6.5 Jap to .308 Winchester...?

[ka0tqv]

Is it practical to convert a 6.5 mm Jap (mod 38) to .308 Win? and if so what are the drawbacks? Would appreciate name of any gunsmith who might do it at a reasonable cost.

Email addr: KA0TQV@JUNO.COM
Third digit is a ZERO, not an OH
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Tnx for taking time to read this. Carl

[rhbrink]

I have a friend that has one that was rebarreled to a .243 works great. Doubt that he has any ideal who did the conversion as he has only had it a few years and appears to have been reworked some time ago, judging by the look of the stock.

[3006guns]

Stop! If that rifle is still in original military form it probably has more value than you realize. Another thing to look out for is whether it is a training rifle or not. The training rifles will NOT have the "mum" stamped on top of the receiver and some cast iron parts. Have it looked at if you're not sure (or post pics here), as a live round will turn it into a grenade. There are still a number of them floating around out there, posing as "real guns".

If it is indeed a normal Type 38 infantry rifle that's already been "bubbad", then no harm done to convert it, and you'll have one of the strongest bolt action rifles around. The barrel threads are 14 t.p.i. and of standard form, so any barrel maker should be able to provide a tube. Not sure if the bolt face or magazine would require any work, but it would be minor in nature if so.

[KCSO]

In the ol;d days 300 Savage was the prefered conversion as it worked best through the magazine, since 308 is just a 300 improved you shouldn't have any trouble.

[StarMetal]

Yes and no. In my case no. I rebarreled a 6.5 Arisaka to 260 Rem and restocked. I had to do extensive work to the action feed rails and change the magazine follower to get the action to feed right. The better action to do this with are the 7.7 ones, but they are as smooth working and cruder made. The 7.7 case is a hair fatter then the 308 and 30-06 family so they will feed fine.

[bruce drake]

I'll second Starmetal on this. I've got a 6.5 that I converted to 260 Rem and it still has some issues feeding and the magazine capacity dropped from 5 to 4 with the fatter 308 case. Also if you plan on rebarreling to 308, you are going to have to get the barrel end threaded to match the Arisaka threads as well. It's not the same as your standard drop-in Mauser barrels.

Other than that, I love my Arisakas. The 6.5 Jap is a great cartridge in it's own right. Use 35 Rem or 220 Swift cases if you can't get actual 6.5 Jap cases from Hornadys or Grafs and you won't be disappointed with them.

Bruce

[StarMetal]

I'll second Starmetal on this. I've got a 6.5 that I converted to 260 Rem and it still has some issues feeding and the magazine capacity dropped from 5 to 4 with the fatter 308 case. Also if you plan on rebarreling to 308, you are going to have to get the barrel end threaded to match the Arisaka threads as well. It's not the same as your standard drop-in Mauser barrels.

Other than that, I love my Arisakas. The 6.5 Jap is a great cartridge in it's own right. Use 35 Rem or 220 Swift cases if you can't get actual 6.5 Jap cases from Hornadys or Grafs and you won't be disappointed with them.

Bruce

Bruce,

All told I wish I'd chambered it to the 7x57 Mauser or the 6.5 Swede. I feel the longer cartridge may have fed better.

My mag only held four also until I opened it up.

[Multigunner]

The only 6.5 Arisaka I've owned and took time to examine closely was a blanf firing training rifle.
I did check to see if it could feed a variety of rimless cartridges and none would be held in the feed way at all well.
The 6.5 Jap case is quite different in shape from the standard mauserlike rimless cases. Some actions might handle the .308 while others won't come near without magazine rail alteration.

[bruce drake]

I love the 260 Rem chambering in the Arisaka and I know this rifle will shine once I tweak the mag area a bit more.

Bruce

[StarMetal]

I love the 260 Rem chambering in the Arisaka and I know this rifle will shine once I tweak the mag area a bit more.

Bruce

After I got the bedding problems solved my first loads went into 3/4 inch with the J-words. I even harvested a deer with it soon after I built it. I view the 260 as a 243 on steroids. Rick Jamison said it's, in his opinion, the best white tail deer caliber. I don't know about that, but it's a darn good round and unfortunately it's popularity is in the decline.

[madsenshooter]

6.5x257 or 6.5x57 feed well with no rail mods necessary.

[NickSS]

If your rifle is in original GI condition sell it to a collector and use the money towards a commercial sporting rifle.You will be money ahead in the long riun plus you will have preserved a fine collectors piece. If it has been butchered already have at it but know thise you will end up spending more on it than a new rifle will cost you and you will find that it is worth less when you try to sell it. I am speaking from personal experience here and not from theory.

[StarMetal]

If your rifle is in original GI condition sell it to a collector and use the money towards a commercial sporting rifle.You will be money ahead in the long riun plus you will have preserved a fine collectors piece. If it has been butchered already have at it but know thise you will end up spending more on it than a new rifle will cost you and you will find that it is worth less when you try to sell it. I am speaking from personal experience here and not from theory.

Not entirely true. I built my very nice walnut stocked 260 for well under $300 including the scope and mounts. Show me a name brand rifle today that is that cheap. You just have to know where to get it done and if you have any gunsmithing talents you can save even more.

[NickSS]

You must have gotten a really good buy on the barrel and did most of the work yourself. I had a brand new Cillian 95 Mauser sporterized a bunch of years ago. As I recall the gun cost me $50 the new fajan stock went for $25 Gettung the bolt handle bent and contured went Cost $20 and Drill and tap four holes were $20. I also had the barrel shortened and crowned for $10. new low profile safety added another $5. Sling swivel studs, sand paper, stock finish and a glass bedding kit added about $10 to $15 when it was all done I had $140 or so bucks into it not counting scope and rings. That same year I bought a brand new Ruger M 77 in 30-06 for $145 out the door and it came with rings. By the way when I sold my converted mauser I got $50 for it and when I sold the Ruger about the same time I got $75 for it. I bought a brand new Howa 308 three days ago for $369. My guess is that were I to have the same work done on a military gun today I would end up with a minimum of 3 to 4 hundred bucks in it especially if I had it rebarreled. Unless you are a machinist or a gunsmith converting old military rifles just does not pay today as you will never get out of them what you put in them.

[missionary5155]

Good morning
I have to agree with the VALUE of a rebarrel. IF I can find a used rifle out there I am going that way. IT has to be a rare critter for me to start laying out the BIG bucks for custom work.
I realise costs are what they are.... BUt there sure are alot of good used 308´s out there.

[Multigunner]

A couple of years back I saw a fine Arisaka that had been sporterized using the very best available stock and sights of the 1960's, it looked like the illustrations in the Williams and Lyman catalogs of what a custom Arisaka should look like.
A rifle like that has its own brand of collector interest as far as I'm concerned and was a great looking rifle.

There are a few less well done sporters out there, and usually can be obtained at a fraction of the cost of an unaltered military rifle.
Since the action is what those who want a custom rifle are really after , its much better to obtain a minimal sporter that has no collector interest and use its action to build a vastly improved sporter. Nothing is lost this way.

[3006guns]

Let me toss a couple more "dumplings in the pot"......

I collect Arisakas. I've seen pics of the rifle in question and it's a typical sporterized job, nothing fancy but nicely done. No harm in rebarreling really.

Another avenue to consider would be boring and rifling to a new caliber. The Japanese made a 7 x 57 variant of the same type 38 for Mexico. Same barrel, just a larger bullet. Probably more expensive than a new barrel though.

I have a sporter built on a type 99 (7.7mm) in a very nice walnut stock. In this case, the original owner removed the existing barrel and had the shoulder turned back, along with the rear of the barrel, to allow it to screw in precisely one more thread. No rechambering. The gun now shoots 7.65 Mauser as the two cartridges are almost identical shoulder angle-wise. Why the Mauser caliber? Because he had two cases (about 3000 rds) of military surplus ammo.......with the chrome lined Jap barrel there was little concern about the corrosive primers. Yep, I inherited the ammo with the gun. Works great on ground squirrels!

All in all, rebarreling a type 38 6.5mm to .308 shouldn't present any problems out of the ordinary. The receiver threads are pretty standard (14 t.p.i.) as opposed to the type 99 which has 16.93 t.p.i....try to find THAT thread on your lathe's quick change box!

[George Tucker]

In the old days, we made quite a few into 6.5/257 Roberts.

[hazwoper]

6.5-257 Roberts, aka 6.5-57, 6.5 Spence, .264 Spence. Reamers and dies available. I have "Hollywood Gun Shop" dies, Herters made them too. Use .257 ROB brass. EASY conversion, no feed problems, etc. I have a Type 38 carbine done like this. I love it.

[Four Fingers of Death]

At the risk of sounding like I am raining on your parade (but I see now that you did ask if it was practical), unless you are reallyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy attached to the rifle you would be better off selling it and putting the money towards a new Marlin, Mossberg, Howa or Savage/Stevens or similar rifle. They cost about the same (or even less at times) than a quality re-barrelling. No bending bolt handles, drilling and tapping, trigger work, feeding work, etc, etc, etc, etc. You will find that a rebarrelled milsup rifle unless it is an exceptional job on a K98 with a nice stock, will be worth the same as it was before the rebarrelling and all the other work was done.

Good luck either way and let us know what you end up doing if you can.

[Multigunner]

A friend really lucked out when looking for a K98 action to rebarrel. A shop owner had an action he'd ordered for a customer that had died unexpectedly before he could pick it up. Its a Whitworth Mauser action, NIB commercial and pretty high quality.He was able to get it for 50 bucks.
He put a .25-06 custom barrel on it and doing all the work himself had very little more than the price of a Walmart Savage invested in it when finished.

[FAsmus]

Ka0tqv;

I have a Type 38 carbine that I converted to 7.62x51 as you have considered.

I virtually had to rebarrel this rifle since the issue barrel was hopeless. I bought one of those inexpensive 30 caliber barrels from Midway took it to my Smith and he accepted the job.

I specified my action be barreled up to match the issue barrel as closely as possible so that I could use the issue stock, which was in very good condition. I requested some modifications such as enough meat on the muzzle to make a base for a Lyman 17A and for drilling to attach a receiver sight.

The fellow did the job very nicely. I took the barreled action and did some fitting so that it would match the wood as close as reasonably possible, worked up some loads and the rifle is currently in regular use as a favorite for both long range shooting (out to 800 yards) and for my regular offhand practicing.

The conversion is an outstanding success. The only problem is/was that my gun-runner charged me (in my opinion) way too much for the job.

Ah well. Once the initial pain of payment was over I find that I'm VERY satisfied with the appearance, the function and the utility of this little carbine.

Good afternoon,
Forrest

[MtGun44]

A brand new Stevens rifle (lowbucks Savage) with scope can beat $300 at some gun shows.
They look exactly like the Savage 110 less the fancy trigger. If they shoot like a 110
they will be tackdrivers. I have had a couple of sporterized milsurps and I think the days
when it was a money ahead deal are gone unless you already have a bubba'd rifle real
cheap and want the fun of working it up. Fun is a great reason to do it, saving money
is pretty marginal to negative these days. Many milsurps are worth more than the low
end commercial rifles today, something that the guys doing the conversions in the 50s and
60s could have never even imagined.

Bill

[Four Fingers of Death]

Howas, Stevens, Marlin and Mossberg bolt guns sell for the cost of a good rebarrelling job here (or less). Hard to go past!

[Four Fingers of Death]

The local gunshop got a batch of Stevens in recently, they were a package deal with a 3-9 or 4-12 Tasco from memory. He reckons that he has had feedback from 3-4 of the guy sthat bought them and they reckon they are brilliant.