"ringing" shotshells

[Jim]

Over the years, I've heard many times about "ringing" shotshells. This is "supposed" to be cutting into the plastic of the shell just at the wad to make the whole casing with shot column intact go down the barrel.
I'm not saying this ain't possible, 'cause I ain't never tried it. But my calipers say that if you do that, something's gonna blow. I've NEVER seen a shotgun barrel that's bored straight through or open enough for the plastic casing to go down the barrel.

Court is in session.

[45 2.1]

Works fine Jim, just have someone show you how to do it properly. The end effect is a hull in the chamber with everything ahead of the cut being gone. Acts like a slug with pretty good accuracy. Its usually called a ringer.

[Jim]

OK, educate me. How does a shell casing much larger than the bore of the shotgun get down the barrel? Seems to me, that's like firing an '06 cartridge in a .270.

[45 2.1]

The inside wads and shot charge go down the barrel with the hull thats in front of the cut in one piece. The crimp doesn't open up. You cut the hull except for about 1/16" on each side, 180 degrees apart, through the entire hull at the middle of the wad. If you don't cut enough it acts like a normal shotshell, if you cut too much it comes apart in your hands. All these components aren't solid and get swaged down. I've done it in many different 12 gauges with the old paper shells first, then the current plastic ones. Everybody i've shown it to think just like you. Neat trick to have up your sleave for some future time though.

[9.3X62AL]

OK, there is today's new idea I hadn't heard of previously.

[snake river marksman]

One of the neat things about this is, it will penetrate the first wall of an aluminium camper as a solid, the inside wall as a semi solid and be free shot going all over the place inside the camper. Abandoned campers where there are teenagers and shotguns don't stand a chance. We were made to clean that mess up and put it in a 40yd dumpster.

[Mk42gunner]

I've heard of it, even saw one guy do it one time. I always thought it was a good way to get a bore obstruction, slugs aren't that expensive.


Robert

[45 2.1]

One of the neat things about this is, it will penetrate the first wall of an aluminium camper as a solid, the inside wall as a semi solid and be free shot going all over the place inside the camper.

It does the same thing to a car door, in the first side as a hole and a 12" pattern on the opposite door face. About 1 1/2" penetration into a 6" oak at 75 yds also.

[scrapcan]

I am with Al on this. I had not heard of it, but could be a good thing to see and stick in the back of ones mind. Would be interesting to see how it works with standard field grade loads out of a cylinder bore.

I wish some of you guys were in my area so I could learn by watching instead of bumbling through some of these ideas.

[45 2.1]

OK, there is today's new idea I hadn't heard of previously.

You would be positively amazed what can be done by modifying shotshells.........................

[scrapcan]

Snake River Marksman,

I take you have seen this first hand? Sounds like quite a few first hand moments?

[snake river marksman]

Yep, I've done it.

back in the day, it used to be illegal to carry slugs when deer season wasn't in. A ringed shot shell was a poachers answer. I don't know what happens when a deer is hit by one of these things. I never did that.

[Bloodman14]

How did you get past the forcing cone in the barrel? I have always heard that the crimp opens up, and the shot/wad column got 'swaged' in the forcing cone, to keep it together. As a result, I have NEVER attempted to do anything like this. Would this work in a cylinder bore?

[snake river marksman]

I don't know all of the mechanics or the physics of it, but I can tell you that it works in a 20ga Ted Williams auto loader, a 20ga Wards pump (both with poly chokes, who knows what they were set at) and a bolt action 16ga. Probably modified or improved cylinder?

[snake river marksman]

Think of it as a poor mans breaching round!

[HeavyMetal]

During a lull in a IPSC match back in the 70's one of the guys was talking about ringing his 12 gauge shells.

Went to his car pulled a nice 870 out and demonstrated the technique right then and there!

Improved Modified was choke on the barrel and we fired about 20 rounds, 8 shot quail load, through the 870 and made a bunch of big holes on a 25 yd pistol target.

Barrel ate them all with no problem and yes they behave as a slug.

Nice idea to keep in the back of your head but hard on AA shells if you reload!

[405]

A friend and I did it 30 years ago. Not hard to do. We called it a "ring around". Just a novelty maybe even a stupid novelty. I'll never try such stunts now. Seems like if you need a shotshell use it as a shotshell. If you need a slug use a slug, need a rifle use a rifle and so on.

[44mag1]

I shot my first coyote with one of these, all I had at the time was a 12 gauge. I hit him in the front shoulder as he was facing me at about 18 yards. The "slug" cut a nice hole going in and made a hell of a mess from then on.

[stubshaft]

I've ringed shotshell before. If you are shooting at something edible DO NOT hit it in the body you will end up with a hole with hair attached. It did not work too well for me in autoloaders because the remaining portion of the shell would not fully eject and jam the action.

Think of it as a big paper/plastic soft patched boolit. Both the shell and the shot will compress to a degree as it passes down the bore. It is no more harmful than shooting with a plastic wad as you can clearly see the imprint of the shot in the wad fingers.

Having the proper load/gun for a given situation is a fine thing. When I was younger it was not an option. When I went afield for game whether it was fur or feathered all I had was my 12ga. Mdl 37.

[yondering]

I had not heard of this before. Interesting. Anyone care to post a pic?

So, what other strange loads can be made with shotshells?

[snake river marksman]

I used to race sailboats. We had a 12ga that we used to shoot black powder blanks out of to start and end the race. For awhile we couldn't get black powder blanks and the smokeless blanks didn't have any smoke or the "right sound" and no flash. So I loaded some shotgun shells with Pyrodex and just a pinch of granulated magnesium. They gave a nice flash, a good cloud of smoke, and a proper "BOOM" . Everyone loved them but when commercial blackpowder blanks became available again, I quit loading up the homegrowns.

[snake river marksman]

Hey Jim! I just paid attention to the last part of your post. Check out the Mossberg 835s specs. If I'm not mistaken, those barrels are bored right at 10ga but chambered 12ga.

[MT Gianni]

It is mentioned in "Silent Warrior" the sequel to "Marine Sniper" by Henderson as used in Viet Nam War.

[stubshaft]

In the back of an old Dixie Gun Works catalog there was always a reference section. It contained things like the ser# of Hopkins rifles, recipies for Hardtack and hints and kinks of various "fixes" from homemade stock stain to browning solution.

One of the articles in there was a treatise of making aerial fireworks by removing the primer and putting a short piece of cannon fuse and filling a 20ga fired shell with BP. This concoction was supposed to be loaded into a 12ga shell that was primed and charged with powder. Upon firing the 20ga was sent airborne and exploded when the fuse ignited the BP. Now I have shot "popper" loadds for game control but this was a little too dangerous even for me.

[ktw]

It is also referred to as "cut shell" and is listed as illegal for the taking of deer in Michigan.

[twotrees]

was to open the roll crimp on paper shells and pour hot paraffin into the shot.

In the end ... same result. A slug that turned to shot on impact.

Not That I would ever do such a thing LOL


:redneck:

[Heavy lead]

The Michigan game regulation booklets still refer to "cut shotshells", never have tried them. Probably won't. But I would think they would be a heck of a frangible load.

[Le Loup Solitaire]

An article was written and published in one of the editions of the NRA Reloading Handbook and it was titled "Cut or Cutting Shotshells. Can't remember the author. Might have been Col. Harrison. It was described then as an old practice and trials and results were described. Interesting reading. LLS

[XBT]

I remember hearing a story years ago of guys dumping the buckshot from a shell and replacing it with split-shot fishing sinkers, all crimped to a length of fishing line. It was said to make for a tight pattern at long range. Never tried it.

[woody1]

An article was written and published in one of the editions of the NRA Reloading Handbook and it was titled "Cut or Cutting Shotshells. Can't remember the author. Might have been Col. Harrison. It was described then as an old practice and trials and results were described. Interesting reading. LLS

CUT SHELLS by E.H. Harrison, NRA Technical Staff
Their tests were done in the dark ages of paper shotshells. IMO they cut 'em a little too far back. They did get some cut shell bodies that remained in the gun. The question of pressure seemed to be answered though. In every case the cut shell pressure was significantly lower than with the uncut shell. It follows also that velocities decreased significantly. Extreme spreads increased in both velocities and pressures. If ya care I can scan the one page article and post it somewhere. Where? Regards, Woody

[SciFiJim]

Put me in the learned something new today column.

Woody, How about posting it in this thread? Would make for interesting reading.

[357maximum]

We used to play with cut shells all the time as youngins. They work pretty well for playing around with and getting a bit more distance when rolling cans and such.

I have seen exactly one whitetail hit with one, must have been about 1990 or so.It was a crippled doe on the last day of general firearms season. She was spotted out ahead of us in a stubble field on the edge of a willow swale we were about to dump the beagles into. My buddy Jim hurriedly cut 2 shells and proceeded to stalk on her while i stayed back with the leashed beagles. Jim hit that doe with a 16ga cutshell from about 20 feet. The "slug" hit her dead center of the front shoulder and ripped her up real bad on entrance, and had multiple exit wounds on the opposite shoulder. Inbetween was nothing but blood red cottage cheese. Not a real gamesaving load, but it did do the deed and ended her suffering that was inflicted by a car as best as we could figure. Three of her legs were broken but she somehow made it 90+ yards from the road.

The state of Michigan actually considers cut shells a large game getting device...I would not purposely use them for such except in a situation similar to the above.....we had nothing else with us. A single slug or roundball is much more appropriate than cut shells or buckshot IMHO. Cutshells are a fun novelty round, nothing more.

[JIMinPHX]

I've seen it done with paper shells back in the day, back east. I've never done it myself. I've also seen guys shoot slugs through modified bores. I never did that myself either. I consider both to be bad practice. I would not subject my guns to that kind of risk unless I had a darn good reason. But that's just me.

[Jim]

I remember hearing a story years ago of guys dumping the buckshot from a shell and replacing it with split-shot fishing sinkers, all crimped to a length of fishing line. It was said to make for a tight pattern at long range. Never tried it.

That's fascinating!

[dale2242]

Have fun boys. You won`t see my shooting "cut" shotshells in my full choke Model 12.....dale

[Doc_Stihl]

Also heard of waxing a shell. Open the crimp and fill the wad and shot with wax. Makes for a tight pattern. Never done it, don't know anyone who has.

We used to take a primed shotshell and feed a long wad into it along with 2 regular paintballs. They were fairly accurate. Useless, but fun.

[Mntngoat]

I've NEVER seen a shotgun barrel that's bored straight through or open enough for the plastic casing to go down the barrel.

Court is in session.


Vangcomp in Az back bores barrels.

https://vangcomp.com/Home.html


ML

[runfiverun]

the mossburgs are back bored to 10 ga 775 dimensions with a 12 ga chamber.
most new shotguns win and rem are bored to 740 now days.
the old standard was 729 in 12 ga.
i once shot a teal [high incoming] with my 10 ga and had a tube shoot off which left just the brass head in the chamber, it rained feathers blood and bits for a couple of minutes.
the cut shells were fairly popular back when all ammo went to war production and all that was on hand were old shotshells.
if you use larger sized shot it works differently than the smaller shot,but really don't hurt the gun any.

[woody1]

Woody, How about posting it in this thread? Would make for interesting reading.

I'm clearly not confuser literate enough to scan the article, reduce it to the size required here and have it be readable for you guys. Mebe this'll do it for ya.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/003175.jpg

or this?
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/003175.jpg





Regards, Woody