Old Fire Extinguisher Hazard

[Rockydog]

Chargars thread about oily rags reminded me of another fire related hazard.

Carbon Tetrachloride fire extinguishers were made post WWII until the late 1950s.

They came in a couple of forms. Brass Extinguishers with T shaped pump handles or in Glass balls filled with liquids which were thrown at the fire. Upon contacting heat the carbon tetrachloride produced volumes of gas which limited the oxygen and starved the fire. The problem is that it also robs any occupants in the building of their oxygen too. But the worst part is that the heat from the fire can chemically change the gas to Phosgene gas. The same gas used in the trenches in WWI. There is no cure for Phogene poisoning. Amazingly there are still both types of these extinguishers around, hanging in closets and basements, in spite of them being removed from the market in the 1960s. I see the glass balls in Antique stores all the time. These are very dangerous. For some info on the brass type you can visit this link. Rockydog

http://www.tpromo2.com/ssmag/fire/exting.htm

[geargnasher]

Thanks for the tip, my boss has one of those liquid-filled glass spheres but it is carefully preserved as a novelty/conversation piece.

Also don't forget the "hazard" of older, dry chemical "ABC" extinguishers that have had the chemical powder clump into a solid that won't spray when you need it most. Keep your extinguishers up-to-date if you want them to work.

Gear

[Lee]

Anywhere I can see a pic of the "glass sphere"???
My son has a glass sphere in a Red plastic housing. There is a spring loaded striker, which if activated WILL break the glass and let the clear liquid out. HOWEVER, there is a safety bar, with a hole drilled in one end, that is keeping the striker tensioned. Pull out this safety bar, and well, the glass breaks. Can't find what it is. Seems a bit complicated for a fire extinguisher, but what the hey, I'm the one asking......Lee

[Rockydog]

Lee, Just go to e-bay and do a search for "Glass Fire Extinguisher" Tons of them. RD

[DeanoBeanCounter]

All true. I work with fire extinguishers and have seen many types.
The ABC type can be kept alive by shaking or turning it from end to end every year or two or three. The only things that I know of that harden ABC power is moister and sitting still for years on end, it compacts or settles. If you happen to use an ABC, clean it up right away. The power is acidic and eats into a lot of different surfaces including metals.
There's a lot of fire extinguishers that have been taken out of service and a lot that are still allowed to be in service. If you have or know someone with an old fire extinguisher show it to a professional and ask if it is safe. If it isn't safe sell or give it to a collector, they should know how to make it inert. I've seen a lot of table lamps made out of old fire extinguishers.
There are to many types to list here and to many obsolete ones to list here too. But yes, stay away from CTC. That's dangerous stuff.
Dean

[MtGun44]

I have seen a wall mounted glass sausage with a tit on the end. There was a hammer
like a gun cocked and held back with a (presumably) low melting temp alloy slug on a
fine wire. Melt the slug, the wire separates, hammer knocks the tit off the end and the
carbon tet drains out. This was at least 40 yrs ago, in a house in Fla.

Bill

[DLCTEX]

A friend's ranch house has the glass balls filled with liquid in the older parts of the attic. I was doing some wiring and inquired what they were. He thought they were some old snake oil salesman's gimmick to keep lightning from striking the house. Any collector value?

[Bret4207]

We had cases of those glass balls at the fire dept I used to belong to back home. Never saw one used.

[Rockydog]

MtGun44, Like this??

[Echo]

Back in the day there was a cleaner named 'Energine' (right, I'm THAT old) that was basically pure carbon tet. There were some incidents where an open bottle was set on top of a radiator, causing phosgene gas to be generated. Energine went off the market in the late '40's, I believe.

[KCSO]

Back in 1980 we removed all those from the Court house and I took them for destruction. I used the carbon tet for degreaser with appropriate caution and took the balls and tanks, ground off the tips with a diamond bit and refilled the bulbs with H2O. Then I sold the repro's to all the local fire marshalls for demo of what NOT to have in the house. I got so entranced in selling the dummies i forgot to keep one for me. I also removed a vial of cyanide from an old safe one time. The safe was rigged so that if somebody tried to peep it the cyanide capsule broke and sort of ruined the safe crackers day. To bad we can't do that any more. I do still have the housing and empty tube.

[DLCTEX]

The glass balls I saw in my friends attic were clear round globes that sat in a wire basket hung from the rafters. I think the heat of a fire broke them. An old friend was killing weevils in stored grain by pouring carbon tet into canning jars with holes punched in the lids and burying them in the grain. The fumes from evaporation permeated the grain. His son was holding a funnel while he poured the chemical. The son had a cigarette in his mouth that was pouring smoke up his nose while both hands were holding the jar and funnel. He spat the cigarette out and it landed in spilled carbon tet, igniting it. The fumes instantly penetrated the deepest parts of the sinus cavities and lungs, causing us all to make an insane rush outside. It's hard to get through a door three abreast. It took about an hour to breathe normally, and that was from a minor whiff. This was in the early '70,s. In 1969 I bought it across the counter from the drug store to degrease a gun before bluing. There were no warning labels or instructions with it. You were expected to inform yourself if you wanted to use it. Now the government tries to keep stupid in the gene pool or at least to fund their offspring and relatives survival.

[KCSO]

Geeze I still have 1/2 a can of Energine in my desk drawer. We use it for cleaning typewriter keys in my Remington manual typewriter.

"Use in well ventilated area and avoid inhalation. Keep out of reach of children. Contents NAPTHA. This is a petroleum product as far as I know and Carbon tet is a chlorine base. Hence the phongene gas.

[MtGun44]

Yes, the same but not red. The glass sausage was translucent whitish.

Never knew what was in it, figured water would be pretty useless (way too little).

I guess it was carbon tet.

Bill

[geargnasher]

I was working at an aerospace plant in 1998 when the halon fire suppression system went off unexpectedly, I'll tell you it's a funny feeling to be in a room full of breathable gas that suddently has ZERO oxygen in it. At least we had a good plan and all got out quickly. Now, like so many things, I hear it's outlawed too.

Gear

[DeanoBeanCounter]

Halon is very much alive. It's slowly being replaced by halotron though. Halotron is more environmentally frendly. Both are very very expensive.

[MT Gianni]

Our fire extinguishers at work ride in a lot of trucks. SOP is to invert it and thump it upside down once or twice before using.

[badgeredd]

Back in the day there was a cleaner named 'Energine' (right, I'm THAT old) that was basically pure carbon tet. There were some incidents where an open bottle was set on top of a radiator, causing phosgene gas to be generated. Energine went off the market in the late '40's, I believe.

I remember as a kid watching my Dad clean OLD weight driven clocks with Energine. That had to be in the late 50s and early 60s. He had gotten it from my Granddad who at the time owned a small hardware store in Toledo. I believe it was NOS when Grandpa bought the store in the early 50s. I'd be willing to bet there is still some around my folks place right now.

I know as a kid my brother and I would take a shotglass full and a "Fusie" (railroad emergency flare) to get rid of woodchucks. Pour it in the hole and light the fusie and throw it in and then get the dickens out of Dodge. No more chucks!!!!!

Edd

[DLCTEX]

If the Energine that KCSO has (post 13) is naptha then it is very different from carbon tet. We used naptha for parts cleaning in the 50's -60's. It was supposed to be less flammable than gas and was used by dry cleaners also. I think it was also lighter fluid used in zippo type lighters.

[KCSO]

The fire extinguisher bulbs came in several different varieties. The hanging bulbs were either red or clear and the metal strip that hel them in place was bismuth??? like cerro safe and melted at 220 degrees and then dropped the bulb. They were also made with a hammer trip and in oblong tanks. All I have ever taken apart were filed with carbon tet.

Energine was sold till just recently and if I remember right it was banned in Kalifornia in like 1999? There was a big lawsuit over it.

[Lee]

OK....I understand the fusible link gizmo on these contraptions, but the metal bar, drilled to attacha string/chain/whatever?? That seems to take it a little bit out of the self contained fire extinguisher category. At least that's what mine look like. I'll try to get a picture.............