Another Lube Sizer Question

[Calhunter]

Does anyone have the problem of lube getting under the gas check and making the base of the finished bullet a waxy mess? I'm using a RCBS Lube Sizer with lyman dies. It's not as bad with non gas checked bullets.

Thanks
Calhunter

[omgb]

Try backing off the pressure. I've found that excess pressure causes the blow-by. I use just enough pressure fill the grooves on one, maybe two bullets. Then I give the piston a slight crank, maybe 10 degrees, 15 at most. That is all it takes during the summer months.

[Bucks Owin]

I get a little lube on the GC's with my old Lyman 450 too. Doesn't seem to hurt anything, I just wipe the excess with my thumb and seat the sucker!

FWIW,

Dennis

[Calhunter]

I was thinking it was high pressure too but it will do it even when there isn't enough pressure to fill the grooves. I'm lubing .45 cal by the way with three lube grooves. I'm also using RCBS pistol lube and it is pretty soft. I'm going to try some harder lubes and see if it still does it. It's a brand new sizer and so far to be honest I'm not very impressed. This is only one of numerous problems I've had with it.

Thanks Again
:castmine:
Calhunter

[BruceB]

The depth adjustment (i.e.: how far the bullet travels down into the die) is usually the culprit in such cases.

With Lyman dies, which have many lube holes compared to the RCBS dies, it's usually no big problem to get a setting which doesn't foul the bases with lube.

Start out with the depth adjustment set so high that NO grooves get any lube at all. Then gradually move the adjustment so the bullet travels deeper and deeper, trtying the lubing function at each location, to the point where all desired grooves are getting the lube. If there is still some "base-gunking" going on, try adjusting a half-turn of the depth screw in each direction, several times if necessary. It's simply a matter of trial-and-error to find the correct depth.

It merits re-emphasis: turn the lube pressure screw ONLY enough to lube each bullet in turn. My routine calls for inspecting the bullets during the lube-sizing process, so what I do is push an inspected bullet down into the die, make the needed rotation on the pressure wrench, and leave the bullet down in the die until I finish inspecting the NEXT bullet. This allows a few seconds for lube to flow into the grooves. If any of your selected grooves aren't completely full, push the bullet down into the die again, and give it another little "tweak" on the pressure screw. Pay attention to how many degrees of rotation it takes for the pressure to fill the grooves to your liking. Each different bullet design will require different amounts of lube (and hence degrees of rotation of that pressure screw).

I spent some time this morning lube-sizing some Lyman 457125s, 500-grain roundnoses with four grease grooves. I set up to lube only the back three grooves, and had no problems with greasy bases. Filling all three grooves on this .45-caliber bullet takes almost a quarter-turn on my 450's pressure screw.

Don't worry...if all of us can get satisfactory results with RCBS and Lyman lube sizers, so can you, and they ARE pretty good machines in my experience.

[dragonrider]

I have that problem on some bullets and have found it to be a sealing problem of the base of the bullet against the die pin usually caused by spru dimples that convex the gas check. To correct it I have hollow ground the top of the pin in order to cause a better seal at the edges. It helps some, but I think a better method would be to eliminate the spru dimples for a nice flat bullet base, but I have not yet found a simple easy method to do this.

[floodgate]

Calhunter:

Another thing that helps is to run the bullet into the die, and hold firm down-pressure on the handle while the grooves are filling; then raise the handle "smartly", so that you maintain constant pressure against the base until the bullet is clear of the grease feed holes.

floodgate

[D.Mack]

If all else fails pull the die out, lay the bullet beside the die to see how far in it will have to go to fill the grease grooves you want, and leave the base between the lube holes. Mark the bullet, and run it in the die that far, then set your stop. The only time I have had trouble with this procedure, is if the bullet is undersize, and the lube migrates down the side bullet, to reach the bottom, and leak out the top. DM

[454PB]

I've had this happen, and it is usually caused by a poorly fitting nose punch. The nose punch will stick on the boolit nose and pull it up slightly before the ejector pin begins pushing the boolit from the sizing die. That allows lube to run in between the boolit base and the ejector pin. To test: use a flat spacer between the nose punch and the boolit, if it stops the problem, you need a different nose punch.

[David R]

Nose punch must fit INTO the sizer die also. If it does not, it may not keep down pressure on the boolit and allow lube under the base. Had this problem once. Lube every where especially when I heated the lube sizer.

David

[454PB]

Good point, David.

[Bucks Owin]

In my case, the problem seems to arise when I have too much pressure on the (hot) lube and it squeezes through the tolerances in the die. Seems the lube "creeps out" and gets under the boolit that way. If I just go ahead and size the boolit with some lube in the die it gets forced back into the reservoir. The amount of pressure on the lube is a fine balance between a complete fill of the grooves and having it ooze out through the die between boolits...

If you savvy what I mean....

Dennis

(This is a problem mainly when I use the heater....)

[Char-Gar]

Shure.. Happens all the time to me...Goes way when I used enough pressure on the bullet to hold it firm against the pin in the die.

Not a matter of concern as I wipe every base of every bullet as a matter of routine. It is a religious thing with me.

[Dale53]

I rather think that it has been mentioned here, before (maybe earlier in this thread) but-t-t-t...

I had a friend chuck up the bullet punch (the punch in the die that returns the bullet after sizing) and take a center drill and drill the part of the die that the bullet rests on until there is only a 1/16" rim on the die in contact with the bullet base. Then run a drill the length of the punch (probably 1/8" - it has been a while and I am away from my dies). This allows excess lube to "bleed" through the hole and the rim seems to seal better against the bullet base. Does double duty - seems to seal better and gives a place for the excess lube to go.

Dale53

[StarMetal]

Dennis,

The NRA cast bullet book has an article about modifying the punch the way Dale explained, but what is missing is that you have to make a relief area at the bottome of the punch, (the part where the ram pushes up against with it's own little plunger) because the lube has to have a place to vent or escape too. Making that little 1/16 inch rim on the punch sure does seal better. What you do to get that is first drill the bleed hole all the way through the punch. Then you use a shallow countersink (drill bit of right size will work too) and counter sink that punch face. I did this to all my dies over 20 yrs ago and I don't have one problem with my Lyman 450 luber/sizer or my lube. I don't have to wipe lube off bullet bases or have leak through, unless there was flaw in the bullet that I missed.

Joe

[Flintlockrecord]

Just been lube sizing some 45 bullets tonight and was having the same problem. Its definately the base of the bullet giving me grief. Thanks for the tips Starmetal. Unfortunately I cant do that to this die as it's a borrowed one but as soon as mine arrives I'll be doing that first.

Flintlockrecord

[Bucks Owin]

Dennis,

The NRA cast bullet book has an article about modifying the punch the way Dale explained, but what is missing is that you have to make a relief area at the bottome of the punch, (the part where the ram pushes up against with it's own little plunger) because the lube has to have a place to vent or escape too. Making that little 1/16 inch rim on the punch sure does seal better. What you do to get that is first drill the bleed hole all the way through the punch. Then you use a shallow countersink (drill bit of right size will work too) and counter sink that punch face. I did this to all my dies over 20 yrs ago and I don't have one problem with my Lyman 450 luber/sizer or my lube. I don't have to wipe lube off bullet bases or have leak through, unless there was flaw in the bullet that I missed.

Joe


Thanks much Joe! I'll try and get me one of those books....

Dennis

[Flintlockrecord]

I have just recieved my new Lyman sizer die and find that the stem has a slightly concaved surface that prevents the lube escaping under the bullet. I guess that Lyman must read these posts!!!

[223tenx]

I was having the same problem a while back and I removed the die to clean it. I noticed that the "I" portion (the center plug) was rounded at one end and I had the rounded end up toward the boolit base. I turned it around so that the flat end was up and the rounded end down and this has all but eliminated the problem for me. I still get the lube too warm and it seems to want to creep under the gas check