, but otherwise makes a pretty good trainer for introducing non shooters to handling a pocket auto for self defense.

I picked up and East German Mak holster to keep mine in, its a pretty good fit.

[StarMetal]

For all those who have Makarovs, PP or PPK Walthers, Bersa 380 and similar pocket size autos I suggest to look into the Crosman imported Walther brand PPKS CO2 powered 177 BB gun.
I'd bought one for use as a film prop due to its realistic blowback slide action (we add muzzle blast and report using CGI) and found it an excellent little bakyard plinker with much the same feel, including recoil, as the real pocket autos of the same general size.

The controls aren't quite the same, its single action rather than double action and the safety is not in the same place, but otherwise makes a pretty good trainer for introducing non shooters to handling a pocket auto for self defense.

I picked up and East German Mak holster to keep mine in, its a pretty good fit.

I have the Walther BB pistol as you mention, but mine is identical in detail to my real Walthers.

[Dutchman]

I'm sorry that the East German Makarovs are no longer the $120 that I paid for this one. At the time the Bulgarian Maks were, I think, $95 and they couldn't give them away because the Bulgarian Maks weren't C&R while the East German Maks were C&R so the EG Maks were selling like gangbusters. Even though these EG Maks were *used* they weren't used much as everybody knows there's no crime in a communist utopia.

Real funny story goes with this.

Bought from AIM in Ohio for $120. They shipped FedEx. I get a telephone call from the Indiana State Prison. They say they have a parcel that was mistakenly delivered to them by FedEx and would I come over and get it. The prison was on DNR land on 500 North. I lived on 600 North and across the state hiway about 2 miles. I immediately thought oh sh*t as the Mak was the only package I was expecting.. except AIM was supposed to ship 2 boxes of S&B 9x18mm in a separate package so I wasn't exactly sure which package was delivered to the prison.

I go over dressed in bib overall as it's rural Indiana and I look like a rural bumpkin (rural camouflage). I walk into the warden's office and they're all standing there looking at me, very somber. The warden hands me a package that was opened and I stick my hand in to see what's in there. Oops.. its the Makarov. I said "that must've been exciting", but nobody thought that it was funny.. like I did. The FedEx delivery driver had been called back to the prison by radio and was sitting there sweating bricks. I slapped him on the back and said "all's well that ends well", and we walked out.

I bought one of the amorer's spare parts kits that has just about everything but the frame and slide and the black leather EG police holster and one of the new rain pattern EG military holsters, which is very nice, btw. And at the next Indianapolis gunshow I bought 1,000 rds of East German FMJ from Cole's for about 8 cents a round.

Did I mention: I love my Mak!

http://images16.fotki.com/v29/photos/2/28344/157842/mak2-vi.jpg

[jim4065]

I hear they throw the empties to hell and gone - so does anybody re-load for these?

[Multigunner]

I have the Walther BB pistol as you mention, but mine is identical in detail to my real Walthers.

On mine the safety is on the grip behind the trigger, the slide mounted safety is non operational and cosmetic only.
The Grips is longer than that of the PPK, more like the PP model.

Theres a much better detailed Walther airgun, based on one of the large frame pistols. These are almost indistinguishable from the real thing.

I just remembered that for awhile there were CO2 powered Makarov BB guns available , these were made from actual Makarov frames and slides and many of the internal parts.
Not sure but I think these used a lead BB and rifled bore. I don't know if they ever imported these. At about the same time a CO2 powered replica of the AK47 was marketed using demilled AK47 rifles or parts.

Dutchman
My holster is like yours only an oxblood brown.
It was unissued and in new condition.
These fit quite an array of pistols of this general size range.

[Gee_Wizz01]

I hear they throw the empties to hell and gone - so does anybody re-load for these?

A lot of us reload for them! Just look at the MAK mold group buys. The do chunk their emptys, but; no worse than any other blowback pistol. I bought some Starline Mak brass years ago, but now I just trim down 9mm brass in my case trimmer. My reloads are more accurate than anything I can buy.


G

[jim4065]

Maybe they're not as bad as the CZ52 then. Mine throws the empties at least 10 yards, if not 20, and through a 45 degree cone. I quit reloading for it. :groner:

[beemer]

It does throw the brass into the neighbor's yard, and my neighbor is not next door. Wolf makes heavier recoil springs for the Makarov, between that and lighter reloads I can sometimes find them.
Dave

[Tony65x55]

I have 2 Bulgarians, an East German, a Russian and a Chinese Mak. I guess you can tell I love 'em. One of the worlds GREAT pistols, IMHO. My East German, with a handload of AA#2 under a Lyman cast bullet will group all day 1" at 25 yards. If only I could hold it that well but I have no problem keeping in the 9 ring. With a full power load of AA#5 under the Hornady hollow point, it will achieve velocities I'm reluctant to mention. Never had a FTF or FTE. Perfect functioning and I've bet my life on it.

Virtually anyone that has ever owned one knows their reliability is flawless. While the world's shooting media has always wondered why the Russians adopted such a "weak" blowback pistol, Mak owners just smile.

[Three44s]

Sorry for the off topic:

The heavier mainspring is a winner! My CZ52 throws full powered empties to about half the distance it did before.

If you load them down you can get to the point that the empties land on your feet!

I have PA63 as well. I like the gun but have not handloaded for it yet.


Three 44s

[Crash_Corrigan]

Sorry...........:hijack: I had recently bought my wife a neat little 9 MM for her CCW use. I was looking for a 380 ACP but nothing at the gunnies store tripped her trigger. He brought out a stubby little black plastic and steel gun and she fell in love with it.

It ain't pretty but it fits her hand really good. Has nice sights and a long double action trigger pull similiar to a Para 1911. The magazine holds ten rounds in a double stack and it is concealable and light in weight.

I bought it for her and I asked for a box of rounds for it. My gunnie slides over a box of Fiocchi 9 MM rounds and I look at him funny. I said "Isn't this a 380?" "No" he replied..."it is a 9 MM". I was a happy camper. I took it home and she played with it for about two weeks dry firing that thing all day long.

I loaded up some rounds using a cast 115 gr LRN and some Unique powder of which I have jugs and jugs of. I found a suitable loading and made up over 700 rounds and we went to the range.

She fired it and did not like the recoil. She said it hurt her hand. I did not believe her. No 9 MM is gonna hurt your hand. I tried a magazine full. I quit after 4 shots. It did hurt! My empties had been thrown anywhere from 30 to 60 feet behind us and to the right. I have never seen a weapon throw empties so far.

I had gotten this loading from a published source and I am sure that it was right but the flattened primers and recoil and the flung empties told me that I had made up some nasty hot rounds not suitable for her or me. Maybe I had loaded these rounds too deep in the cases or whatever but I need to shoot these babies up in my Ruger Blackhawk convertible as nothing is gonna damage that gun.

I went back and loaded up some more rounds and I found a much better recipie where there is no pain, good accuracy and the empties just pile up to the rear and to the right in a neat little pile. We are both happy campers now and I learned a valuable lesson. When messing with a new loading make up 25 or so and test them before your go and make a fool of yourself.

Oh the gun is a Scyy made in Orlando Fl. Cheap but pretty well made and she loves it. She took home her first target and posted it on her bulletin board. All I need to do is to get her to start reloading as I can use the help.

[bigdog454]

I have a PA-63 that I found a .380 bbl for, cost a little more to shoot with factory ammo but, Its light weight and I carry it a lot and shoot it a little.

[doubs43]

I hear they throw the empties to hell and gone - so does anybody re-load for these?

I began reloading for the Mak as soon as components were available. I bought some of the very first batch of Starline brass and Speer Gold-Dot bullets. I also have a 95 grain mold by RCBS.

Maks are extremely accurate. I've seen no difference between the EG, Bulgarian or Russian Maks in terms of accuracy; all are as good as I can hold them.

[corvette8n]

I got one of the C&R East German Maks for $100.00 when Century had them on sale many moons ago. I never paid attention to where it threw the empties as I shoot surplus ammo. I know my CZ52 would throw the empties up on the roof of the covered range. I traded the CZ toward a rifle, kept the Mak.

[acl864]

I like my CZ-82 alot. I've been reloading for it since I got it a little over a year ago using converted 9mm brass and recently started casting for it. It does throw brass all over hell and half of Georgia but I equipped my two boys ages 8 and 11 with an el-cheapo metal detector. I pay them $4 per hundred. They make some extra $$$ and I rarely lose a piece of brass in the backyard.

[leadman]

The last group buy Mak mold from Lee is a very good boolit for the 9 x 18. Much better than the cataloged Lee RN.

I have even gotten rabbits with mine.

I had a Russian with the adjustable sight but the sight cut into my side when carried concealed. I now have a Bulgarian and really like it.