Tubing Jacket die pictures

[scrapcan]

First off, Thanks for the pictures Hud.

Here are some Pictures from Hud on his tubing jacket dies.

I am pretty sure that if we have additional questions, he will try to answer.

He indicated that he has been usign them for 15 plus years, he most likey can answer our questions.

This is not a for sale thread. The thread is for informational purposes.

[Hickory]

How much?
If for sale.

[scrapcan]

Nope they are not for sale, he offered pictures for those that asked what they looked like. Ioffered to put them up for him as he was having problems.

[303Guy]

I need to figure out how to attach thumbnails. I always trim my pics to make 'em smaller!:veryconfu

[scrapcan]

303,

HUD said you were also trying to get them put up. I said if you hadn't got them up by the time I was ready I would do it.

I think we will all have some additional questions for him.

[Ammosmith]

Does he use the hydro press for this or the CSP-2 press?

[Hud]

Thanks Jeremy, 303 Guy and all....5/8s x 24 thread on the jacket die....sorry for not including the info with the pictures....CSP-2 is what they were designed for altho a bushing could be made to allow use with the Walnut Hill or the hydro press....more space for the hands and fingers...no real effort required with the soft coiled copper I used...never used hard drawn so I don't know if there's any difference...wouldn't think so since you don't aneal until after the jacket is formed... a larger thread might offer a safety margin...Hud

[docone31]

Do the dies draw the copper, or just form it?
I would suspect, without prior knowlege, that there would be some drawing with the action of the die.
What is the weight of the finished swage?

[ANeat]

From what Ive read the tubing dies are made for a specific size/thickness of tubing so there isnt a lot of drawing.

Rather it goes thru a couple steps to form the base, then seat a core and form the point

[Lead pot]

The die is made for the caliber, the punches are designed for the tubing side walls.

[butch3220]

Here is a link to Corbins website about his tubing jacket dies.

http://www.corbins.com/tubing.htm

I also have a PDF document that is a little different (still Corbin) but I am unsure on how to post it. Anyone tell me how to do it?

[scrapcan]

It looks to me like the two dies on the right are jacket reducing dies (draw die and punch). the left die of right two is the top dies or draw die and ounts in top of press, the right die is the punch die and mounts in ram.

The other die has an ejector punch and it mounts in the ram, the three top punches mount in a floating holder that screws into the top of press.

Is that correct HUD?

[ANeat]

Lets see if I can move those pics from Butch's link. Welcome butch, Im not sure about the pdf thing.
Base forming
http://www.corbins.com/images/ctjm1.gif
Drawing
http://www.corbins.com/images/ctjm2.gif
Base flattening
http://www.corbins.com/images/ctjm3.gif
Finished jacket
http://www.corbins.com/images/ctjm4.gif

[scrapcan]

Aneat,

yep you got them in. The last two steps are done in a core seat die with special punch. There is a draw die at step two.

[gjb]

Why do people think the base has to be so no lead is exposed. I use copper tubing and have never sealed the base. I looked at the Speer Grand slam and the Nosler Partition and those have exposed led. I can't believe that the lead will distort any in the milisecond it is in the barrel and affect accuracy. The Corbin boys do make nice stuff but I don't want to give up a 401k to own it . I assume that he corbin bullets will kill no better than for example sniper bt's bullets or anyone elses for that matter.

[ANeat]

gjb I would like to see some pics of you bullets if you have any (pics) Ive seen some guys that just roll over the base and dont close it up all the way.

I think in a worse case scenario , guys may worry about the jacket being left in the barrel, especially with a hollow point, and exposed base.

Do you roll over the base any at all or something else?

[gjb]

I just roll the base After all the jackets are cut I throw them in muriatic acid then under the melting pot and after a couple hundred the size them to .301 then start back forming the nose (2 stages). I just use a Lee Casslic cast I have yet to break the Lee but for 80.00 I can buy a lot of them compared to Corbin. I don't see why it is such a ego trip to announce " I HAVE A CORBIN" Corbin was not making presses in the 40's and 50's but people were making bullets. Sure things have advanced now there are starters on cars but before there where cranks and they got the job done. I made my own dies for the 9 ton Herters and the rifle bullets still killed just as dead and that is back in the late 60's. Now I try for the one hole accuracy. I have gotten close but after 40 yrs I just don't think it can be done. I am pretty sure I have shot a train load of powder ( maybe only a 1/2 train load).
I sure do thank the people on this sight for all of the ideas. There are a lot of perfectionist on this sight when it comes to machining.I would be the first to take my hat off to them. Even us old timers still learn something. I just wish this snow would leave. 7 new inches on Friday. working on an H jacket out of soft copper

[swageall]

When making large caliber tubing jackets, I put in a copper gas check under my lead core, seat core, then point form.

Makes a real nice looking bullet base.

Swageall

[MIBULLETS]

I have made 358 tubing jackets from 3/8" hard and soft tubing. Both seem to work just fine. The soft does process a little easier though. I normally leave a 1/16" hole in the base or so, but I have closed them up too. Both shoot as good as the other.

Swageall, I'll have to try the gas check idea, sounds cool. How big is the hole in your base before you put the gas check in?

Dan

[Sarg]

GJB,

What do you use to roll the base of the tubing? I have never thought it was necessary to completely close the base either, but something to grip the bottom would be some secure. The gas check idea is excellent and may be the perfect answer.

As far as Corbin goes ... I have a Walnut Hill and I think it is a steal at the $300 I got it for. Sure that is a lot more than some of my other single stage presses. It thought makes the most difficult resizing jobs and such so much easier. I have an RCBS that I put a 2' cheater on, and when I have to lay on the bar to push a steel core bullet through it's a pain. That same bullet can be resized on the WH with one finger however. I couldn't justify spending $1k on a press though unless it did it all for you!

Sarg

[phil3333]

swageal, i would like to talk to you if possible

[swageall]

M1bullets;

The size ot the base holes in my tubing jackets depends on the quailty of copper tube being used and the amount of pressure used when forming. The tubing jacket makers that I use only require two steps for a finished jacket. With 1/2" copper tube for .458 jackets, Very small hole to closed all the way, with 5/8" copper tube for .600 nitro's there is a 1/8" hole that I gas check my cores to cover the exposed lead from the inside. Have never had a problem with the hole being exposed without a gas check inside. Have several of the major manufactors large caliber bullets like Barnes .600 nitro's and they all have large base holes when they used to make them with copper tube.

swageall

[swageall]

Phill3333;

Send me a PM

swageall

[n.h.schmidt]

Hi
I have a question for swageall. Where can you get the copper tubing at a low enough price to make this worth doing? The prices I have seen for straight copper tubing say 5/16" put the cost too high . It would cost less to buy the already made jackets. In the past I have made 6.5 CT bullets out of 1/4" rolled pluming copper. It worked but, it was a lot of work to straighten the tubing. The price was ok though.
n.h.schmidt

[Multigunner]

Why do people think the base has to be so no lead is exposed. I use copper tubing and have never sealed the base. I looked at the Speer Grand slam and the Nosler Partition and those have exposed led. I can't believe that the lead will distort any in the milisecond it is in the barrel and affect accuracy. The Corbin boys do make nice stuff but I don't want to give up a 401k to own it . I assume that he corbin bullets will kill no better than for example sniper bt's bullets or anyone elses for that matter.

There were many accidents involving open base tublar jacket .303 bullets. The major cause of such accidents is gas washing softening the jacket and causing cores to separate and blow through. Use in bores in very good condition seems to cause no problems.

Don't know about the Grand Slam but the Nosler partion is called that because it has a partition to prevent blow through of the core.

When dealing with propellants everything is in tiny but finite moments of time. Bullet bases usually show some effects from propellant gases, and even high speed impact by still intact powder grains.

PS
An enclosed base or enclosed nose is no garantee that a core can't blow through. The FMJ round nose 220 gr of the 1903 .30 blew through when the bore began to erode due to high temp propellant used at that time, and federal recalled all .303 ammo at one time after a blow through caused a fatal accident.
The ammo in each case worked fine in new or very good condition barrels but gas blowby due to erosion by previous long use of high nitro content (30%-58% far higher than modern DB rifle powders) propellants caused core separation in the bore.

The Nosler partition sounds like the better choice for an old rifle with noticable erosion.

[scrapcan]

We had an interesting experience with winchester whitebox 40 S&W ammo. It is supposed to be fmj, but upon pulling down a few loaded cartridges it has open base bullets.

The interesting part was the high amount of leading that resulted in a springfield XD. the gun was brand new unfired prior to the class the owner was in. He shot 150 rounds (3 boxes) of factory whitebox winchester during the class and at the sleanign your firearms section of class he was having issues cleaning. Upon inspection by myself and aother instructor severe leading was noted.

So much so that we ended up starting with a 30 cal bore brush with chore boy , then 38 and 40 cal lewis type lead remover. I was shocked at what I witnessed inthe 40 S&W. This is not a clenaing process that we usually get into in an introductory handgun class. I just happen to always take my range bag when I teach fo rhte just in case.