Lyman4500 VS RCBS LAM2

[DeadWood]

O.k. i've done the leg work on these two fine machines. Seems to be a tie.

Does the LAM2 and/or 4500 come with a GC seater?LAM2 add says "sizer also seats GC's"or do i need to purchase that seperate?

Can anybody tell me the difference between the 2?

For those who have used both any prefrence and why?

Was planning on getting the Lyman Master Kit, until i saw the Lyman Big Dipper kit. Both are 10lb furnaces, Big Dipper being the better design? All else being equal the Master Kit comes with the $15 manual that i already have. So for $25 more i can get the LAM2.

[SciFiJim]

Deadwood, the 4500 comes with a gas check seater, or at least mine did a month ago.

[462]

DeadWood,

They both "install" or "seat" gas checks, if that's what you're asking. The Lyman 4500 comes with a part called a "gas check seater", the RCBS does not.

[Heavy lead]

I don't even know how to use that thing, don't even see why you need it, I seat checks when I resize in the sizing die, am I missing something?

[DeadWood]

DeadWood,

They both "install" or "seat" gas checks, if that's what you're asking. The Lyman 4500 comes with a part called a "gas check seater", the RCBS does not.

thats what i was after....if the RCBS came with one or not, add another $10 to it

[DeadWood]

I don't even know how to use that thing, don't even see why you need it, I seat checks when I resize in the sizing die, am I missing something?

Heavylead heres the link to what i was referring too

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=335653

I read the reviews and last post said it didn't fit the RCBS LAM2, but my midway catalog say it does but there website doesn't specify so guess i will be calling midway in the am to confirm

[MT Chambers]

It's for seatin' gas checks without any sizing of the bullet.

[DeadWood]

It's for seatin' gas checks without any sizing of the bullet.

If using a sizer (if just to lube) to you still need it?

[462]

Deadwood,

No. In fact, you don't need it at all.

Just as one of life's mysteries is, where do elephants go to die, so, too, is how do you use Lyman's gas check seater. There are no more than two people who know, and one of them has probably forgotten.

[dromia]

If buying from new I'd go for the RCBS, purely for their warranty.

If I want to seat gas checks on a lubesizer I just put a penny over the die retaining nut.

The heater facility on the 4500 is good but still the RCBS warranty would win it for me.

Both do the same job very well.

[Echo]

+1 for Dromia.

[Marlin Hunter]

I just purchased an RCBS LAM2. The only gripe I have is the casting is of very poor quality. the holes are off center. The casting looks like someone shifted each half off by 1/8". It still works, but I would have preferred a better quality casting. If I get another lube sizer, and I haven't won the lottery, it will be the Lyman. I don't think you need the gas check seater for the RCBS. There is an adjustable plunger stop that should do what the Lyman seater does (act as a positive stop).

RCBS has a $10 rebate if you buy over $50 worth of their product.

http://www.rcbs.com/pdf/RC129_RCBSCoupon.pdf

[DeadWood]

Saw the $10 off and Midwayusa has them on sale also, so that's why i've been thinking of going with the RCBS sizer and Lyman BigDipper kit. still hoping i can find a used one this weekend. haven't placed an order yet just looking for the best bang for the $$.

[Daryl]

I was going to also post a question on this. I'm curious about the opinions of those who have used both.

I have the 4500 and sent it back to Lyman two times to get the top punch lined up with the die. It is fine now.

But, in Veral Smith's book, he recommends against the Lyman in favor of RCBS.

Can anyone identify specific performance differences between the two?

I'm pretty happy with the Lyman. I've done maybe a couple thousand 7.62 with gas checks and a few thousand handgun bullets.

Once I get the adjustments right, it goes ok. But, I do get some gobs of lube in the die that I need to clean out occasionally. I'm sure that is due to either my technique, not paying attention, or an adjustment.

So, what are the substantial issues between the two?

Thanks

[Marlin Hunter]

Can anyone identify specific performance differences between the two?


So, what are the substantial issues between the two?

Thanks

I have not tried both of them, but I think the RCBS has a longer top section to hold the ram inline better. The lube adjuster on the RCBS always wants to turn into the linkage. I think the Lyman ratchet may be better.

[DeadWood]

Now were getting some where........

"pick the less of two evils?" Which one????

Daryl,
You stated "I have the 4500 and sent it back to Lyman two times to get the top punch lined up with the die. It is fine now."

How was Lymans customer service? Did you have to pay any fees and what were they for?

[Marlin Hunter]

Lyman and RCBS dies and punches are interchangeable. I like the Lyman dies better (ground surface instead of turned) and they are also cheaper. For the top punches, you will need to get the one that fits your boolit regardless of who makes it. The center hole in the ram that holds the top punch is .265 dia. I do not know what it is suppose to be, maybe .250 or 1/4". The lyman top punches are loose in the RCBS ram. The RCBS has 2 adjustment available for pushing the boolit back out of the dies. The lower linkage is 2 threaded rods. The Lyman has a stamped steel non adjustable lower linkage. If you go to the Midway website, they should have the manual for both lube sizers.

[dromia]

There is a good article on one mans take on choosing a Lubsizer in Cast Pics, look in the members articles.

Also heres a link to posts on alignment fettling how tos.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=27554

[Tazman1602]

If buying from new I'd go for the RCBS, purely for their warranty.

If I want to seat gas checks on a lubesizer I just put a penny over the die retaining nut.

The heater facility on the 4500 is good but still the RCBS warranty would win it for me.

Both do the same job very well.

+1 for Dromia

I've got both. The RCBS is a MUCH stouter machine. Parts are steel and not cast. BOTH are great devices and I use a Lyman plate heater on both for hard lubes.

I use Carnuba Red in my RCBS (Rooster) to lube my big rifle bullets (.458) but I use my Lyman 450 for almost all handgun bullets.

The single biggest problem I've had with the Lyman has been getting parts when they break from Lyman but that's only started happening in the last five years or so, must be a company thing.

RCBS has never let me pay for anything even when it's been my own stupid fault.

On the Gas Check seater, it works on both machines. I have some molds whose bullets do NOT like to be seated when lubing and some that don't mind it a bit. On my balky ones I seat the GC in a separate operation but man it adds TIME to the process although it works very well.

...........you're hooked now man................<GRIN>

Art

[Marlin Hunter]

I think the Lyman unit comes with wrenches to install the dies and top punch. The RCBS (mine) did not come with them. It's another expense if you don't have a hex key wrench set and an Cresent wrench

[kfarm]

I went with the Lyman 4500 for 2 reasons, no one had and RCBS at the time and it came with a heater.

I had it for about 6 months before it broke. Had a friend turn the pressure handle with out the heater on which broke the casting holding on the pressure screw rod on. Also I have noticed that the casting was true as it should be, not lining up the top punch. Called Lyman and they said to send it back for replacement. I don't know if there will be a charge or not I know RCBS would fix it free. However while I was at a gun show I saw an older Lyman 450 for $40 so I got that while the 4500 was in the shop. In my opinion the 450 is much better made even though it does not have a heater (I'm using a 90 watt flood light). So far I have not sent the 4500 back.

In my opinion I beleive the RCBS is a better built Luber Duber than Lyman.

[Bradley]

The main advantages of the RCBS is its warrenty and the fact that it will handle all RCBS and Lyman sizing dies. The down side is that after a while the pressure screw stops working. Getting a new one or replacing the o-ring doesn't solve the problem. I think that after a lot of hard use the o-ring, even if it is a new one, just doesn't grip the inside walls of the grease reservoir enough.

The main advantages of the Lyman is the build in heater (which is optional but well worth the money) and the fact that its pressure screw works even after years of hard use. The disadvantage is that the 4500 will not handle older sizing dies. Specs were tightened up during the manufacture of the previous model, the 450, and many older sizing dies just will not work.

[Marlin Hunter]

... The down side is that after a while the pressure screw stops working. Getting a new one or replacing the o-ring doesn't solve the problem. I think that after a lot of hard use the o-ring, even if it is a new one, just doesn't grip the inside walls of the grease reservoir enough.



I have noticed the same thing with my brand new unit. After the screw gets to a certain tightness, I can keep turning the handle and nothing happens. The problem is nothing is keeping the piston from turning with the screw once the screw exerts enough pressure on the threads of the piston gripping it tight. The bullet lube also acts as a lube between the O-ring and the side wall.

Hmmm. I just thought of a possible solution. I'll have to get back to you....:mrgreen:

[Packy]

Kfarm
The same thing happened to my 4500. I called Lyman and they said send it in. They put a whole new body on it and didn't cost me a thing. This was just last year. I borrowed a older Lyman sizer from a friend, one that had the 4 holes in it. And it worked just fine in my 4500.