Fore end stock pressure or fully float?

[the_ursus]

I have a Ruger M77 with a new Bell & Carlson carbelite stock and I'm trying to decide if the barrel should be fully floated or keep it's fore end pressure. I don't want to remove the fore end pressure if in fact a fully floated barrel negates accuracy. Is there a way I can replace the fore end material if fully floating doesn't prove beneficial?

Luke

[docone31]

They like full float.

[oneokie]

Is there a way I can replace the fore end material if fully floating doesn't prove beneficial?

Luke

Use some epoxy in the barrel channel to build up a pad to apply pressure to the barrel.

[deltaenterprizes]

Use a couple of business cards to shim the barrel close to the receiver and see how it shoots. If the rifle shoots better , free float the barrel, if not remove the business cards and you are back to square one!

[c3d4b2]

Use a couple of business cards to shim the barrel close to the receiver and see how it shoots. If the rifle shoots better , free float the barrel, if not remove the business cards and you are back to square one!

This is good advice.

Some barrels like to float some like pressure, as long as the pressure is even. The older Remington 40X's has screws in the forend to apply pressure against the barrel. The screws were tightened or loosened to improve accuracy. It has been described as a barrel dampening device.

[uncowboy]

Float or not to float? I always liked floated bbls but I have had some not shoot as good as shimmed. RUGER Uses forearm pressure in there guns. I have found that most mags work better when not floated. I have a 700 Rem 7mm mag that shot just over 1" 5 shot groops at 100 . That was good but I had pressure from the sling swivel mount touching the bbl. I Removed the hardware cut the bbl channel nice and smooth and ground the hardware to make clearance. Epoxy sealed the wood and reassembled the gun with a free float that is nice and smooth. Took the gun out and now it shoots just over 1.5" for 5 shots at 100. All that work and I lost 1/2" in my groop. Never can tell.J.Michael

[the_ursus]

Thanks guys, as is, the rifle has fore-end pressure so I'll have to remove material to fully float. Once material is removed, it's more difficult to fill it again so I'm still debateing. I think I can re-fill the void if with epoxy if it turns out full float doesn't work.

Not sure if it matters but, for those interested, I'm dealing with a 7x57.

[c3d4b2]

Thanks guys, as is, the rifle has fore-end pressure so I'll have to remove material to fully float. Once material is removed, it's more difficult to fill it again so I'm still debateing. I think I can re-fill the void if with epoxy if it turns out full float doesn't work.

Not sure if it matters but, for those interested, I'm dealing with a 7x57.


Use a couple of business cards to shim the barrel close to the receiver and see how it shoots. If the rifle shoots better , free float the barrel, if not remove the business cards and you are back to square one!

This is a quick way to test free floating without removing any material. One of my friends showed it to me and I was amazed how well it worked. It was also very easy and quick.

[the_ursus]

Yeah, the business card trick would definately be worth a try IF I had space to get them in. Right now, the stock has pressure on the fore end and to get any peice of paper in there I'll have to take sand paper to it.

Anyway, I think I'll just grit my teeth and do some sanding. I'm pretty handy with epoxy so I can always fill it back in.

[docone31]

One way to find out, and I have done it permanently also, is to take a rubber inner tube.
Cut a piece round with an hole for the forward reciever screw. Put it down over the screw and tighten the action.
That little space makes a big difference.
I did it to my old Savage 110 in -06. The groups went from all over the place to in the black at 100yds. Just that little easement made all the difference.

[yondering]

Yeah, the business card trick would definately be worth a try IF I had space to get them in. Right now, the stock has pressure on the fore end and to get any peice of paper in there I'll have to take sand paper to it.


I don't think you understand the business card thing. Remove the action from the stock, place a business card in the barrel channel directly in front of the action, and re-assemble the gun. The thickness of the business card at the rear of the barrel will prevent the front of the barrel from being drawn down into the stock, so it will be free-floated.

You don't have to sand anything to try this.

If you do relieve the barrel channel to free float it, and decide you need forend pressure later, it's not too hard to do. Put release agent on the barrel, out at the forend, and put some acraglass gel in the forend. Assemble the rifle, snug the actions screws, and mount it in a vise horizontally (in the same position as if you were shooting it). Hang a 5 lb weight from the sling swivel on the forearm, and let the acraglass cure that way. When you remove the weight, you'll have the right amount of forend pressure. Obviously you can use more or less weight if you desire.

[the_ursus]

Ah, put the card right in front of the action! Now THAT makes sense. Not sure why I was misinterpreting that. I was thinking the card was supposed to be placed right at the fore end. (well duh) I'll give that a try this evening when I get home. Thanks.

[the_ursus]

Tried it and floated it. Thanks for tolerating my long winded post. I'll post again, with my paper results.

Luke

[bcp477]

One caveat about free-floating. In order for free-floating to work, the action MUST be absolutely bedded into the stock - with NO possibility of movement whatsoever. If that is the case, then free-floating has a fair chance of improving accuracy (though not in all guns). If not, then free-floating will ALWAYS DECREASE accuracy. So, if contemplating free-floating a barrel, always check the receiver bedding first.

[the_ursus]

Thanks bcp477, I hope to get to the range tomorrow and if my results are less than expected I may be shopping for some bedding compound.

[MtGun44]

Im glad you have all the answers about what ALWAYS happens when you free float or
bed a rifle. In my experience, what works with one does not always work with another
gun.

My experience is that free floating usually is best, except when it isn't. Same with
bedding. Bedding always improve accuracy, except in those cases where it doesn't. YMMV. :-)

Bill

[jnovotny]

I have floated every one of my center fire rifles with good results. They have always shot better than with the factory setting. You'll just have to spend some time working up a load it likes.

[Char-Gar]

Perhaps the biggest bug-a-book for a fellow learning to work on his rifle, is the fear of screwing it up big time. If a fellow will just;

1. Pre-think each step of his project.
2. Have the right tools
3. Take his time

the chances of messing up big time are slim and none. In all my piddling with guns, I have never made a mistake I could not correct and have never ruined a gun.

YOu get good advise from these folks.. good luck!

[the_ursus]

Update:
Went to the range last night and finally got to try the barrel floated. I saw very little affect in accuracy, if anything, the group got just a hair larger. So I pulled the paper shim out from behind the recoil lug and returned it to it's original state with fore end pressure.

The chamber is very long in this rifle. A quick measurement came out at .5"! Even with my longest 175 grain spire points, they have to be just barely seated in order to touch the lands. I've read that some folks still find sub MOA accuracy with this rifle model and round but it still makes me wonder why Ruger (or whoever made this barrel) would do such a thing?

Here's where I'm thinking of going from here:
1. Wait till my neck sizer gets here and try again with same loads.
2. Try different powders (I've been using h4350)
3. Try longer bullets (been shooting 140gr Sierra)
4. Bed the action
5. Call Ruger and see if they can get me a barrel with shorter throat.
6. Find a custom barrel.