.30 BR vs .308 x 1.5"

[Marine Sgt 2111]

Gentlemen, What is the difference between the .30 BR and the .308 x 1.5"? I bought a set of .308 x 1.5" on fleabay and must admit after making a case up...I'm getting the itch...so what's the difference between the two?

[Doc_Stihl]

Internal capacity will be (slightly) different. The 30BR was developed from a "Universal Remington Bench Rest" Brass which is(was) a thin wall 308 with small primer pocket. New "br" brass is the same, but remington no longer makes the URBR brass.

The old .308x1.5" were quick twist and long throated typically using cast.

But as far as outside dimensions, I believe they're the same. I don't have a case drawing for the 308x1.5" in front of me but the shoulder angle might be different.

[Doc Highwall]

If you go 6mmBR.com they have a section on the 30BR, looks like a great cartridge.

[Marine Sgt 2111]

I have already read about the .30br shooting tiny groups with 118gr or there abouts bullets out of slow twist barrels and having stupid long barrel lives. I have also noticed that quite a few cast boolit bench rest matches are won with it also but they use faster twist barrels and 200gr boolits of linotype.

I bought the dies on a fluke but then I also did the same with some .40-70 SBN and 6.5-06 dies also. So much to do....so little time...

If anyone has anyother comments about the differences between the .30BR and the .308 x 1.5 please feel to chime in..

Thank you for the information and help...

[Pat I.]

The BR case has a 30 degree shoulder compared to 20 degrees for the 30 x 1.5. The neck on the BR case is about .100 longer than the 1.5 case. Capacity of the BR case is a bit more. Case forming for the 30 BR amounts to expanding a 6 or 7mm BR case and fire forming or just using some bullseye with a toilet paper wad on top and shooting it up in the air. You can buy good 6 BR cases to use.

On a target I doubt if you'd see a bit of difference between the two.

[StarMetal]

Read this page:

http://www.6mmbr.com/30BR.html

[Marine Sgt 2111]

thanks Pat....that does answer my questions...I am going to shorten a trim to length .308 die to use during cutting off the excessive brass from forming from .308's. When I get a barrel chambered I will make sure it's .308 x 1.5. Thanks again everyone.

[Marine Sgt 2111]

FWIW after months of snooping and pooping around the web and through articles here seem to be the main differences between the .30 br and the .308 x 1.5". The BR OAL is 1.52", it uses small rifle primers, has a 30 degree shoulder vs 20 on the .308 x 1.5" and some minor dimentional differences. One thing I did notice is that the .302 Whisper is a long throated .308 x 1.5 and that you can get AR-15 uppers chambered for it. Now that's an interesting path that one might follow.

Good shooting gents!

[smokemjoe]

I had a 308x1.500 and had 2- 30 brs, a 1-14 twist and now 1-12 twist, The 308x 1.500, you may have a thicker neck on it, depends what kind of reamer was for neck size. Best to have .002 neck clearness, I have to neck turn my 30 br. brass, I think the 30 br has more edge for accuzite then the 308x1.500, But try it, thats how I started and it shot good also. Joe

[Charlie Sometimes]

I've got some 30-06 brass that I cut back because of split necks.
You might be able to use them for making the 308x1.5.
PM me with your address if you want them. :smile:

[Marine Sgt 2111]

smokemjoe,
The forming dies are RCBS and year stamped '73. I will go down to the local Production Tool Supply and match the reamer to fit the die. Since you have played with both calibers, I have to ask...what action did you use for your rifles? Barrel makes? I think that I.s going to run with a 1-12 twist as it seems to be the winning twist. Thanks for your input and experienced thoughts.

[Marine Sgt 2111]

Charlie,
I appreciate your offer but I am going to start with fresh cases both regular .308 and Lapua 6mm BR cases. THis will give me a clear idea of Large primer vs Small and which case will give me the most winning groups. Thank you very much for your kind offer.

[Houndog]

Charlie,
I appreciate your offer but I am going to start with fresh cases both regular .308 and Lapua 6mm BR cases. THis will give me a clear idea of Large primer vs Small and which case will give me the most winning groups. Thank you very much for your kind offer.

If I were going to make some 308-1 1/2 cases I'd look at the 300 Savage case! They have a thinner body so your necks would be thinner to start with.

[r6487]

well i am making and shooting 308 x 1.5 now. took a rem sps 308 tactical and added a kreiger barrel, had to buy a pacific reamer. making brass out of LC match. got a 1:8" twist and lobbing 240grain 308 subsonics thru a 30cal suppressor. so far 11.9 grains of H110 pushes them at 1100 ft/sec, working on sr4759 and aa#5 too.

[Willbird]

Did you see the new 30 caliber AR round Rem came out with ?

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2008/10/remington-introduces-new-30-remington-ar-cartridge/

[felix]

Looks like a round made for WW748 using a 16-17 twist barrel? If I were the engineer in charge, I would send the design to the BR folks (lab) should any remain which I highly doubt. Were they not disbanded back when Mike Walker retired as the head engineer of the Company? ... felix

[Willbird]

Looks like a round made for WW748 using a 16-17 twist barrel? If I were the engineer in charge, I would send the design to the BR folks (lab) should any remain which I highly doubt. Were they not disbanded back when Mike Walker retired as the head engineer of the Company? ... felix

What is crazy is that AR's break locking lugs with x39 sized cases, let alone a .500 dia case. Ballistics were impressive for an AR platform. 125 grain bullet at 2800fps.

[felix]

They should find that out during lab time. Hopefully, they check that out throughly. Of course, they could specify a certain bolt mechanism only via their manufacturing specs. Another way of saying the public MUST buy this gun to shoot this ammo. ... felix

[kywoodwrkr]

Felix,
Do you know where Mike Walker is/was from?
There used to be a bunch of 12 and 14 caliber rounds floating about the gun shows in Louisville, KY with the Walker name associated with them.
Supposedly made barrels and etc for various US entities.
Are these two related? same?
Thanks.

Looks like a round made for WW748 using a 16-17 twist barrel? If I were the engineer in charge, I would send the design to the BR folks (lab) should any remain which I highly doubt. Were they not disbanded back when Mike Walker retired as the head engineer of the Company? ... felix

[Willbird]

They should find that out during lab time. Hopefully, they check that out throughly. Of course, they could specify a certain bolt mechanism only via their manufacturing specs. Another way of saying the public MUST buy this gun to shoot this ammo. ... felix

I did see that the gun is a sort of mongrel, it has an ar-10 bolt married to an ar-15 lower.

[felix]

Mike could have been involved with those barrels because he was interested in small calibers. Mike's first BR barrels were done by Douglas using Mike's button technique, giving time to re-tool should Douglas make a profit. Mike lived and worked in upstate NewYork. He died in Florida after moving when he retired at Remington. I think Mike was instrumental in the XP-100 design as well as making the 17 a production caliber. ... felix

[frank_1947]

I have a 30BR and its hard to believe how it shoots it is a Krieger barrel 25 inch the contour is 1.250 to .947 and it has a 1/17 twist at the moment I am shooting 118 gr bullets at 3050 I practice at 200 yards it shoots from a .3 to .5 inch 5 sshot groups that is 1/4 and less MOA, the only reamer that I know any one to use is the Robinnet he started the 30BR, the 30br is set up with a .330 neck and no free bore like someone said you expand a 6mm br you must turn the necks.

[felix]

No freebore with condoms is the only way to go for long term accuracy, provided you have enough neck length to contain the bullet of choice when the barrel is new. What neck clearance with what powder (speed) are you using? ... felix

[frank_1947]

I use a redding neck bushing die at.324 that is common and 34.5 gr of H4198 can only fit about .3 gr more in case, the case is full to top, all common loads, I shoot it at the lands just about touch

[felix]

Neck clearance? ... felix

[frank_1947]

.001 with loaded round .329 i measured the only one I have in the house my empty for jamming everything is loaded and in the car for a match tommorow leaving at 6:30 am

[felix]

I suspected around that number, actually a little less, for the accuracy you are getting with the 4198 speed. ... felix

[nanuk]

Frank:
118gr bullet (or boolit?)
3050 fps
1/4MOA

what's not to like!
for a deer rifle, you could just aim for that little dark spot that forms just at the side of the eye from tear-wash....

[frank_1947]

your right , I am still working on some 125 gr speer TNT bullets , they do just as good at 100 yrds but just a bit larger at 200 but still good and they cost half of what Berger or the custom bullets I bought.

[bruce drake]

I just picked up a set of 308x1.5" RCBS dies on E-bay for $35 with shipping. I'm starting to gravitate towards small 30 caliber cartridges for most of my range shooting to go along with my 6.5 match rifles.

Now I need to set some money away for a decent barrel blank to thread and chamber.

Bruce

[frank_1947]

[QUOTE=bruce drake;4390316]I just picked up a set of 308x1.5" RCBS dies on E-bay for $35 with shipping. I'm starting to gravitate towards small 30 caliber cartridges for most of my range shooting to go along with my 6.5 match rifles.

Now I need to set some money away for a decent barrel blank to thread and chamber.

Bruce[/QUOTE

I have a barrel for you, it's a Krieger heavy varmint #17, and it has a 17 twist, interested, at the moment it is chambered in a 30BR

[bruce drake]

[QUOTE=bruce drake;4390316]I just picked up a set of 308x1.5" RCBS dies on E-bay for $35 with shipping. I'm starting to gravitate towards small 30 caliber cartridges for most of my range shooting to go along with my 6.5 match rifles.

Now I need to set some money away for a decent barrel blank to thread and chamber.

Bruce[/QUOTE

I have a barrel for you, it's a Krieger heavy varmint #17, and it has a 17 twist, interested, at the moment it is chambered in a 30BR

Check your PM messages. Potentially an Interest. 17 or 12 rifling twist rate?