Overwelmed, request help

[Butler Ford]

I thought that I would invest in a wad cutter mould for .38. I thought that it would make identifying practice, plinking and "teach-the-in-law-children" bullets easy as well as a bit lighter weight bullet for softer shooting. The problem is that there are MANY different WC moulds and almost NO discussion about the pro's and con's of individual bullet types. Which is easiest cast? What shoots best? What's easiest to load? Hollow base, Double end, beveled, "little nipple on top? Not being a bullseye shooter the afore mentioned uses would be it's sole purpose with little or no intrest in experimenting with this one. My expectations aren't overly high, just a bullet that's easily cast and loaded and with enough 25 yard accuracy potential to keep the intrest of novice shooters.
Anyone willing to point a direction would be appreciated.

BF

[dubber123]

I think for your stated purposes, you will have a harder time finding a "bad" wadcutter mould than a "good" one. I have used quite a few different ones, and other than the very light ones, (under 140 grs.), they all seem to shoot about the same. I recently tried a LEE 6 cav, (non tumble lube design), and it shot as well as the rest. I do have favorites, the Lyman 358091 for example. Wadcutters are some of the easiest moulds to come up with. Good luck.

[mooman76]

That's why you don't see allot of discussion her about it. Like dubber said. They all tend to shoot good. I had a stubby pistol that wouldn't shoot that great. Kind of expected being a stubby but I had to try to get it to shot better anyway. It shoot WCs the best of all I tried. I don't know why but It tend to like WCs better for some reason. I guess I just think they look bad and cool. Lee also makes a really good plinker. It is a SWC though 105gr but nice shooter and light recoil and light loads.

[BruceB]

BF, sir;

I'm in agreement with dubber about finding a "good" design. Sorta like saying redheads are a lot like blondes, all of whom resemble brunettes to some degree.

We are talking wadcutters for use in revolvers, si? Not many .38 autoloaders out there, and they do have some peculiarities.

Most wadcutter designs come to us from decades back, and they almost all have too many lube grooves for today's better lubes. I lube only one groove in my double-ended 35863 bullets, and since I don't like the sprue mark showing on a loaded round, I lube the rear-most groove only. The bullets can be seated out if desired, or flush, or crimped in a crimp groove if such is present...the possibilities are numerous!

Just buy the first one that comes along at a decent price, and you'll be satisfied. Within fifty yards, the .38 wadcutter is a VERY accurate type for the purposes you intend.

[HeavyMetal]

For what you are going to use it for pretty much any standard WC will get the job done for you.

If you have a lube sizer avoid the tumble lube designs and, as BruceB mentioned, most are set up for way to much lube.

One lube grove filled is all you'll need.

HBWC's are usually one bangers and production suffers dreadfully with them.

[mooman76]

I might add that HBWCs are usually not needed but in some cases like an oversized bore or other paticulars they can overcome certain problems in revolvers. Like stated though they are most always going to be a one banger and run more in price too.

[anachronism]

I've been toying with the idea of having Erik make me a 2 cavity Cramer style HB wadbutter mould from a DE mould I recently purchased. It seems like it should work, but I haven't asked him about it yet. It would be expensive, yet... interesting.

[Butler Ford]

I thank ya'll for the input, looks like there'll be a Lee 6 banger on the way in short order. While the kids may not know it yet, they thank you too.

BF

[Lloyd Smale]

like was said finding a decent one is no problem. but finding the one your gun will absolutley shoot the best is a matter of buying or borrowing them all.

[Butler Ford]

like was said finding a decent one is no problem. but finding the one your gun will absolutley shoot the best is a matter of buying or borrowing them all.

Lloyd, I understand, but there are too many moulds and too little time. I will probably start questioning which ever mould shows up but right now, I'm just working on convincing myself that this is not an endevor that I'll persue beyond a decent basic load. [smilie=l:

[anachronism]

I almost forgot, there was a wadcutter shootout on Castpics. Here it is, for your enjoyment:

http://www.castpics.net/

go to "articles", it's the second article down

[Butler Ford]

I almost forgot, there was a wadcutter shootout on Castpics. Here it is, for your enjoyment:

http://www.castpics.net/

go to "articles", it's the second article down

I'd missed this, thank you. The note:

3) The LEE bullets are at least as good as the rest, and better than most. The moulds aren’t as nice, but… was the cherry on top. I'm on my way to hit the "submit payment" button on the Lee.

Thanks

BF

[Hardcast416taylor]

I`ve had, or borrowed, LEE 6 holer, Lyman 4 holer and a RCBS 2 holer. All threw good WC boolits. I still have the Lyman and occasionaly cast up a pile that will last a year or so. I tend to use HP-38 or Winch. 231 powders. Charges are a straight 3.0 gr. of either powder I`m using. Primers can be whatever you have on hand of the standard variety. Robert

[Butler Ford]

Thanks HardCast but I've a pound of Bullseye that came in 3rd or 4th place in a couple of other expriments. I couldn't think of a better way to get rid of it than 2.7 to 3 gr. at a time. I hoard the 231 for the 45's. I never used any HP 38.

[sixshot]

Butler, 2.7 or 2.8 grs of Bullseye & a 148 gr WC has probably been shot more than any handload in history. HP-38 & 231 are the exact same powder, they come out of the same spout.

Dick

[Snobal]

Butler Ford -

I have been using a RCBS, two-cavity, 148 grain, bevel base wadcutter (BBWC) mold since the 70's and have cast and shot many thousands of these bullets.

I mostly use Bullseye powder. It would not surprise me to find the newer powders work better, I just see no reason to change something that has worked great for me most of my life.

I size the BBWC's with a RCBS sizer/luber .358 and only needed to lube one groove with Javelina or Tamarack lube (the old NRA formula stuff).

Now they quit making Alox 2138F which was used successfully for over 50 years in a 50/50 mix with bees wax. When I finally ran out of my stockpile of the old lube, I had to start lubing all three grooves to get a visually lead-free barrel after 50 to 100 shots with a 50/50 mix of the new Alox and bees wax. No big deal. The old Alox just worked better for me.

Old or new lube, once you get a decent load worked up, expect to get well less that 2" groups at 25 yards with BBWC's (shooting from a sandbag rest) --- and six-shot clusters into one ragged hole are not unusual.

By the way, I'm getting the same velocities with the new Bullseye that I got with the old Bullseye.

JMHO - YRMV

[Butler Ford]

If MidSouth and my history holds true to norm, I should have a 6 cavity Lee 358-148 WC Tuesday.

[35remington]

The tumble lube designs work fine in lubrisizers, and the bottom grooves only can be lubed on TL designs as well as standard designs. I do just this myself.

A lead free barrel is often not as accurate shooting as one that shows a slight amount of leading.

If your barrel shows no leading whatsoever, experiment with a little less lube to see if groups improve.

[Butler Ford]

The tumble lube designs work fine in lubrisizers, and the bottom grooves only can be lubed on TL designs as well as standard designs. I do just this myself.

A lead free barrel is often not as accurate shooting as one that shows a slight amount of leading.

If your barrel shows no leading whatsoever, experiment with a little less lube to see if groups improve.

Didn't get the TL mould, just the plain jane. Thanks for the insight on the too clean barrel.

[shooting on a shoestring]

Just a thought, but push them fast. They do that real well. My bedside GP100 has 359091s loaded with drilled HPs that chrono around 1520-1540 fps with "enough 2400 to make Elmer smile". Same load in my SP101 carry breaks 1300 fps. My old worn-out Mod 60 .38 sometimes CCW has pure PB 358091s with Herco pushing them to 900 fps.

The luxury of plenty of lube can let wadcutters crank up the velocity where others start to fail. Wadcutters make a lot of sense for self defense, targets, and I've not had any problems getting them to hit gallon water jugs at 100 yds from either .38s or .357s.

You'll end up wondering why more people don't get excited about them.

One other point, wadcutters are short for their weight and that works out well with slow twist rates in most revolvers (18.75 in my Smiths, and 16 in my Blackhawk). I think that contributes alot to their success.

[Butler Ford]

Well I hope you folks weren't pulling my leg because now I have 35# of Lee Wad Cutters. I needed to do a third pot but the back was telling me I'd had enough for a while.

Thanks to all for the guidance.

BF

http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/ButlerFord45/leewadcutter.jpg

[stubshaft]

That's only 1650 boolits.

What are you going to shoot next month???

[Butler Ford]

I think my Lee Hand Press is going to get a work-out!! :holysheep

[scrapcan]

Yep I agree with what everyone said. I have had great success with lots of different designs. Even had good luck with a recommendation to shoot some button nose wadcutters backwards, They actually did better in my 4 inch 15-3 Smith loaded that way. And what a hoot to shoot with 2.7 to 3.0 gr of bullseye. Unique is a good one to use also. Great for practice.

I also like to not have to chase brass. set a 1 gallon bucket next to your position and dro pin the bucket on each reload.

You will be surprised at how quickly you can load and shoot, even with the hand press. You may also get a way with not having to full length size for subsequent reloads. Just size enough of the neck to get good tension and a crimp.