working up New loads

[Harpman]

I get the rest of my stuff tuesday, .458" 535 Grn. Lyman Post ell Mould #457132 1-Cav., .060 poly wads, compression die...any suggestions on what components to change in any order as to minumize repeating mistakes ?

[KCSO]

I would suggest that if yo don't have one you get a good notebook. I keep notes on all my loads down to how may seconds I let the sprues cool. That may seem picky, but sometimes just one little change can make a world of difference. Don't be afraid to try things on your own. Every gun is different and just because Rangmaster Ralph gets a trophy with 215 primers doesn't mean that YOUR rifle won't work best with W/W pistol primers. The only other advise I would have is to at least start out with a good known and repeatable alloy for your bullets. I know some do good with wheel weights, but unless you cast a ton of bullets from one batch of w/w metal you will never get it exactly the same and that is what it is all about, everything the same ever shot. For my B/P bullets i mix pure lead and pure tin in weighed quantities into a cleaned pot. That way this year, next year I can cast bullets that will be on the money.

[SharpsShooter]

Good advice KSCO. I'll add this; When working up a load for BP (or smokeless) change only one thing at a time so that you will be able to track the effect it has overall. Start slow and work up in both compression and velocity. Also keep in mind that there can be absolutely no space between the powder and boolit. I suspect that you know that item, but it bears repeating for any who read these posts.

Now with the Postel you need 55gr by weight of Goex Cartridge grade, dropped 24" and compressed only enough to seat the boolit to the depth of your needs. Use a .030 veggie wad over the powder and a .030 cardboard wad on the base of the boolit. Light the whole thing off with a federal 215 and you should be good to go.


:coffee:

[Harpman]

All I have on hand is 5 pounds Goex FF, Is 55 still a good starting point for this ?.or is that a max ?....

[13Echo]

This is the load Rdnck from the Goex board recommends as a starter for the .45-70:

"Remington cases, full length sized and neck expanded. Standard, not magnum WLR primers. 70 grains by weight of Goex 2f or cartridge powder, drop tubed into the case. Compress the powder with a compression die to the right depth to seat your bullet. Compression of the powder will run between .350 to .380, depending on powder lot and bullet used. Place a thin card wad on top of the powder. I actually use a wad cut from ordinary kitchen wax paper. Seat a Lyman 457132 Postell bullet cast 30:1 and lubed with Black Magic lube so that it just touches the wad and powder without an airspace, and you are in business."

This is as good a place to start with a load that has shot well in any number of rifles. The Black Magic lube is his own concoction designed to work in the heat of a Louisiana and Texas summer. SPG or any number of others should do just fine. Have fun.

Jerry Liles

[Harpman]

dang......took all day, , casting, fitting, screwing, lubing, reading,sizing, turning, compressing, throwing crap around the room...finally got it all setup...4 rounds...70 grains GoexFF, chambers perfectly...this sure is alot different than smokeless.........Thanks for all the advice Gents..After getting this Lyman mould, I aint never buying another Lee. this thing is a cadillac compared to Lee

[GregP42]

dang......took all day, , casting, fitting, screwing, lubing, reading,sizing, turning, compressing, throwing crap around the room...finally got it all setup...4 rounds...70 grains GoexFF, chambers perfectly...this sure is alot different than smokeless.........Thanks for all the advice Gents..After getting this Lyman mould, I aint never buying another Lee. this thing is a cadillac compared to Lee

There is only one rule you must follow above all others with the holy black in a case, there can be NO airspace at all between the powder and the bottom of the boolit! Other than that have fun shooting!

Greg

[Harpman]

I triple checked that, measuring and adding, subtracting...

[montana_charlie]

You have one recommendation to use 55 grains of powder, and another specifying 70 grains. Both are said to be good loads, but your rifle will tell you what it likes best.

When deciding on an initial charge for use with a new bullet, I use the Wolf formula.
That is 5.3 grains of powder per tenth of an inch of powder column height.

I don't have any .45-70 cases to measure, but for example...

The inside of a .45-70 case measures (say) 1.88 inches from the web to the mouth of a properly trimmed case.
The bullet and wad will require a total seating depth of (say) .680 inches (assuming that will chamber properly in your gun).

1.88 minus .680 equals 1.2 inches. That is 12 tenths of an inch.
This is the maximum powder column height under a bullet with that length of shank.

5.3 (grains) times 12 (tenths of an inch) equals 63.6 grains.
This would be my starting load for a .45-70 when using that particular bullet.

According to Wolf, this would also be close to the maximum powder charge for that case/bullet combination. Using more might increase recoil, but may not yeild a higher muzzle velocity.

Use your preferred method for settling the powder in the case, then compress it enough to allow a .680 seating depth.

All of these measurements ae based on estimates. Your own components will probably be a bit different.

Using this formula in my .45-90, I get good accuracy on the first try. Tinkering with small increases and decreases in the charge show little change on the target.
CM

[hiram]

I have a redding measure. I started with the minimum load to fill the case to the bullet’s base. That was #50 on the micrometer setting. Load 1 case, then I turned the setting, from 50 to 51, loaded another case, 51 to 52, load 1 case, 52 to 53, load 1 case. I did this for 17 loads. My charges were from 56.7 to 72.7 gr. The powder measure setting is not the grains, its just a control for you to load 20 cases with the same increment of powder between each load. You have to throw 2 or 3 charges to settle the powder after you make each change, but that takes no time at all. So now you have twenty rounds of ammo, each with a slightly different charge. Make a list of the increment setting and corresponding charge weight.

We go to the range with 2 targets. One at 100 yds (that's what is available to me) and 1 target on the bench with your equipment. You have a few extra rounds to get you on paper and now the fun begins. Once your on the paper, NO SIGHT ADJUSTMENTS. You fire a round, mark where is hits on the target on your bench with the load number, i.e., #1. Fire the second and mark it on the paper, #2. Fire them in order. Mark each on the target with its load #. After the 17 rounds, you will see some shots spread out and a cluster of others. Take the middle load for the cluster and that is your basic load-and you can fool around a little from there.

My load worked out to be 61.3 grains, but it is number 55 on the powder meter.
Don't confuse the meter seeting with the powder weight.

[SharpsShooter]

All I have on hand is 5 pounds Goex FF, Is 55 still a good starting point for this ?.or is that a max ?....


2f will be fine and 55 has always been a good starting point for me, but not maximum at all. I have a load for the Lee 457-450F that likes 72gr. but it must be compressed almost .500 to seat the boolit. That load cracks like a hot smokeless load when it goes off and recoil is rather brisk:-D

SS