1868 Springfield

[13Echo]

Just got a new project. A .50-70 Model 1868 Springfield just arrived at the front door. I have spent a pleasurable evening stripping the old Soldier of ancient grease and surface rust. Barrel has bright sharp rifling and the chamber is smooth and clean. The finish is now a pleasing medium to dark, uniform brown with smooth metal surfaces with no pitting. Got to get started on the stock tomorrow. Now if Buffalo Arms will just get me my brass, mould and dies I can see how she will do on the range. I wonder how long it has been since she was last fired? Too bad most of these rifles can't be traced to see where they served.

Jerry Liles

[KCSO]

Jerry
you are going to have a ball with that one. Remember that the bore may be oversize and you may have to use a soft lead slug with B/P to get the best out of her. I had one a few years ago and I got it to shade 3" with B/P. I used Bell cases and a 425 bullet from an old Dixie mould. Although some specs show 512 I was gong a full 515 and they shot best that way. I never tried smokless so I couldn't help there.

[13Echo]

Smokeless!?!?! Bite your tongue. Only the Holy Black for this Old Soldier!

I have Hosmer's book on the early Springfields in route. It should have a lot of information on the original loads. Currently I plan to use 70 gr FFG with the 425 gr Lyman or Lee bullet based on the original design cast 30:1 lead tin and measuring about .515 in diameter with a hard crimp. This should be fairly close to the original load and should be a good place to start. Starline brass, dies and moulds are on order from Buffalo Arms. In the meantime I have plenty to do to get her cleaned up without messing up the honorably acquired scars and patina.

The workmanship still evident in this old rifle should put most modern rifles to shame.

Jerry Liles

[floodgate]

13Echo:

If you don't already have it, get a copy of Croft Barker's "The .50-70 Shooter's Handbook" too; $24.50 + $2.50 S&H from Cistern Publishing Co., (361) 865-0030 or www.cisternpublishing.org. Lotsa good info; right up there with Spence and Pat Woff's on the .45-70's. He has other good books too.

floodgate

[13Echo]

Thanks Floodgate.

Barker's books on restoring single shot rifles and on the 50-70 are on backorder at Buffalo Arms along with the dies, brass, moulds, etc. Like I said, gives me pletnty of time to work on the old girl.

Jerry

[StanDahl]

Next, go to TrapdoorCollector.com and find the section on researching your trapdoors serial number. There, you may be able to at least find out where it was issued when it was new. There I was able to find that a cadet model I have was originally issued as a rifle and cut down to cadet size at some point. The other I have had been built as a cadet. I had never thought to look for the physical clues, but found them after this search. You'll find lots of other useful info there too. Stan

[13Echo]

Stan,
Unfortunately the data base does not cover the 50-70 Springfields. The 1865, 1866, and 1870 versions weren't even serial numbered. Only the 1868 series had serial numbers and it isn't covered in the data base. Too bad. I would have liked to see if the old girl had a history. My 1884 isn't in the data base either. The rifle has seen use. The 1868 rifle has an arsenal replacement stock so something happened to the original. I would like to think it was in some frontier action, but was most likely a garrison accident. I guess I'll never know.

By the way the sights are atrocious. Do you know if I'm supposed to hold the post even with the top of the broad V notch or with the top of the tiny slit at the bottom of the V or is the slit just to help align the post in the V? I have to wear glasses with an intermediate strength perscription to let me focus on the post and still see the target. I guess I'll find out when the brass gets here.
Jerry Liles

[13Echo]

Stan,
Unfortunately the data base does not cover the 50-70 Springfields. The 1865, 1866, and 1870 versions weren't even serial numbered. Only the 1868 series had serial numbers and it isn't covered in the data base. Too bad. I would have liked to see if the old girl had a history. My 1884 isn't in the data base either. The rifle has seen use. The 1868 rifle has an arsenal replacement stock so something happened to the original. I would like to think it was in some frontier action, but was most likely a garrison accident. I guess I'll never know.

By the way the sights are atrocious. Do you know if I'm supposed to hold the post even with the top of the broad V notch or with the top of the tiny slit at the bottom of the V or is the slit just to help align the post in the V? I have to wear glasses with an intermediate strength perscription to let me focus on the post and still see the target. I guess I'll find out when the brass gets here.
Jerry Liles

[StanDahl]

That's too bad you can't find that info. I was able to get at least a hint on all 3 of my trapdoors, one was pretty specific. As for the sights, I don't have a clue. Mine all have Buffington sights. I tried to look up your sights in my copy of The 45-70 Springfield by Poyer and Reisch, but it turns out the book only deals with the 45-70 and its variations. Huh. Whod've thunk it? Stan

[NickSS]

I have several 50-70 trapdoors that I shoot occationally. The 1868 sights like all sights of that era are hard to see by anyone over 45. The littl notch is the aiming notch. Draw the front blade down as far as possible and it should be on at 100 yards. By on I mean hit a man somewhere in the body at 100 yards. The where is variable. The rifle I shoot most (becasue it is not all original is an 1866 model that is all original except the sights. Someone in the rifles far past had a gunsmith install civilian sights on it. The front is a Rocky mountain blade sodered into the bayonet lug and the rear is a very unusual U shaped sight with a tinny notch at the bottom. This rifle will regularly print 3 inch or under groups at 100 yards right at point of aim using 70 gr of Goex FFG and a Lee 425 gr slug sized 515. No wad as I do not have a wad punch that size. The bullets are cast from wheel weights and all is loaded in Bertram brass shells I have on hand

[13Echo]

I shot the old girl today. Used the Lee version of the 50 caliber 450gr Govt. bullet, 63gr FFg and Starline cases. The bullets are not very round and the sights are kind of hard on my eyes but she turned in a 4.5" group at 100yds. I'm delighted. The new mould is in and I hope to try out a better bullet in a couple of weeks. Shot my 1884 Trapdoor in 45-70 and finally found a bullet it likes. The SAECO 1881 bullet at 500 grs put 3 shots into 2" and 5 into 3.5" at 100 yds. Now to get back to load development on my Sharps. Rick showed how it is done this evening putting 2 shots from his Christian Sharps .45-110 heavy barrel into the same hole at 500yds just as light was failing.

Jerry

[WBH]

Great group using a "not so great" mould. That Lee is a BB mould isn't it?. I shoot .50-70 and .50-90 using steel moulds only. I never had any luck out past 100 with a Lee mould. The RCBS or any of the custom makers (Paul Jones etc) moulds will delight you. There is a world of difference. My Paul Jones moulds throw almost perfect bullets every pour if I do my part. The .50-90 shoots a 650 grain pill. Lucky for me it weighs 16 #'s.

BTW Huntingtons in Calf carries Bell .50-70 and 50-90 brass.

[13Echo]

The 450gr 50 cal Lee bullet is sold base. It actually looks almost exactly like the original govt bullet. Unfortunately it just isn't round. I have a new Lyman mould for the same bullet that just came in. I hope to try it out in a couple of weeks. I also suspect the groups would be better with the 68 Springfield with better sights. The originals are a bear for 59 year old eyes. The Buffington (what a wonderful name) sights on the 1884 Trapdoor are darn sight easier to use.

Jerry Liles

[13Echo]

Well an update on shooting my 50-70 1868 Springfield. The Lee bullet, which casts about .516 will give me a group at 100 yds. The nice new Lyman version of the same bullet, which is very round and pretty and casts at .514 won't even stay on the target using the same alloy and load. Looks like that .002" difference is rather important. The rifle also groups about 16" high at 100 yds with the 200yd setting which would put it close to on target at 200 according to the ballistic charts. I'll continue to shoot the old girl for fun but someone younger will have to shoot for accuracy since I just can't see the sights good enough to do better. I bet she would do rather well with better sights but I'm not about to ruin a nice antique. I hope to try her out at 200 yds sometime soon.

Jerry Liles

[45nut]

Just got one of these myself today,,,,any update available?

I got dies with the rifle and have some starline brass on the way via midevil.

I would sure like to see someone write a proper BPCR loading article with loading sequence pictures and all. Please!

[45nut]

Can anyone clue me in on the proper sling to outfit this rifle with?

found number 21 cartouched in 2 places on the stock,,,any insight beyond maybe a platoon or troop number?
Springfield 1863 on the sideplate and 1869 above a US on top.

Found a good article one the web regarding the cartridge,,still looking for accoutrements.

http://www.shootmagazine.com/articles/firearms/50-70_govt.htm

[13Echo]

Congratulations. Does your rifle have cartouches on the left cheek of the stock? For a sling I'm using the Civil war Springfield pattern with the standing loop and single claw as I believe that's what was being used until the 1873 was adopted. At least when properly mounted on my rifle the claw fits neatly into the shallow grooves left by the original sling claw.

The best book out on the early Trapdoors is Hosmer's "The .58 and .50 Caliber Rifles & Carbines of the Springfield Armory, 1865-1872".

Reloading for the rifle is much like other BPCRs. I'm basically using Wolf's methods for the .45-70. I use the 450gr Govt. bullet from a Lee mould, cast of 30:1 alloy, unsized and pan lubed. It's larger diameter (.516") than the one cast from my Lyman mould (.514) and will give a group while the Lyman won't stay on a 2' target at 100yds. I use Starline brass which I anneal before the first firing. 60gr of Goex FFg, Fed 215m primer. Compress the powder charge sufficiently to seat the bullet to allow a firm crimp over the front band. Use a proper black powder lube to help control fouling. I'm using Lyman dies and a compression plug from Buffalo Arms. If you cast a bullet of linotype you can use it to compress the powder charge if you size or turn it down to give a slip fit in a sized and expanded case. The rifle shoots about 16" high at 100yds which is just about what it was supposed to do. Best groups are about 6" but the sights are difficult and the eyes are old. Lot's of experimenting yet to do.

Jerry Liles

[45nut]

I will be looking for one of those slings...

I cant find a cartouche on that part of the stock,,only the "21" on top and on the side.
Thanks for the load info,,,I have a 515141 on hand already. I will try these as cast with soft lead.