1891 Argi with 180 grain J-words

[357maximum]

Anyone care to post their favorite 180grain (speer/hornady) .311/.312 Jacketed bullet loads for the 1891 Mauser rifle? Mine is a 24inch sporter btw.

I am going to try a few, and am going to start with a low 40's grain charge of H414 or H4350 and would like any heads up you may have that may help save a few redskinned bullets. Thanks, Michael

[Dutch4122]

Hornady's Fifth Edition reloading manual doesn't list H414 or H4350 with that bullet. They do list IMR3031, IMR 4064, H4895, IMR4320, H380, and IMR4350.

The Lyman 49th Edition lists IMR4895, IMR4064, Varget, IMR4320, N140, RX15, and 760.

Any of this help?

[357maximum]

I have a series of H414 loads sitting here waiting for ma nature to quit leaking. Lee's book has the info on H414 and I am starting real conservative.....we shall see.

IMHO H414 & H4350 are the same powder in different form..........kinda.

I was just hoping that someone had blazed this path to help me conserve the big redpills........but that's OK...I have a machete also. ;-)

[StarMetal]

Hodgdon recommends 43 to 47 grains of H414 powder with a 174 grain Hornady RN. That's the bullet I use to use when I shot jacketed from my 7.65 many years ago. They list the same exact load for their 4350 powder with the same bullet.

[357maximum]

Hodgdon recommends 43 to 47 grains of H414 powder with a 174 grain Hornady RN. That's the bullet I use to use when I shot jacketed from my 7.65 many years ago. They list the same exact load for their 4350 powder with the same bullet.


Joe,
I have 10 of each @ 43, 44, 45 and we shall see when the sun comes up. I want to keep this conservative for now and will see what I learn from the 3 loads and go from there. I know that all 3 loads are safe...I already stuck 1 of each through her in succeeding order just to make sure. This is an 1891 sporter with the original barrel cut to 24inches.

IMHO H414 is the ball powder equivelant of H4350 from the playings I have already done in similar or slightly larger brass containers.

I was simply hoping to conserve the j-words which do not seem to be very available right the moment...OH WELL>.......................I WILL FIND MORE.


I have seen the Hodgdon data...I just wish they listed the pressures on their site or in their phamplet. I was going to try the 150's also.....but then I realized how much room is in that there chamber.......WOW.

[220swiftfn]

So which bullets are you using/planning to use? Remember that the '91 was made around the RN, IIRC a 215 gr. Unfortunately that can mean a lot of freebore with a spitzer. Mine likes the Hornady 174 RN as well, but I'm pushing it with IMR 4064, I'd have to check for the charge tho...

Dan

[45 2.1]

The 45th Lyman manual lists a dandy accuracy load for a 180 gr. jacketed load. Look it up as I don't have the manual here.

[357maximum]

So which bullets are you using/planning to use? Remember that the '91 was made around the RN, IIRC a 215 gr. Unfortunately that can mean a lot of freebore with a spitzer. Mine likes the Hornady 174 RN as well, but I'm pushing it with IMR 4064, I'd have to check for the charge tho...

Dan

I am using the 174 Gr Hornady RN Interlock (now) and the Speer 180 Gr Hot Cor RN (when I get them) putting anything smaller in this throat seems rather goofy because of all that open real estate. If I could find a FAT 210 or 220 RN I would try that also.

MaNature left my range a muddy sloppy sticky clay mess last night and the air is still like pea soup so I guess I will not do any shooting today.:cry:

[357maximum]

I had to get some trigger time in so I shot out the window at 75 yards. The 43,44 gr 5 shot groups were about 3/4 inch but have an identical slight stair step shaped group which starts low and left and works linear up and to the right. I need to do a little barrel channel work apparently. She does show some promise though...all is not lost in this cavernous throat.

[dualsport]

Haven't tried those powders but have had good accuracy with H4831 and the 180 gr. spizer. I used 51 gr. and LRM primer. With the Hornady 174 gr. RN I shoot 42.5 gr. H4895. On a hunting trip I decided to spring for some Hornady factory ammo (Hey, I needed the brass!) and was very surprised to find my gun loved that load with a 150 gr. SP going 2800 fps! Since then I load 150s for j-loads and get better accuracy than with the long heavy bullets. I know, don't add up, but it's true. My 1891 approaches 1 moa with them on a good day, it's an amazing gun, sure don't look like no tack driver. I'm about to go cast in this gun with my new 316299 mold, can't wait. Today is cast 'em up big time day, gonna have me a pile. Did a small test batch then oven HTd them for fun, harder than Linotype.

[Freightman]

Go here lots of loads!
http://stevespages.com/311_2.html

[357maximum]

I tired my shoulder out with her today. I got the barrel channel issue squared away, she seems to like 42.5grains H414 in reformed 06 Mil brass and 44grns H414 in reformed comercial 06.(trim length of 1.120). So far the 174Horn and the 316299 are shooting about the same 7/8 to 1.1 inch groups at 75yds.

*********typical load development caveat right here.......do your homework and do not blindly follow data from some dummy you do not know on the internet............please******* I consider both loads my upper limit in this gun and if these loads cannot make it into meat, I should have brought the Whelen.:bigsmyl2: The thought of that H414 @ 47 grains on the posted link scares me a bit. My CCI 200 primers said STOP at 45 grains.


Results were amazing as neither bullet or Boolit touch any steel prior to launch. I was hoping the 316299 would engrave, but it does not touch nothing but brass in this cavernous throat. As soon as my sloppy clay range dries up I will back up a bit and do some more testing of both bullet/boolit.

This is easily the biggest throat I have ever played with and I am quite pleased how she is shooting thus far. I know I can make it better though.


I will try some 150 gr j-words when I run across a box...just to see. Thanks for the encouragement.

[220swiftfn]

Hey 357, it's kind of funny, I have the '71 NRA gunsmithing guide (compilation, lots of good stuff) and it has the old military loadings photographed on a grid. The 211 gr. RN ball is friggin LONG!!!! Anyhow, those groups are nothing to sneeze at, it'll put meat in the freezer for sure. Mine likes 42.3 IMR 4064 reformed win '06 brass and gm210m primers (still playing around with it, but 1.25 at 100 isn't bad... :)

Dan

[leadman]

I load the 150gr. Hornady with IMR 4895 and it shoots less than 2" at 200 yards (scoped). The bullets seem to shred alot of weight when shot into elk, but seem to kill them just fine. Work better on deer.

The Remington 180 gr. loaded with a max. load of AA2520 shoots about 3 to 4" at 200 yards. The Rem. bullets are .310" and roundnose and drop quite a bit after 200 yards but shoot well. I shot a cow elk at about 80 yards and the bullet expanded in a classic mushroom shape. This shot was angling away and penetrated about 3' of elk.

I shot an elk with the Sierra 180gr. Spitzer at 175 yards and there was minimal expansion. The cow elk dropped in her tracks though as the bullet hit the spine.