Austin & Halleck Mountain Rifles Available

[pietro]

Talk about a phoenix rising up from the ashes of destruction !

Besides their modern inline muzzleloaders, Austin & Halleck made/sold a pretty fair Hawken rifle repro, called the Mountain Rifle.

It was only available in .50 cal, with a 32" octagonal bbl - but in either flint or cap lock. ( I have a rocklock, myself).
Either flint or percussion barrels were made in both 1:28 conicals twist and a 1:66 round ball twist.
The stocks were also available is ascending grades of Tiger Maple.

Well, A&H closed their doors in 2006, and besides scarce, the price of Mountain Rifles found lately have kept up pretty well.

I don't know why it took so long, but it appears that Tradtions has purchased the old stock of the A&H Mountain Rifles, and is offering them on their website at an astoundingly low price, considering their quality.

http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/eshop/10Expand.asp?ProductCode=R910060sk

http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/eshop/products/MOUNTAIN%20RIFLE_L.jpg

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[Boz330]

That sure sounds like a good price. I wonder how good their rock locks are?

Bob

[pietro]

I think they're pretty darn good.

I've owned two - the first a few years ago that, I foolishly sold; and my present one, that I bought this Winter to replace the one I sold.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1056075/AH%20.50.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1056075/AH%20Mountain%20Rifle.jpg

I got outstanding accuracy from both, and virtually instantaneous ignition - which surprised me greatly.

Mine have had a very fast lock time, much faster that the odd-dozen caplocks I've owned since the 1970's - on the order of a 209-ignition.

That's what most likely most contributed to the good accuracy.

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[KCSO]

They are made in Spain the locks are somewhat fragile and the triggers are not properly hardened. The barrels are of variable quality some very well made and some not so well made. The stock on the pictured gun is the nicest I have seen, most are much plainer.

[pietro]

AFAIK, the barrels are made in Spain (and are so stamped on their bottom) - but the remainder was done in Provo, Utah, USA (also stamped).

I've had no issues with soft triggers, etc - but I've also never filed through any casehardening in an attempt to "gunsmith" them, either - finding them very acceptable as received.

While I've only seen about 20 A&H's in person, only one had a plainer, "standard" grade stock wood - most had the upgraded Tiger Maple.

I've no clue as to what wood the Traditions Mountain Rifles have - since they evidently bought NOS at a distress sale.

FWIW, at about 60% the cost of the original A&H's, and $150 less then what used ones are bringing in online auctions, IMHO the Traditions price is a bargain, regardless.

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[Southern Son]

Less than $400.00? That would not even get you a bit of timber as nice as that one up the top in Oz. Pietro, that is a pretty good looking flint rifle you have there, too.

[pietro]

Thanks - But I only bought it. :)

.

[RBak]

Interesting thread.

I found the same rifle ad about a week ago and posted it on another forum...all I got was a bunch of flak, with a few responses that just didn't make a whole lot of sense.

It is my opinion that those who have never even seen or owned this rifle in real life should not be so quick to condemn it.

I owned one once, several years back, and although I never fired it, I found it very pleasing to the eye with a very nice balance and exceptionally nice wood. Wood to metal fit was much better than average...in fact, it was plain out fancy!
So fancy in fact, that I sold it to a fellow for a handsome profit, and he new exactly what I had paid for the gun the year before....it was just that kind of gun.

Here is 'kinda' the way I saw the old A&H come and go.
First off, they were expensive...almost twice what a T/C Hawken or a GPR cost at that time, and about three times what a CVA would cost for the same time frame...
(That price difference may be a little high, but you get the picture.)

Second, they were representative of a Hawken and there were several companies trying hard to capture that market for considerable less out of pocket expense...and, by the time A&H came along, the other companies were fairly well established within a price niche.


Now muzzleloaders, being the special interest group they are, are not very apt to pay big bucks for a same or very similar product that can be had for much less, unless there is something extraordinary about that product, and the old A&H just didn't have it. It was very nice, but not enough to warrant the huge price difference.

Now, fast forward about five or six years. Who would have ever believed that a new T/C Hawken, or a Lyman GPR, would ever be selling for what they are asking for them today? Today's prices on the guns mentioned is right in line with what the A&H was being so for back in their day.

Sorry for being so long winded, but it seems that some things just need a little more talkin than others.

Russ...

[twotoescharlie]

ordered one and recieved this past Monday. I have been shooting sidelock and underhammers for well over fifty years. (I ain't no spring chicken)and have 32 front loaders of various types. Don't much care for the inlines.
don't know why I ordered another but I just liked the looks of it. this rifle has the smoothest bore of any ML I have ever incountered, also has the strongest hammer spring, I don't think it will have trouble with misfires.
couple of small drawbacks, the set trigger adjusting screw was stripped which was no problem as it was easily replaced and the ramrod was very nice looking but kinda flimsy, made another.
the rifle shot very well with 50-70 grains 3fg powder, pilllow ticking patches was a little tight. front sight was a little to high but that is no problem either.
I was shooting about 4 inch groups at 50 yards from a bench. I consider this very good for 73 year old eyes, with beginning cataracs. I will gradualy work up a good load for this rifle, don't hunt anymore just informally target shoot.
came with a 0-120 grain powder measure, a real nice brass powder flask ,an inline cap dispenser, nipple wrench, and a short starter.
altogether I am happy with my purchase and will be a good addition to my BP herd. also had a goodlooking tiger striped stock as in the pictures.

TTC

[northmn]

I saw one at Cabela's once and was impressed with everything but the drop. It was a little hard to get down on the sights.

Northmn

[nicholst55]

They are made in Spain the locks are somewhat fragile and the triggers are not properly hardened. The barrels are of variable quality some very well made and some not so well made. The stock on the pictured gun is the nicest I have seen, most are much plainer.

+1. I have only examined one of the A&H Mountain Rifles, that belonged to a friend. He touted it as an ultra-high quality gun, but I was singularly unimpressed. He was on his second stock - the first one split, and the second one fit very poorly. It had also cracked, IIRC.

My friend tried to trade the rifle to me repeatedly, but I elected to stick with my Lyman GPRs and my T/C Renegades at the time.

[Hometek]

I have one I bought 5 years ago. It was sold by discount site as a blemished seconds. If I remember right I paid around 300 for it. The browning was uneven and the tang inlet was done poorly. Other than that it had nice figure to the wood and shot really well. I didn't like all the markings and warnings on the barrel that looked like they did with a small punch.

The stock wood is very soft. My 2 year old took a hard plastic ruler and was in the act of wacking it to death when my wife stopped her. I had been shooting it and had it on my bench where she could get to it. Put dents all over the stock. Any place I've bumped it has a dent or ding in it. Must be some really soft maple.

I'm in the process of getting a stock ready for a .58 cal build and the maple is 10 times harder than the A&H.

I like the fact it has the regular lock spring instead of the coil spring of a lot of the other Euro arm muzzleloaders. Has a better feel than the mushy feel when I cock my Lymans Trade Rifle.

[northmn]

Probably used red maple or some European stuff. Red Maple can give a great figure but some of it has all the density of pine.

Northmn

[nicholst55]

I'd be willing to bet that it's not maple at all, but beech.

[twotoescharlie]

tiger striped beech?

TTC

[RayinNH]

If I'm not mistaken, Beech is quite hard when dry,close to Oak...Ray

[pietro]

FWIW, I hit Maple when I inletted the stock on mine last week for a piece of scrim.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1056075/DSCN0246.JPG

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1056075/DSCN0247.JPG

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1056075/DSCN0248.JPG

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[PatMarlin]

Very nice pietro ....:drinks:

[KCSO]

Hey I don't want to Pee in anyones Wheaties but I have built quite a number of custom muzzleloaders, some from wood I harvested myself and some with barrels I cut the rifling in so I simpply offered an opinion based on expirience. Pretty wood does not quality make. If you can cut a sear or a set trigger part with a file it isn't hard. If a lock plate is two pieces of plate stock spot welded it's not quality. If the lock mortise is routed out in a big hole and the breech is not solidly inlet and so on. I have repaired a number of A nd H rilfes and while they look good from the outside they are not what I would term a high quality rifle. But I look at things like how well the breech is fitted and will the rifle last a lifetime of honest use. I won't say that you don't get your moneys worth since right now PARTS for a good rifle are running $450 or more, but I personally would rather have a Lyman Great Plains Rifle if I were going to go with an inexpensive starter gun.

[PatMarlin]

Yaw- the retail price on a new TC Hawken is unbelievable.

I paid $275 for mine with accessory kit years ago. Has above average wood also.

[iron brigade]

lots of good used tc rifles for sale. bought hawken flinter last year for 165.00 in excellent condition. then bought a tc renegade in .54 cal for 110.00 in even better shape. these were on gun broker.

[RBak]

lots of good used tc rifles for sale. bought hawken flinter last year for 165.00 in excellent condition. then bought a tc renegade in .54 cal for 110.00 in even better shape. these were on gun broker.

Real good buys, especially that Renegade if it had the full 1" barrel.

Russ...

[iron brigade]

thankyou. yes indeed it does have a 1" barrel. several weeks after buying it i harvested a doe with it. pass through at 25 yards, dead when i got to it.