22 Boolits- tested

[Charlie Sometimes]

Posting a couple of targets from this past summer that I neglected to process after shooting them.
Looks to me that the 225438, 22-55-SP, and the 225415 shot the best.
All sized to 0.225 inches, and I used Small Rifle primers.
I think any rain had very little to do with grouping.
I used 55 yd. because it was as far away as I could get shooting out of my work shop window in the rain.

These are the results of shooting the various listed boolits utilizing the same load/charge for comparision of potential accuracy.
Lesser charges of Lil' Gun caused larger groups.

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c164/BaptisteBrown/Charlie%20Sometimes/22HornetAccuracyTestSmall.jpg

This one- I weighed every component individually, and got them as close as I could- and then ruined the group by getting in a hurry on the last shot! But it's still good.
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c164/BaptisteBrown/Charlie%20Sometimes/225438targetSmall.jpg

[303Guy]

Nice! Thanks for posting. :drinks:

You just gotta love the little hornet and Lil'Gun. It's like it was designed specifically for the hornet. I have not had any great success with cast but then my castings weren't the greatest. But Lil'Gun seems to get better as the charge goes up. With my gun and zero neck tension I drive J-words to 2700fps or more (based on bullet drop). That's using R-P cases. They have more capacity. Accuracy cannot be faulted and that's with a rust damaged bore!

My loading technique could work for cast as it involves seating the boolit/bullet in a paper cup and bonding it in place with molten wax-lube mix. Maybe one day I'll give it go.:)

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

Thanks for posting, thats pretty good!

What lube?

About how fast is that going?

I'm thinking of getting a Hornet for two reasons, well . . . three!:lol:

1. Cheaper to shoot
2. We got lots of waskilly wabbits wonning a wond (both cotton tail and Jack)
3. Can a person ever have too many guns?

[Charlie Sometimes]

I love this Ruger 77/22- a real good shooter!
I have some J-bullet loads that I am woking on too- for varmints, etc.
I will mostly shoot cast in it from now on though.

I think I am going to rechamber it to K-Hornet later this year though.
More case life, capacity (another grain of powder), and slightly more velocity.
Case life and capacity being the main reasons.

I don't have a chronograph- but this load is half a grain from maximum (13 gr.)
Hodgdon says bullets of 45 gr. will be near 2787 fps max; 55 gr. travel 2652 fps max.
My educated guess would place them in the range of 2600-2700 fps.
It's hard to get 12.5 gr. in one of these cases- need a drop tube, or vibrate it slightly before removing the funnel.
I feel that it almosts amounts to a compressed load- especially at 13 gr.
Boolits were seated to function in the clip, too, so some aren't optimal length from the rifling.

Lube on the 225438 an 225415 was a recipe I got from Leadhead 500 last summer.
Seems to work very well at high velocity in any caliber.
I've used it in my '06 (HV loads on 311299), 38 Spl, 38 S&W, and some 45 Colt loads, so far.
No leading, and clean, shiney bore after firing.
The lube is a little tacky in warm weather- I haven't got to do much firing in cold weather yet this year to see how it works below freezing.
The other boolits had whatever was supplied on them from some of the kind people of this forum (johnly the Lee Bators, and Chunkey Monkey the RCBS 22-55-SP- Thanks guys!), or the gun show where I found the 225462's. (I also had 225450's but they wouldn't stay under 6 inches at that range- they were all over the place. I fired them in earlier tests.)

[303Guy]

I think I am going to rechamber it to K-Hornet later this year though.
More case life, capacity (another grain of powder), and slightly more velocity.
Case life and capacity being the main reasons.I guess there is nothing wrong with that. But there is another way should you choose to try it. That is R-P cases as I've already mentioned. They hold another grain already. The other is to compress that charge and lube your loaded cases with case lube on a lube pad. (I use STP). This prevents case stretch and one can find that critical load just below the point where cases start to stretch. At this point, very good accuracy is achieved and performance is actually a tad better than can be had with the k-hornet. (It's a quirk of Lil'Gun powder - the shoulderless case shape and compressed charge may have something to do with it). Remember that the only pressure limitation with your rifle is what the hornet case can take - which is not a lot but it can take more if lubed when fired! And that's where Lil'Gun starts to really perform.

[Charlie Sometimes]

I guess there is nothing wrong with that. But there is another way should you choose to try it. That is R-P cases as I've already mentioned. They hold another grain already. The other is to compress that charge and lube your loaded cases with case lube on a lube pad. (I use STP). This prevents case stretch and one can find that critical load just below the point where cases start to stretch. At this point, very good accuracy is achieved and performance is actually a tad better than can be had with the k-hornet. (It's a quirk of Lil'Gun powder - the shoulderless case shape and compressed charge may have something to do with it). Remember that the only pressure limitation with your rifle is what the hornet case can take - which is not a lot but it can take more if lubed when fired! And that's where Lil'Gun starts to really perform.

Hadn't heard of that technique. If it was posted elsewhere on this forum, I've missed it so far. That's worth trying. I usually find that RP cases are heavier than their competitors- at least in other calibers. The majority of my 22 Hornet cases are WW, but I do have 50 or so RP, and I can try this later to see for myself.

What about hunting and prelubing the cases? Any issues, or have you done this under those conditions, or just at the bench? Hunting with these boolits is my intended main purpose.

Could the same technique be aplied to the K-Hornet?

[303Guy]

Could the same technique be aplied to the K-Hornet? I don't think so, no. (But then I have been proven wrong before!) There seems to be a delicate balance between case shape, volume, powder compression, and bullet weight. I once got a Winchester case mixed in with my R-P's and it actually expanded the primer pocket. But then I was seriously at fault by ignoring or failing to fully examine the cause of the powder charge being higher in the case neck! I eventually had the R-P cases to the same level in the neck and they did not expand primer pockets. There is no issue with lubing loaded cartridges. The case does not carry any significant load and a dry case will simply separate the head from the body! (It's about case shape and primer pocket strength - the shape of the case cannot handle the primer pocket strength when there is excessive grip between case and chamber wall. Lubed cases don't prevent case wall grip anyway - it's case to chamber wall binding that is prevented. Oil is not a good case/chamber lubricant - it can result in diesel ignition in some instances).

I used my R-P's for all my field shooting loaded like that. It did trake a bit of care in preventing chambering failure and I did have a few issues initially but once I got my act together, all was well. I would not hunt dangerous game with a gun reloaded in this way but then we are talking ferocious rabits and feral goats here! And a hornet. ;-) (Sometimes I wonder how I can actually shoot a goat - they are so harmless! But their numbers do need to be controlled. Even so....!)

[Charlie Sometimes]

I got the picture- the cartridge "gives" in the chamber rather than "sieze", and sets back before gripping (if any), and is supported properly. I see how that lack of seal early enough could cause the ignition of the compressed excess oil, too. Like the compression fire starters.

I use Imperial Sizing Die Wax on all calibers not using carbide dies. That stuff is great and very slick, as a very slight amount on your fingers will lube 5 large cases in a die before you need to touch the can again. I wonder if that could replace the STP oil treatment? (Hey, made a pun! :lol:) That might be worth trying.

I was also concerned about the oil getting on everything, collecting dirt, dust, or making the clip "sticky" in cold weather. I carry my extra 22 hunting ammo in little change pouches in my pocket so they don't get dirty, etc. Finding another type container that don't make noise for prelubed cartridges might be a bit difficult- I'll have to start watching for something in 22 Hornet.

[wistlepig1]

I have been having trouble with my Hornet with casts, with J-words its a nail driver. I use Lil gun in the J's, but with my cast 438's I can't hit the barn from inside it. I will have to try the lube on the loaded cases. Thanks for the info, if the snow holds off I will try it this week and report back.

[dualsport]

I've been considering the "K" chamber for my Savage M40 Hornet, strictly for the case life benefit. Just how much longer does a K case last than a standard Hornet, under the same conditions? Double? Triple? Charlie, I'm getting fair to good accuracy with the 450 in my Hornet and a couple .223s. Mild velocity though.

[Charlie Sometimes]

I had trouble with low and mild velocity loads giving me any kind of accuracy in my rifle with Lil Gun- until I pushed them faster! The faster they went the tighter the groups got. The loads that Beagle has in some of the stickies, etc., just weren't enough, some even caused leading (particularly the 225450). I think the lube had a big effect there, too. I have yet to experiment with Trail Boss and Unique loads in this rifle- some swear by those for accuracy, so I want to see.

I'm not sure how much extra life the K-Hornet gains, but from everything I've read, they don't stretch as much or require trimming as often. Maybe from 6 firings to 10? Someone else here could answer tha question better than I, most likely. Case shape obviously makes that difference. I neck size only, too, after once firing in my rifle to save working the case unnecessarily.

303Guy-
How do you trim and size your cases when fired as you suggest?
I would think neck size only, and they would probably be longer now?

I can see that the compressed charge supports the inside of the case, and having the head space taken up prevents the separation, and the lubrication acts like a sizing die at this point- there would be a point where everything is a "perfect storm".

[Bass Ackward]

I've been considering the "K" chamber for my Savage M40 Hornet, strictly for the case life benefit. Just how much longer does a K case last than a standard Hornet, under the same conditions? Double? Triple?


The answer to your question is that it depends on you.

Most of the people that I am familiar with the K-Hornet thought that it was an upgrade worthy of 400 or 500 more fps. Point was that if you over pressure that thin case, it just gives up no matter how you shape it.

[NHlever]

Though I haven't tried LilGun much in my Ruger Hornet, I have had better luck with the slower burning powders. I have had good results with both IMR 4227, and AA-1680. I don't have the 225438 mold, so I've been shooting the 22596, and 225415 (new heavier version)

[wistlepig1]

Charlie, what lub are you using in your Hornet? thanks

[Charlie Sometimes]

Charlie, what lub are you using in your Hornet? thanks

PM in bound with the recipe & instructions. :grin: