PDA

View Full Version : My first 1911A1 - part 2 care and feeding



Linstrum
02-17-2010, 08:22 AM
I've had my Citadel copy of the Colt 1911A1 .45 ACP for three weeks and I've run a few hundred rounds through it. I pretty much know what its idiosyncrasies are now, and it has a few - BUT - I suppose what I have observed is common to most versions of John M. Browning's masterpiece, although I can't say for sure since this is the only 1911A1 I have had any extensive experience with.

First of all, I am just flat amazed at the accuracy this pistol has for being a plain off-the-shelf production item. Using the 228 grain Lee .452-228-1R boolit in front of 6.4 grains of Ramshot True Blue pistol powder, I was able to get 8 shots into a playing card at 75 feet. I kept setting up my targets farther and farther back and I still kept hitting them, and I finally got all the way out to 100 yards. At that distance I was putting all eight shots into an 18 inch circle by aiming high, which was not hard to do after firing some ranging shots first to get it right. Using the back corner of my dump truck bed as a rest and carefully squeezing off each shot, I was able to get all eight shots into an 11 inch circle at 100 yards. The math works out right since I was getting eight shots into 2.5 inches at 25 yards, so I should have been getting them into 10 inches at 100 yards, and 11 inches is pretty close to that.

About the Lee .452-228-1R (a short round-nose design) in this particular gun's chamber, I was jumping through hoops to get my cartridges using this particular boolit so they would chamber all the way and let the slide close and lock in battery. Just about every shot I had to smack the slide with the palm of my hand several times to get it to close all the way. Like all guns should be built, it won't fire until the cartridge is locked in the chamber. I found out what the problems were right off by simply measuring a loaded cartridge. This particular bullet must be inserted in the case right down to where the ogive begins and then some, and the generic over-all cartridge length for 230 grain cast lead bullets of 1.230 inches was way, way, too long. I kept running the depth in and finally at an over-all length of 1.175 inches the boolit showed no marking from being jammed into the bore. But the slide would still not lock in battery. Even though sized to 0.4525”, which is 0.002” over my particular gun's groove diameter, the boolits bulge the case enough to make it a press fit into the chamber and it requires more force than the slide recoil spring exerts to get a round bottomed out against the headspace stop. I solved the problem by taking the primer punch pin out of the cartridge case sizing die and then I ran my reloaded rounds part way back into the die to swage out the bulge. But this also squeezed down the body of the boolit where it was inside the case mouth to an unacceptable 0.445” diameter, which made it dangerously loose in the casing so it will fall all the way to the bottom and cause a potential detonation or other high pressure problem that will wreck a gun. Besides going all the way into the casing, at 0.445" it also will neither engage the rifling nor seal the bore. As expected, accuracy was non-existent. But after I re-crimped the mouths they fed and chambered great. Since the gun was useless with ammo that will not chamber or shoot accurately, it was time to do something about it. Lee's .452-230-TC is pretty popular and one that most .45 ACP shooters swear by and not at, so I ordered a mould from Midway. The day it arrived I had 100 cast up about an hour after my electric pot was hot. I use wheel weights and these cast at 0.453”, so I ran them through the Lee-style 0.4525” push through sizing die I had machined special for this gun to get the new batch of boolits perfectly round and all the same size. I usually use Lee liquid Alox and I lubed these boolits by putting them in a quart Zip-Loc plastic bag with a tablespoon of lube and doing the “shake 'n bake” routine before drying them on a paper plate out in the sun. I loaded up one cartridge and it slipped right into the chamber no problem just like the Russian ammo I had used when I first got the pistol. At the first opportunity I went to the range and ran one magazine of ammo through the gun using the new ammo I had reloaded with the Lee 230 grain truncated cone boolit and it functioned perfectly like it is supposed to. I ran another eight rounds to test for accuracy and found that the accuracy was about as good as the earlier 1R round noses and Russian cartridges I had originally used. At 100 yards it grouped a tad bit larger than the 1R type had, but that just could have been me since some days I shoot better than others.

I've never used Ramshot pistol powder before and the True Blue is working out very well for my .45 ACP loads. With a 230 grain cast lead projectile its load range is 6.1 to 6.7 grains and it burns clean at 6.4 grains. It looks like H110 but is not the same, it is more along the line of Blue Dot but is not exactly like that, either. I am using True Blue because I have a lot of it and it is not expensive. The other Ramshot powder I have used is Tac, which I use in my Swiss K38 with 147 grain fmjbt milsurp bullets. I got Ramshot powder last year when the other more popular powders were not available, and I have no complaints with cost or performance.

Kind of interesting, at the range the ground is littered with hundreds of CCI Blazer aluminum cartridge cases because nobody picks them up, even for scrap aluminum value, so I checked them out and found two types. Most of what I found are Boxer primed instead of the older Berdan primed that CCI used to make, so I picked up a few dozen of the Boxer-type to see if they have any potential for reloading. I ran twenty of them through my carbide .45 ACP sizing dies and they sized just fine without any signs of damage, so I reloaded them up and fired them. I have reloaded them five times now and they are still fine except for one that was damaged when I found it. It had been stepped on and its mouth was oval-shaped before sizing it, and that one finally split at the mouth after I had fired it four times, altogether it has been fired five times. I went back and picked up all of the aluminum cases with Boxer pockets that fit my guns and I increased my pistol cartridge supply by several hundred rounds. Even if I only get one use from them they are worth picking up, and if they prove to be reliable beyond four or five reloadings they will be a real windfall find! The one that split did not cause any problems since mouth splits are not dangerous – I've had many mouth splits over the last forty years and not one of them has caused the slightest problem. I like the Boxer primer pocket Blazer cases because they take magnum small pistol primers and I've got five times as many of those as I do large pistol primers.


rl737

Lloyd Smale
02-17-2010, 09:30 AM
personaly i dont think its worth risking a case failure with reused aluminum cases.

mike in co
02-17-2010, 10:41 AM
your issue with the 228 lee bullet is why i dumped that mould and went to the 230 rn bb tl.
the nose is under sized to the 451 bore...means one can load to a realistic 45acp oal.......

mike in co

Fugowii
02-19-2010, 06:24 PM
Can you tell me what you used for the COL of the TC loading?

Thanks,

F

Linstrum
02-21-2010, 03:31 AM
Hi, Fugowii, for the Lee .452-230-TC truncated cone bullet, I found that it works well at a cartridge over-all length of 1.130-inches.

I found that the actual cartridge over-all length varies but slightly, a few were 1.131-inches and some were at 1.129-inches. Having a + or - of only 1/1000 of an inch is pretty good.


rl739

35remington
02-21-2010, 02:39 PM
Linstrum, if this is all the longer your gun can accept TC's, it's throated too short.

Common overall length is 1.200-1.230" in a 1911.

I must point out that short OAL's do not reproduce the lengths the 1911 was designed to run most effectively, and may be a reliability compromise.

What is your OAL with the nonstandard 228-1R? I presume your guns allows virtually no full diameter bearing surface out of the case based on your description of the TC seating depth.

Bucks Owin
02-21-2010, 03:33 PM
personaly i dont think its worth risking a case failure with reused aluminum cases. Same here! Be a shame to injure that new selfstoker with a head separation or blowout at feedramp etc. I doubt aluminum is as "forgiving" as brass, especially after resizing/workhardening a half dozen times....JMO too

Linstrum
02-22-2010, 05:43 AM
Hi, 35remington, I'm running the greatest cartridge over-all length that will allow the case mouth to contact the headspace stop annulus. For the Lee .452-230-TC truncated cone that is 1.130", and for the Lee .452-228-1R one radius round-nose ogive that is 1.175". My buddy's Citadel that is the same model as mine has to use the same c.o.a.l.

If any bearing surface is exposed outside the case mouth it prevents the cartridge from fully chambering because the exposed bearing area immediately jams into the rifling since the rifling starts where the chamber stops. I slugged the throat area and it goes from chamber diameter to bore diameter without any lead-in where the rifling lands are taper-cut away to create about 0.175" of free-bore like in my 92 Rossi .357 Magnum lever gun and my two 9mm pistols.

At this point my options are four things:

1- leave it alone,

2- get a .45 ACP reamer that will cut some free-bore,

3- lap out the first 0.175" of the rifling to create some tapered lead-in free-bore, or

4- get another barrel to play around with and leave this barrel alone since it has pretty darned good accuracy.

Since I am not having any pressure problems with the bullets seated ~ 0.10" deeper than usual, my inclination at this point is to keep it the way it is since the present chamber configuration still allows the barrel to chamber cartridges using 0.450" copper jacketed bullets with the bullets seated to give a c.o.a.l. of a more usual ~ 1.230".

The whole problem is from the cast bullets I am using being 0.4525" in diameter to give me 0.002" larger diameter than the pistol's 0.4505" groove diameter bore. If I size my cast boolits down to 0.450", then I can seat them out to give a c.o.a.l. of 1.230" and still allow the slide to close up all the way and lock in battery.

If I size them down to 0.450", though, then I get into the realm of gas cutting with attendant severe leading problems. Right now the gun has pretty darned good accuracy with just minor leading problems and it just might have the potential to be a 4" at 100 yard shooter by working around with loads a bit, along with machining a barrel bushing that is a bit tighter.

It has pretty good accuracy right now and I sure would hate to mess it up.


rl742

Linstrum
02-22-2010, 06:48 AM
Hi, Lloyd Smale and Bucks Owen, thanks for the recommend on not using aluminum cases. The big problem with aluminum is from what you guys brought up, it has different work hardening properties than the standard brass made from 70% copper and 30% zinc normally used for cartridges. Kind of bizarre properties, actually.

From the experiments I did with aluminum cases they are good for about six re-sizings and then they go to pieces - literally - making them treacherous.

One of the properties of many aluminum alloys is they harden up by themselves at room temperature after annealing in a furnace at about 400°F for a few minutes and then cooling down quickly, somewhat similar to what air-cooled lead-antimony bullets do. Right after annealing and cooling, aluminum alloys can be forged and worked without work-hardening much, and this property is taken advantage of when drawing and forming aluminum cartridge cases or making aluminum extrusions for structural parts. After standing at room temperature for a day or so the parts harden up to full strength. The hardening can be delayed by storing the aluminum in a freezer and aluminum aircraft rivets are sometimes called "icebox rivets". Most aircraft built back in WW2 used the so-called icebox rivets.

Going through the annealing process for aluminum cartridges and then waiting long enough for them to harden back up to their safe strength again after re-sizing and loading is a time-consuming pain between the hip pockets to do right, so you guys are quite right, it is best to leave the aluminum cartridges alone and stick to brass.


rl743

35remington
02-22-2010, 10:13 PM
I've got a severe allergy to the magazines needed to feed short OAL's as I do not consider them reliable due to design compromises that do not get mentioned by those that peddle them for money.

If it were mine it would get throated in a heartbeat.

Normal OAL in my Colt factory and Bar Sto custom barrels is 1.220" for both the bullets you describe, as I cast both of them myself.

This is much more in the proper range for the 1911. 1.130" is ridiculously short for a 230 TC bullet and is improper.

Standard lengths.....

230 Ball 2 radius ogive 1.255-1.265" depending upon who makes the mould.

HG 68 Pattern 200 SWC (longnose) 1.235-1.250 depending upon who makes it.

230 TC's 1.200-1.230."

The Lee 228-1R is nonstandard for the 1911, as it has a one radius ogive (bluntnose), and works better out of magazines that release a little bit earlier than GI. Checkmate's tapered lip hybrid style would be better for this, and it is a superior magazine to the McCormick's et al right out of the gate, as it retains the 1911's controlled round feed principles and does not feed the cartridge at as sharp an angle as the straightlipped SWC magazines do.

A very knowledgeable 1911 gunsmith of my acquaintance suggests that overall lengths generally be 1.200" or longer. Shorter than this runs to the various 185 target SWC's that finish in the 1.155-1.185" range, and this length definitely requires early release magazines, which unfortunately require the round to climb the feedramp at a steeper angle, resulting in "ka-chunkier" feeding.

Railbuggy
02-23-2010, 08:29 PM
I to have the 228 g mould,found out here about ogive.Got the Lee 230-2R mould for my 1911.Will shoot the 228s from my Blackhawk 45lc.