Lathe....First Time

[EMC45]

Got a chance to get on my Uncle's (Wife's Uncle) lathe for the first time. It is a LeBlond and it is OLD! I was trying to make a part for my MEC shotshell loader and on my last pass I took off too much! Imagine that! Here are some pics of some Rat Rods he built too. My gang are in the last pic ready for a ride! He has a bunch of tools and equipment that can be utilized for "gun stuff". Great guy too!!!http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm243/Evansguns/102_2316.jpghttp://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm243/Evansguns/102_2314.jpghttp://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm243/Evansguns/102_2312.jpg

[EMC45]

Any way to tighten up the chuck on one of these? It has a very small bit of wobble. It can be overcome with using a Live center I guess, but he was saying he wanted to get it all back tight. Any suggestions?

[Marvin S]

Kind of funny use of a boring bar holder you got going on there. Do you mean that the chuck is out of round? Is it a threaded spindle, it looks that way. Maybe the back plate was not the original one and is out of round.

[machinisttx]

Looks like the chuck and the threads are one piece, common on older chucks.

[scrapcan]

you might try to take the chuck off and clean the threads in chuck and on spindle really well. Doesn't take much to put some wobble in.

[bohica2xo]

First you need to define & quantify "wobble".

Are we talking about simple radial runout? An axial runout issue? How much runout?

Those old chucks with solid jaws were not too bad, but years of hard use can take it's toll.

The LeBlond has a threaded spindle, with a straight land. Some clearance is necessary to mount the chuck. Spin the chuck off of the spindle. To do this, put the machine in the lowest gear available. Place the chuck key in one of the holes, and smack it with a lead or brass hammer near the OD of the chuck. It is a right hand thread.

Once the chuck breaks loose, unscrew it from the spinde. A board should be placed over the ways under the chuck - it is heavier than you think.

After you remove it from the machine, take it to the area you clean really filthy things - a solvent tank if you have one. Use the chuck key to spin the scroll untill the jaws come out of the chuck. With a stiff brush & some solvent, clean the grooves in the face of the scroll. Turn the scroll with the chuck key, and clean through the jaw slots.

Once the chuck is clean, lightly oil the surfaces. Clean the teeth in the jaws & oil. Re-assemble the jaws, pay attention to the numbers stamped in them.

Clean the spindle nose & thread carefully. Oil it lightly with whatever you are using for way oil on the machine. Set the chuck on your board, and check the female thread & bore to be sure it is clean. Once the chuck is screwed on, turn it gently to meet the shoulder on the spindle. Now unscrew it a quarter to half turn. Tighten it again with a sharp twist or "snap" to seat it securely.

OK. Now the jaws & scroll are clean, the spindle is clean & everything is mounted correctly. Time to test for runout.

Clamp a piece of drill rod, or other ground & true shafting in the jaws fully. The shaft should extend into the chuck past the jaws, and hang out at least six inches over the bed.

First check the chuck for damage. Try a .001 feeler gauge at the tip of each jaw. If it goes between the jaw & the test bar, the jaws are sprung. Not the end of the world, but an issue to deal with. For feeler gauge stock, just look for the white plastic security device in a retail packace. Cut it open, there are two nice feeler gauges in every one...

Runout. Use a dial indicator, and whatever holding apparatus you are familar with. A magnetic base, clamp it to the toolpost - whatever. Test for runout right at the chuck, on the test bar. Mark the high spot with a sharpie, and write down the total indicator travel - if it is -.005 on the low side, and +.005 on the high side, you have a total runout of .010. This is the radial number at the chuck.

Now move the indicator down the bar as far as you can - six inches from the chuck is good. Test for runout again. If the runout is greater, how much is it? If the runout is the same, and the high spot is in the same place, all you have is simple radial runout. If it is much LESS than at the chuck, you likely have axial runout issues. If the high spot moves appreciably - axial runout again.

Now do one more favor for "Uncle". Buy a decent toolpost. Even a 200 buck Phase II is beter than that mess. You need a size "BXA" at least for that machine, and you can actually use a "CXA" on it. Poorly supported tools cause all sorts of trouble. All of that overhang on the old rocker is a recepie for disaster.

Right now you can buy an Enco BXA for about 170 bucks. Worth every penny in this application.

B.

[oneokie]

The chuck jaws look to be the 2 piece reversible to me. Look on the face of the jaws for socket head cap screws. If there, remove the cap screws and the top half of the jaw. Number or mark the jaws so you can put them back where they were originally. Some jaws have matching numbers already stamped on them. Check to see if the numbers match for each jaw.
Clean the mating surfaces and check for burrs.

[Buckshot]

............Ha, old doesn't mean bad or worn out. While that 15" LeBlond is on the smaller side for that manufacturer, they were all built to be worked like a mule (day in and day out) and last so long as some kind of maintanence was done on them periodically.

So far as wobble at the chuck goes, bohica2xo nailed it because 'wobble' can mean lots of different things and each can have a totally different remedy or degree of 'Oh NO!' attached to it. The chuck jaws look like 2 piece to me just seeing the end of that one. If you do take the chuck apart to clean and oil it, be sure once reinstalled on the lathe you stand to one side when you start it. Otherwise you'll soon have an oil racing stripe up your shirt, forehead, ceiling and back wall.

Looks like your uncle must also have a milling machine of some sort. I see a shell mill holder on an R8 collet on that shelf behind the lathe. I also agree you've got a heckuva bit of stickout there with your toolholder setup:lol: Looks like not only is the crosslide is backed off well, but the compound is also. Not good as rigidity in setups is the name of the game in any machine tool. You want to be as close to what you're turning as practicable.

You've got a nice looking family there too!

...............Buckshot

[bohica2xo]

Sorry, I did not notice that in the crappy monitor out in the shop.

It does appear to have two piece jaws. This is simply another place for a slob to clamp a bunch of chips. You will need to knock the top jaws off as well when you clean it up. Again, pay attention to the numbering on the top jaws, most of the time they are numbered to match the master jaws in the chuck body.

The good news is that you can run soft jaws on that chuck. US Shop Tools sells soft jaws so cheap anymore it is not worth making your own most of the time.

B.

[EMC45]

Once again the team here has come through! You guys are great and I appreciate all the info and will print it out for my Uncle. We knew we had some Rube Goldberg going on with our set up, but were limited to what we could do. He has a good bit of tooling for the lathe and mill. Yet he does not have a mill yet. He gets a good bit of his tooling at Hot Rod swap meets and other places. He has fly cutters, end mills, ball end mills, rough cutters etc. Also knurling tools, parting, threading, etc. etc. Wobble could mean a bunch of stuff, sorry for the vagueness. I would say more like runout. He has a indicator so that would be the first step and he has some drill rod as well. I am gonna print this out and let him take a look at it so as to see what the next angle of attack is. He has run a lathe for quite a couple years though and he schooled me on a good bit of stuff as well.

[John Guedry]

I ran a lathe similar to that one years ago and met one of the founders of the company who told me he had bought it second hand about 50 years before. I don't think you could wear 'em out. The chuck should be removable as someone else mentioned try removing it clean the threads and re-install it.

[EMC45]

Thanks Buckshot!

[scrapcan]

EMC45,

I think you need to take the other two old toys on a parts run. that red/green/rusty one looks like a whole heap of fun.

One other thing for you to check is headstock/tailstock alignment. If the chuck checks out you could be introducting error by use of a mal aligned tailstock.

[MtGun44]

I hope the white rod has air shocks or something. . . . . .

Bill

[EMC45]

The red/green one has a 454 with blower and the white one has a 350 and 3 sp. tranny. The white one has airbags. He drove the red one last year to Daytona and the white one this year. That's from the mid Ga area.

[semtav]

I've got pretty similiar Leblond. Started restoring it a couple years ago. Still not done.


http://castboolits.gunloads.com/picture.php?albumid=256&pictureid=1722

[andremajic]

If you do take the chuck apart to clean and oil it, be sure once reinstalled on the lathe you stand to one side when you start it. Otherwise you'll soon have an oil racing stripe up your shirt, forehead, ceiling and back wall.

:smile:

I still have that streak running up the wall in my garage!!!

[Willbird]

iIt is pretty much a fact of life that a 3 jaw universal will have SOME runout on about any dia of stock you chuck up. If the part needs to run dead true you go to a 4 jaw. BUT on those kinds of chucks which have 3 pinions, I have seen times where using the same pinion to tighten the chuck every time will make it behave in a more consistent fashion.

The Hendy Lathe I had, when my Dad got it the 3 jaw had been on there for years before he got it, it refused to come off with any method, so he unbolted the chuck from the backplate, and machined the backplate off the spindle...then made a new backplate, that was a better solution than breaking teeth off the back gear like some folks have done resorting to "gorilla" tactics to loosen a chuck that has been in place for too long.

Also there is nothing WRONG with a lantern tool post, yes an Aloris type can be a nice add on....but it is not going to let you produce parts that are light years better.

[Buckshot]

Also there is nothing WRONG with a lantern tool post, yes an Aloris type can be a nice add on....but it is not going to let you produce parts that are light years better.

...........Very true. A lantern toolpost can be very handy for tool heights and built in rake. The one real problem is with tool changes, and if you're going to be making a bunch of one thing, or something with a few different features on it, tool changing will just slap wear a guy to a frazzle :-)

..............Buckshot