New guy here with a question on lube

[oscar.45]

I have been reloading for years and want to take the plunge into casting. Thanks to this site and you guys I will be making my move this year.

Before I start casting I have a question about boolit lube and smoke. I recently picked up 1,000 rounds of .45 and 9mm. After loading up 200 each I went to the indoor gun range. After several very smoky rounds I was asked not to shoot the reloads as the power was too smoky. After I got home I realized the power was the same as I always use, W231 for both guns. I have never had this smoking problem before with W231. Last week I went back to the range with some older loads and some of the new. The older ones shot clean with no smoke. The new ones smoked. The only difference I can see is the lube. Both boolits are lead.

My question is – what should I do? Clean off all of the existing lube and re-lube or melt everything down and re-cast?

Thanks

oscar

[David2011]

Hi Oscar,

Welcome to the forum! What lube were you using that didn't smoke? I have had smoke issues as well. When some boolits didn't have lube all the way around the grooves I laid them on their side and put them in the oven for a while at 200-250 degrees lying on a bed of paper towels. The paper towels wicked the lube away nicely and they were ready for re-lubing.

David

[oscar.45]

Hi David,

Not sure what the boolit lube was on the boolits as they were purchased at gun shows or gun stores. Thanks for the tip on removing lube.

oscar

[runfiverun]

i have had 231 smoke about half as bad as black when used with cast and higher humidity.
try some titegroup.
unique and Lla does the same thing.

[sagacious]

The older ones shot clean with no smoke. The new ones smoked.

Did you measure the bullets?

What were the older bullets sized to, and what were the new ones sized to? Were they different lots of bullets?

[jimmeyjack]

i have had 231 smoke about half as bad as black when used with cast and higher humidity.
try some titegroup.
unique and Lla does the same thing.

I too noticed alot less smoke with tightgroup, unless I used to little and it would smoke up a storm

[oscar.45]

Titegroup would be good if I could only get it, still not on the local shelves. I also have 8lbs of WST to shoot through.

All of the cast boolits that I have shot have measures .451-.452. I take a hand full and measure them before I start reloading. I have also have some Rainer plated 9mm HP’s that run supper clean with the 231. Guess I can keep the 231 for the Rainer bullets and get some Titegroup for everything else.

Thanks for the input!

oscar

[sagacious]

All of the cast boolits that I have shot have measures .451-.452.

oscar

Most of the time when one notices a lot of smoke when shooting cast bullets, it's because the lube is burning, and not a powder problem.

Everyone knows that burning bullet lube almost invariably produces lots of smoke, but many blame 'smokeless' powder for somehow producing sooty smoke with cast bullets, but not jacketed. It's the lube that makes for lots of smoke, and not the powder. Many people do not realize this, and cast about for a solution believing that the only component of the ammo that "burns" is the powder, and so a change of powder must be the remedy. But often that is not the remedy.

The difference between .451" and .452" is plenty big enough to allow gas to push past the bullet and burn-off some lube.

Going to a slightly larger diam bullet will likely cure the smoke problem immediately. When one buys lead bullets, one is usually stuck with the diam-- and the potential for smoky ammo. When buying bullets, have the seller mike (or guarantee) the size and make sure they are big enough. When casting your own, be sure to size large enough, and smoke should not be a problem.


I have also have some Rainer plated 9mm HP’s that run supper clean with the 231.
There's the proof of what I described above. With jacketed ammo, WW231 burns clean because there is no lube to burn off. A diam that allows for lube to be burned-off a cast bullet is the problem-- not the powder.

Good luck. :drinks:

[runfiverun]

excellent point there sagacious.
about the diameter and lube interaction, it also will do the same thing because of the boolit's bhn and the fact that even though you see no leading you aren't getting a good seal.
just the powder is usually the easiest thing to change if you have a load level you are happy with.
the 231 could clear the smoke up, just by going up in charge weight a little bit.
i have seen the 45 acp do this before.
and with bought boolits the easiest remedy iv'e found has been to change to titegroup or clays.
just for the quicker boolit bump.
and their burn characteristics.

[cajun shooter]

Melt out the lube that is on the bullets and use CLAYS with White Label BAC or Carnuba Red

[oscar.45]

Most of the time when one notices a lot of smoke when shooting cast bullets, it's because the lube is burning, and not a powder problem.

That's what I was thinking and why I asked the question. Thanks for the reply.

oscar

[fredj338]

It's the lube that makes for lots of smoke, and not the powder. Many people do not realize this, and cast about for a solution believing that
Ture, but some powders do better than others when it comes to smoke & bullet lube. I find W231 pretty smukey w/ cast lead bullets regardless of lube. WST, very little smoke. I believe you are correct about the bulelt size, but pressure of the load also comes into play. A lower pressure/vel load w/ a hot burning powder, like TG, will cause a lot of smoke.