Lee Universal Case Expanding Die

[dovehunter]

Anyone used the Lee Universal Case Expanding Die to expand case mouths to be able to easily insert cast bullets without any lead shaving, deforming, etc.? If so did it work okay and is it a worthwhile investment? Comments?

[Guesser]

It works as advertised. I use Lyman "M" dies for all cartridges I have them for but the Lee Universal is better than their "Powder thru expander" when you are just expanding.

[cheese1566]

I was about to order one too. Primarily for rifle cast bullets...

[Willbird]

The LEE tool is not an expander, it is a case neck flaring tool,It does not actually size the inside of the neck, it just flares it, as such it compares in no way with an M die.

So for instance if you used a normal rifle sizing die and removed the expander ball.....the used the LEE tool you would end up with around .008 of bullet pull.....actually not because your bullet would be expanding the neck, and getting sized down in the process. Overall not a good situation.

I thought the LEE die was a cool idea until I ordered one...and saw it only flares the necks. I had pictured that it came with a set of stems that both expanded and flared...sort of like what is inside the powder through expander dies.

Bill

[EMC45]

I like the Lee Universal Expanding Die. It works well. Beats jamming a pair of needle nose pliers into the case moth for a flare.

[skeet1]

I use the Lee and it works well on all size cases. I use it in my Lee Classic Turret with .303 and 06 along with a Lee collet die. It works great even with oversize bullets like .314 in the .303 and .311 in the 06. I was also concerned that a neck with too big a difference in size compared to the bullet might change the diameter of the bullet during seating. So I pulled a few bullets and found no difference in diameter.

Skeet1

[1874Sharps]

I bought this Lee die for loading paper patch gas check 30 caliber rifle boolits. It flares the mouth a bit and thus protected the paper jacket from tearing upon loading. I found it handy when make-shift loading cartridges using whatever dies I happened to have on hand while waiting to get the correct dies (such as flaring the mouth of a 44 Russian case and using 44 Special dies for sizing and seating). I think they are a handy addition to the battery of reloading equipment and well worth the small price. BTW, I think this is true of the Lee Universal Decapping die, too.

[HABCAN]

I bought this Lee die for loading paper patch gas check 30 caliber rifle boolits. It flares the mouth a bit and thus protected the paper jacket from tearing upon loading. I found it handy when make-shift loading cartridges using whatever dies I happened to have on hand while waiting to get the correct dies (such as flaring the mouth of a 44 Russian case and using 44 Special dies for sizing and seating). I think they are a handy addition to the battery of reloading equipment and well worth the small price. BTW, I think this is true of the Lee Universal Decapping die, too.

Exactly!!

[wiljen]

I use the Lee universal too and have had no quarrels with it.

[405]

Anyone used the Lee Universal Case Expanding Die to expand case mouths to be able to easily insert cast bullets without any lead shaving, deforming, etc.? If so did it work okay and is it a worthwhile investment? Comments?

Depends on what you expect from your cast reloads. It is simply a flaring tool. Also, if you cast for and load only a couple of different cartridges and want the best outcome then something like the M die or other similar expanders w/flaring capability are well worth the investment. If you cast say .001 larger than groove diameter and use the regular neck expander button/decapping pin in the sizing die the neck may be left WAY undersized.... these systems were designed for loading jacketed bullets- not cast bullets. If you shoot soft plainbase cast, the WAY undersized neck will reduce the diameter of the soft cast bullet during seating. In most instances with normal cast loading the amount of neck tension on the bullet when seated is best if the ID of the neck is about .001 smaller than the cast bullet. Any more than that will not increase neck tension, may reduce the size of the bullet and surely will not help neck concentricity (loaded round all out of plumb). So I guess they are a decent flaring tool.

[462]

I use both the Lee universal and Lyman M dies. The Lee works but I prefer the Lyman.

[Willbird]

The M dies are not expensive if you just buy one die body and then get all the expander buttons seperate, I think the whole deal for every caliber I could think of was not a lot of money.

[mtgrs737]

The previous posters are correct, the Lee die flares and does not expand the case neck. So you need to size/expand the case neck to the size you need for cast boolits before flaring the case mouth and seating the cast boolit. Most die makere will provide you with the proper sized expander for your particular size cast boolit just for the asking. However if you shoot cast boolits that are several thousanths over the normal Jacketed bullet size then you will find that you are over sizing the necks of your brass and may soon find it to be work hardening the brass and causing splits in the neck area. Using the cast boolit to size the case neck during the seating process may be reducing the cast boolit diameter enough that the boolit is smaller than intended and causes leading due to a poorer fit. For my 6,5mm Swedish Mauser target rifle which has a larger than standard groove dia. I solved the undersized boolt problem by: buying a couple of Lee custom oversized moulds that cast fat .269+ boolts, having our very own Mr. Buckshot make a .2683" sizing die for my Lyman 450, sending in a new set of Lee Collet dies to Lee with a couple of fired cases and a sample of the boolits so that they could alter the collet die and seater die to correctly size the neck and seat the oversized boolit. I then bought a Lee universal flaring die, and a Lee Factory Crimp die to remove the case neck flare. I get no boolit dia. reduction and wear and tear on my brass case necks is minimal which should make them last much longer. The Lyman M die of the proper size should expand the case neck to the correct size, however the oversizing of the case neck by the sizing die may still cause shorter case life.

[3006mv]

but how do you remove the flare after you seat the bullet? i cannot crimp any more as the bottom of my die is already touching the top of the shell holder

[nagantguy]

In like the Lee universal flairing die, I size/deprime and then flare and then prime and seat. Have had good results with it. Don't own any Lyman m dies but plan to so I can't compare.

[762 shooter]

The Lee Factory Crimp die I got in my die set works well to close that flare.

I barely flare so I don't have much to fix.

762

[ballistim]

Anyone using the Lee Universal Case Expanding Die that would want to use it more in the way a Lyman M die works should go to NOE website
http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=88&osCsid=aq62eugapbpcd8jar8927d5in3
This link will take you to one of the pages with expander plugs they make to fit the Lee die. I've bought them for every caliber that I own guns for and they work great! I'm hoping they add more in between sizes in the future.

Tim

[762 shooter]

^^^^^^^^

This also.

762

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Anyone using the Lee Universal Case Expanding Die that would want to use it more in the way a Lyman M die works should go to NOE website
http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=88&osCsid=aq62eugapbpcd8jar8927d5in3
This link will take you to one of the pages with expander plugs they make to fit the Lee die. I've bought them for every caliber that I own guns for and they work great! I'm hoping they add more in between sizes in the future.

Tim Nowdays, this is absolutely the way to go. The Lyman product is good, but expensive relative to the Lee and poorly supported. Lee and NOE both do a better job with customer responsiveness by a huge margin.

[ballistim]

Nowdays, this is absolutely the way to go. The Lyman product is good, but expensive relative to the Lee and poorly supported. Lee and NOE both do a better job with customer responsiveness by a huge margin.

I've also bought multiple Lee dies so that I can leave some set-up for my most used caliber/cartridges. Previously I'd mentioned my hope that NOE would add more sizes, and they have but I would still suggest contacting them to add any size you need. Hopefully increased awareness of these being available will increase sales and they will make a complete line up of all diameters needed. Hats off to NOE for making a great product at a reasonable price!

[1Shirt]

I also use both the lee and Lyman, however recently, purchased some NOE expanders that work with the lee, and are much cheaper than the M-dies.
1Shirt!

[wallenba]

It was the only game in town for expanding the necks for my oversized cast boolits for my 8x56R Hungarian. Works well.

[FLHTC]

but how do you remove the flare after you seat the bullet? i cannot crimp any more as the bottom of my die is already touching the top of the shell holder

Factory Crimp die. One of the best tools Lee has

[ballistim]

Factory Crimp die. One of the best tools Lee has

Yep!!!

[MT Chambers]

save your money re: factory crimp die.......the lee universal does not alter case neck tension like the M-die does and only flares. If you want to remove flares, don't waste money on FCD use either your seating/crimping die or your FL size die set part way with the stem removed, all this is Reloading 101.

[Sticky]

Anyone using the Lee Universal Case Expanding Die that would want to use it more in the way a Lyman M die works should go to NOE website
http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=88&osCsid=aq62eugapbpcd8jar8927d5in3
This link will take you to one of the pages with expander plugs they make to fit the Lee die. I've bought them for every caliber that I own guns for and they work great! I'm hoping they add more in between sizes in the future.

TimRecently obtained a Lee universal expander and just ordered a mold and a buncha expander plugs from Noe to set up for all my loads. I think this will work out very well for loading casts!

[FLHTC]

save your money re: factory crimp die.......the lee universal does not alter case neck tension like the M-die does and only flares. If you want to remove flares, don't waste money on FCD use either your seating/crimping die or your FL size die set part way with the stem removed, all this is Reloading 101.
saying that a FCD is a waste of money is like saying carbide dies are too. There is more than one way to get a good crimp and the FCD does it the best for the money.

[gwpercle]

I use the Lee universal expander on all the handgun rounds I load for, semi-auto and revolver. Cals. 9 mm, 38/357 , 41, 44, and 45 . It works great on every one of them .
For my 30 cal. rifles I have a Lyman M die that I use because I got it before finding out about the Lee die.
I am starting to load for a 303 British no.4 mk I Lee Enfield and will use the Lee expander die because it works so well on everything else.
It is a very handy flairing tool and I like it a lot.
Gary

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

To stop the argument on the Lee FCD, everyone should remember there are two, not one, types of Lee FCD's. The rifle versions are exceptional, and the pistol can easily be modified to work well with cast boolits without sizing the boolits any more. Simply remove the extra case sizing ring in the pistol FCD and you've got an excellent crimp die for everything.

[MT Chambers]

The question still remains, why do you need it if you can crimp all you want and more with a std. set of dies?

[geargnasher]

Because the rifle FCD is more forgiving of slight variances in trim length than a roll crimp. .30-30 is a perfect example.

Gear

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

The question still remains, why do you need it if you can crimp all you want and more with a std. set of dies?

Same reasons you want a Forrester seater die and a separate crimp die when reloading rifle cartridges in a progressive. Improved versatility.

Most standard pistol die sets come with three dies and the seating/crimping is combined into one operation. I've found that generally, this forces one to make compromises between the seating and the crimping to get the die to work. If one is serious about improving the cartridges they are making, one of the simplest and easiest beginning to this is separating these two operations.

While I think expanding and powder dropping is a good combined operation, I do so because the expansion occurs slightly before the powder drop and inside the die, the other part by a case activated powder measure/mechanism and mostly outside the die. This allows one to find tune the two operations separately even though they're at a single station.

Seating/crimping, on the other hand, has an overlap of the two operations that cannot be adjusted out, so one has to compromise on one or the other to get both operations to work at the same time. Adjusting the combined operation is also mechanically more difficult, increasing the likelihood of a mistake.

Hence the desire to separate and improve the control over each operation. Improving the control reduces the chance of maladjustment, thereby improving over all round quality.

Viewed in this light, the easy adjust-ability of the Lee crimp dies, both the FCD and taper crimp dies, combined with the very competitive cost per die, make them a very desire-able product for those wanting to improve their cartridges.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Back to the OP question. The Lee expander die is inexpensive and offers excellent adjustability for low cost. Combine that with the Lyman M-die style expander buttons from NOE and you've got an excellent expander for cast boolits at a very reasonable price.

If you look over NOE's offerings and order, you can order a "set" of their expander inserts and make yourself some type of box to hold them. Add a single Lee die and you're started.

If you're loading progressively, you can add/purchase more of the inexpensive Lee dies as you go and replace their insert with the ideal NOE insert for your cast boolit application.

You can also use their powder through versions with a Lee powder through expanding die and a Lee Pro Auto Disk powder measure. (Lee's best powder measure and an excellent addition for the progressive reloader's bench when wanting more than one powder measures.)

The really lovely thing is due to the very reasonable cost of the die and great versatility of the inserts, you cannot lose from a financial standpoint. Just select the insert you need to fit your cast boolit, insert it in the die, put the die in your press, adjust it and you're on your way.

Speaking of which, since I have a Lee Universal expanding die sitting on the shelf and will soon be loading cast in both .223 and .308, I need to get busy and order another die and a set of those inserts.:cbpour:

[FLHTC]

The question still remains, why do you need it if you can crimp all you want and more with a std. set of dies?
Those who don't use one would ask that.