Do I mix???????????????????

[haff202]

I have a 30 lb. bar of linotype lead from a print shop.
I have about 150 lbs. of WW soon to ingot up, Should I mix the lino with WW??????? Will cast 45-70 bullets only in RD350 .460 reject mold.
I have solder to add if mold are not filling out.
I have a coffee can of stick on wheel weights. These seem to be pure lead, most of the strips have weight written on each piece 1/8oz, 1/4/oz. Should I add these to WW and make a lead SALAD???
Later on I would like to try a soft nose and WW rear 45-70 bullet like I saw made on Ammo Smith .com

[ANeat]

I would not mix in the Lino unless really necessary. The WW alone will probably be plenty hard for the 45-70 bullets.

[haff202]

What kind of hardness are we talking? WW vs. lino printers lead

[ANeat]

I think most WW are 10-12, Lino 17 to 19.

Harder isnt necessarily better. Ive had fine results with some pretty stout 45/70 loads using WW and pure lead 50/50

[largom]

I shoot 60% lead-40% WW in my 45-70 at 1700 fps. Save your lino for future use or trade material.

Larry

[cbrick]

I wouldn't mix it. When I melt WW I seperate the clip-on and stick-on weights and put each into their own ingots. This way I have two seperate alloys, I have options as to what to mix as it's needed. If you mix it all together you have one option, what you have is what you have, period.

The 45-70 operates at 28,000 PSI max, clip-on WW alloy should be fine. Save the lino for a time when you'll really need it. Forget that silly nonesense "hardcast". Harder is not automatically better, it's just harder and that can cause it's own set of problems.

Rick

[haff202]

My lead supply is like hit or miss. More miss, so using up this linotype lead is just filler to use with the WW. I do like the trade value talk. Pound for pound, what value is the lino vs. WW? Can I trade at a scrap yard 30lb bar of lino for a bucketr of WW, even steven?

[KYCaster]

My lead supply is like hit or miss. More miss, so using up this linotype lead is just filler to use with the WW. I do like the trade value talk. Pound for pound, what value is the lino vs. WW? Can I trade at a scrap yard 30lb bar of lino for a bucketr of WW, even steven?


At a scrap yard? Probably not, most of them don't care what the alloy is...if it's heavy, it's lead. You have a better chance of finding a trade here in the swaping and selling section. A two to one swap would probably be a good offer to start with.

My experience with stick ons has been quite a bit different than Rick describes. I've always found stick ons to vary widely in hardness. Recently I'm finding fewer soft ones and more zinc and steel. I no longer bother to segregate them.

I would save the lino for future use. Roof flashing, pipe, Xray shielding, caulking lead and range scrap all could use some enrichment and your lino is an easy way to do that. Mixed 5:1 or 6:1 will get you close enough to WW that your gun won't know the difference.

Jerry

[Edubya]

I agree with pretty much everything that Jerry said. I would not agree with him on the swap 2/1 on the lead/Lino. I have bought Lino for a little over $1.00 per lb. I would not pay $0.50 for WW, more like $0.25 per lb.
EW

[rob45]

I have a 30 lb. bar of linotype lead from a print shop.
I have about 150 lbs. of WW soon to ingot up, Should I mix the lino with WW??????? Will cast 45-70 bullets only in RD350 .460 reject mold.
I have solder to add if mold are not filling out.
I have a coffee can of stick on wheel weights. These seem to be pure lead, most of the strips have weight written on each piece 1/8oz, 1/4/oz. Should I add these to WW and make a lead SALAD???
Later on I would like to try a soft nose and WW rear 45-70 bullet like I saw made on Ammo Smith .com

If your mold is a "reject" mold, you first need to determine why it's a reject. Is it because it casts on the small side? If so, lap it out to achieve better bullet fit.
Bullet fit is always the first thing to correct; worrying about different alloys does no good if the bullet does not fit.

Do not mix your different types of lead. It is good to melt the different metals down to obtain consistent batches of clean ingots, but keep the different types of lead separate. For example, melt all the clip weights into a large batch, stick-on weights in a separate batch, linotype in yet another batch. Once that is accomplished, you then have a clean base supply to create different mixes as needed.

As to what alloy is needed, that will depend upon your loads (provided you have fit and lubrication already addressed). You did not state what level you wish to push your 45-70. Once you have an idea how fast you want the bullet to go, then you can get a general idea of pressures involved. Whenever you have narrowed down pressure parameters, you can find a suitable alloy hardness.

Personally, I prefer to keep my alloys as soft as I can get away with.

A 1:1 (50/50) mixture of clip weights and nearly pure lead (stick-on weights, plumbers lead, etc.) should give you a hardness around 10 BHN. After considering the pressures involved, this level of hardness can easily be good to 1500-1700 FPS with your RD350.

Using air-cooled clip weights with a hardness @12 BHN, you can increase pressures up to "SAAMI max" levels. Using suitable powders, this translates into speeds up to around 1800-1900 FPS with your RD350.

Water-dropping or oven heat-treating your (clip weight) bullets allows you to attain hardness beyond the "modern gun" limits of the 45-70. This type of hardness (17 BHN and higher) allows pressures that equate to speeds well over 2000 FPS with your RD350.
Not that I advocate such loads, although I have developed several "bruiser" loads. Rather I am making this point to reiterate the fact that WW in one form or another will do everything you need.

So as others here have already said, the wheel weight alloys are going to be most useful in your application. I cannot think of a single application for the 45-70 where I would want to use linotype, unless it was "watered down" considerably.

If you have plenty of soft lead, you can take three parts of lead and mix with one part linotype. That recipe will be nearly identical to clip WW, although it may not have arsenic in it for best results when water-dropping. Easily remedied by adding a few ounces of shot.
Other than that, trading off the linotype sounds good. I do it all the time; usually about 1.5-2 lbs of their WW or soft lead for each 1 lb of my lino makes everybody happy.

BTW, you mentioned the possibility of "soft nose" casting later on. I do not have much experience with that, but keep in mind that with your mold (RD350) you have a front driving band approximately .025"-.050" in front of the crimp groove. That driving band needs to be the same hardness as the back half of the bullet, so it may be best to keep your "nose alloy" proportions small.

Good Luck.

[haff202]

great posts