Heavier weight 45 LC hollow points

[Changeling]

Look out I'm starting to think again, then on the other hand this might be an idea if it hasn't been done already.

I was thinking about taking a RCBS mold (45 270-SWC) and having it hollow pointed. With the right boolet alloy it just might make an awesome projectile for Deer hunting. Haven't worked out everything yet, like who can set up the mold for hollow points, still thinking, dangerous situation.

What do you guys think?

[leftiye]

Sounds good to me! 45Colts tend to run into a wall with boolits much heavier than 300 grains - but I'm thinking about a 325 grain HP for my 454.

[Bass Ackward]

Look out I'm starting to think again, then on the other hand this might be an idea if it hasn't been done already. With the right boolet alloy it just might make an awesome projectile for Deer hunting. What do you guys think?


Uh huh. It isn't what we think, it's what you define. WHAT constitutes "the right alloy" ? And at what range and velocity?

Hollow points are best out of soft metal so that they hang together. Fact is, that if you use soft enough metal to get the bullet to hang together well, then you usually DON'T NEED a hollow point. A hollow pointing is only beneficial if you define (and discipline) shot angles so that excess penetration is reduced when countered by expansion. That also depends on "strike velocity" or minimum and maximum ranges that you intend to use it.

Hollow pointing is the act of making something small, get bigger easier. If your slug is already at the desired size, what do you gain? In big bore handguns, using a hollow point can DRAMATICALLY improve results on game at longer ranges as velocity drops but not without extending the "minimum" (close) range at which you can shoot.

Since most game is shot at 100 yards or less, hollow pointing can actually turn out to be counter productive. Just to give you more to think about.

[yondering]

Sounds good to me! 45Colts tend to run into a wall with boolits much heavier than 300 grains - but I'm thinking about a 325 grain HP for my 454.

Huh? you must be talking about SAA guns, not Rugers. Changeling has a Ruger.

Changeling, if you want a heavier HP boolit, look into the Lyman 457122 HP. It casts at 330gr, and can easily be sized down to .452 for your purposes. It is my most accurate 45 Colt heavy boolit.
270gr really isn't a "heavy" 45 Colt boolit when you're talking about a Ruger IMO, more like a medium weight.

[beagle]

I hollowpointed a RCBS 45-325-FN-U mould and downsize to .452" in a .45 Colt Blackhawk. It runs 321 grains sized and lubed. I have had nothing but good results with this modification.

I've tried both the 457122 and the 457191 both hollowpointed in the .45 Colt. The 457122 is a bit too long in the nose but shoots good. The 457191HP also shoots good.

But, the winner is the RCBS over 17.0 grains of Lil Gun for 1053 FPS.......and according to Hogdon, this is the starting load but is plenty for me and what I want it for./beagle

[44man]

I have to agree with both Bass and Beagle. Fast with a hollow point gains nothing but a little slower is OK.
You do NOT want a .45 boolit to expand too fast on game and a slower hollow point can still penetrate.
Best to just have a good meplat.

[Bucks Owin]

Huh? you must be talking about SAA guns, not Rugers. Changeling has a Ruger.

Changeling, if you want a heavier HP boolit, look into the Lyman 457122 HP. It casts at 330gr, and can easily be sized down to .452 for your purposes. It is my most accurate 45 Colt heavy boolit.
270gr really isn't a "heavy" 45 Colt boolit when you're talking about a Ruger IMO, more like a medium weight. I had the same thought, sizing this boolit to .454-5" for my fat throated .45 BH. Can someone tell me what size the 270 RCBS falls from the mold at BTW?....Dennis

[Changeling]

Huh? you must be talking about SAA guns, not Rugers. Changeling has a Ruger.

Changeling, if you want a heavier HP boolit, look into the Lyman 457122 HP. It casts at 330gr, and can easily be sized down to .452 for your purposes. It is my most accurate 45 Colt heavy boolit.
270gr really isn't a "heavy" 45 Colt boolit when you're talking about a Ruger IMO, more like a medium weight.

You're exactly right the RCBS 270-SWC is not a heavy bullet, or light (285gr WW), but out of a 45LC (Ruger,thanks) it is what I think (no facts Bass Awkward) would be an awesome projectile with enough but not to much velocity to be absolutely great on Deer inside 100 yards. I could be wrong but I have been really thinking about it.

Alloy, well it won't be WW not malleable enough, maybe a mixture of WW and ?, maybe another alloy all together. But I really believe my thoughts have merit.

Diners ready, got to go, later.

[Changeling]

You're exactly right the RCBS 270-SWC is not a heavy bullet, or light (285gr WW), but out of a 45LC (Ruger,thanks) it is what I think (no facts Bass Awkward) would be an awesome projectile with enough but not to much velocity to be absolutely great on Deer inside 100 yards. I could be wrong but I have been really thinking about it.

Alloy, well it won't be WW not malleable enough, maybe a mixture of WW and ?, maybe another alloy all together. But I really believe my thoughts have merit.

Diners ready, got to go, later.

Evidently others thought this idea had merit, I see it is now in the proposed molds section for purchase. Make sure you have the spud size correct for your velocity and alloy.:bigsmyl2:

[bobke]

just another thought out loud, but what happens if you take your wheelweight metal and anneal it in an oven, say 300d for an hour and a slow cool in the oven. been too long since i've done it, but seems it would provide a very uniform metal structure and if you played with the time/temp, you could get them down to 10-12bhn without having to configure a new alloy to do so. save the headache of melting or acquiring a new alloy. don't hear too much about annealing, mostly about hardening/quenching using an oven. can work both ways.

[outdoorfan]

I had the same thought, sizing this boolit to .454-5" for my fat throated .45 BH. Can someone tell me what size the 270 RCBS falls from the mold at BTW?....Dennis

Seems to be .454-.455

[leftiye]

I guess you're right about my perspective. !6.0 grains of Blue dot behind a 250 grain Lee split cases though (1250 fps chrono'd). This was the best I could do with those pressure signs. This is in the standard .45 Colt chamber that Saami puts at only .486" (for .472 diameter cartridges), and pressures in the 21,000 psi range (just expanded too fast). The 300 grainers won't fly very fast at or below these pressures. This has kept me from going hog wild in my 45 L.C. Ruger bisley model. It may not damage the gun, but splitting cases doesn't make my ulcers happy. With a minimum chamber though...... But I'm just a woos though I guess, my favorite load in my .454 is 1300 fps with AA#9 and an RCBS 300 grain rnfpgc.

[Dale53]

We are running a Group Buy on the MiHec two cavity Cramer Style mould for the RCBS .45-270-SAA mould at:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=75615

Dale53

[Changeling]

I guess you're right about my perspective. !6.0 grains of Blue dot behind a 250 grain Lee split cases though (1250 fps chrono'd). This was the best I could do with those pressure signs. This is in the standard .45 Colt chamber that Saami puts at only .486" (for .472 diameter cartridges), and pressures in the 21,000 psi range (just expanded too fast). The 300 grainers won't fly very fast at or below these pressures. This has kept me from going hog wild in my 45 L.C. Ruger bisley model. It may not damage the gun, but splitting cases doesn't make my ulcers happy. With a minimum chamber though...... But I'm just a woos though I guess, my favorite load in my .454 is 1300 fps with AA#9 and an RCBS 300 grain rnfpgc.


I hear you buddy, I don't have them and am trying best I can not to get them, Hopefully, but sometimes the post answers just get to one! Thanks for your reply.
It's odd, that so many problems could be solved if Ruger would just adhere to some chamber specifications that would be productive to there business model and promote a definite safety margin to the users of there firearms/Revolvers.
Eventually someone will be hurt and traceable to there specification negligence and be liable to there lack of competence engineering. Actually it is so small of an engineering change on there part it's ridiculous. But I suppose they feel safe in producing an inferior design relative to chamber dimensions. After all, it's there company.

[bobke]

i think the warranty goes out the door with handloads, so any mishaps created by firing same might be on the guy doing the loading or firing, not strictly the manufacturer. no doubt, ruger could stand to upgrade their quality standards for certain, and likely not cost much to do so, but production rates rule, not rework costs. kinda makes you wonder how much you save doing something twice.

[MtGun44]

Heck, it's an awesome boolit for deer with a solid point! Hollow point can't
hurt, may bloody up more meat, tho.

Bill

[Bucks Owin]

Seems to be .454-.455 Perfect. Thanks. I'm about to test some 457191 292 gr sized down to .454" with 457122 330 gr "Gould" to follow next. I'll keep y'all posted...:Fire:

[Changeling]

Perfect. Thanks. I'm about to test some 457191 292 gr sized down to .454" with 457122 330 gr "Gould" to follow next. I'll keep y'all posted...:Fire:

Read up on all the information you can find on spud sizes (piece of metal that makes the HP), also the different alloys that should be used.

The spud size is directly related to the alloy/velocity/caliber for really good results, the velocity range is not very large so you have to consider what caliber/velocity you want to use first and then the alloy mix.

[Bucks Owin]

Huh? you must be talking about SAA guns, not Rugers. Changeling has a Ruger.

Changeling, if you want a heavier HP boolit, look into the Lyman 457122 HP. It casts at 330gr, and can easily be sized down to .452 for your purposes. It is my most accurate 45 Colt heavy boolit.
270gr really isn't a "heavy" 45 Colt boolit when you're talking about a Ruger IMO, more like a medium weight. I think so too. I fired some sized down 457191 292 gr @ from 1150 to 1270 fps yesterday, and the accuracy looked promising right out of the gate. A 270 HP would likely be a nice "all around" Ruger weight though if accurate. The MiHec 270 SAA mold deal that is underway is tempting! ...JMO, Dennis:Fire:

[Changeling]

I think so too. I fired some sized down 457191 292 gr @ from 1150 to 1270 fps yesterday, and the accuracy looked promising right out of the gate. A 270 HP would likely be a nice "all around" Ruger weight though if accurate. The MiHec 270 SAA mold deal that is underway is tempting! ...JMO, Dennis:Fire:

A 270/280 gr bullet will blast through the biggest deer that ever lived relative to meplat diameter (.320/.340/.360 and hardness of the projectile as 44Man has said so often. When someone who has been there seen it and done it, talks , maybe you should listen.

If you don't agree, no problem, do it your way!!!!

[yondering]

A 270/280 gr bullet will blast through the biggest deer that ever lived relative to meplat diameter (.320/.340/.360 and hardness of the projectile as 44Man has said so often. When someone who has been there seen it and done it, talks , maybe you should listen.

If you don't agree, no problem, do it your way!!!!

What would you know about it? Based on your posts, you haven't even fired your 45 Colt yet, but you're giving advice on bullets to use for deer?

Some people prefer to think and experiment for themselves, rather than believe everything they read from the internet experts.

[Changeling]

What would you know about it? Based on your posts, you haven't even fired your 45 Colt yet, but you're giving advice on bullets to use for deer?

Some people prefer to think and experiment for themselves, rather than believe everything they read from the internet experts.

What I know about it is researching the subject from people like Taffin and Fryxell, I also contacted Eric at Bullet Hollow Pointing service who has been known to Hollow point a few molds plus some other sources I won't divulge to you because of your moronic attack on me.
They are the Internet experts that I believe have the expertise to know a few things about the subject that you don't know, not that you know anything but how to be a rude jerk. I gave correct information. If for some reason you can't act like an adult and ask in an appropriate manner, forget about ever getting a reply from me. You contribute NOTHING to the subject but your rude ignorance.
You go right ahead and experiment on your own, we'll see how long it takes for you to learn to take advantage of the expertise of others willing to give it and save people a lot of money and testing for something that has been already done.
Since this isn't the first time you have attacked me please refrain from EVER commenting on another of my posts. Your kind of input is not needed so you and a couple of your friends can act like the Internet experts that you are NOT!

Now you run along and tell the system administrator that the bad man got tired of my **** and jumped on me, LOL!

You're correct in saying I haven't fired my 45 Colt, (I have a 45 RUGER), and I have been getting all the things I need for it, not that is any of your business whatsoever.

Try contributing to the knowledge base instead of hampering it. People doing what you are is the very reason why one of the forums has up a sign about "come on in lurkers", for what, so they can be attacked by your type?

[Dale53]

People, people, people!! Let's place nice!

We all have something to contribute here. If you don't agree, then just don't reply. Fighting amongst ourselves won't get ANYTHING accomplished.

Understand, this great advice comes from a guy who has recently been reprimanded on another forum for speaking a bit harshly (me).

Let's all just back up a step, simmer down, and get to be friends again.

FWIW
Dale53

[Changeling]

People, people, people!! Let's place nice!

We all have something to contribute here. If you don't agree, then just don't reply. Fighting amongst ourselves won't get ANYTHING accomplished.

Understand, this great advice comes from a guy who has recently been reprimanded on another forum for speaking a bit harshly (me).

Let's all just back up a step, simmer down, and get to be friends again.

FWIW
Dale53

I totally agree with you Dale I think/believe I have been more that courteous to everyone on the forum. However when someone attacks me on more than one occasion I think I have a right to protect myself and answer the allegations, This is what I did.
Sorry if I offended anyone not associated with the problem.

[yondering]

I totally agree with you Dale I think/believe I have been more that courteous to everyone on the forum. However when someone attacks me on more than one occasion I think I have a right to protect myself and answer the allegations, This is what I did.
Sorry if I offended anyone not associated with the problem.

Sounds like some explanation is in order. I'm not going to argue about this, but will explain myself once.

Changeling, I didn't "attack" you, any more than your post was attacking Bucks Owin. I was calling you on the BS of saying "when 44man speaks maybe you should listen". Criticizing someone for not believing everything they read on the internet is a little backwards, don't you think? Bucks Owin shared the results of his experimenting, and you ridiculed him for not doing it "your" way.

As for telling me I've contributed nothing, read back up at the top of this thread. Your post title is "Heavier weight 45 LC hollow points", I responded with a very good option for a heavier 45 Colt hollow point. I've also offered advice in many of your threads, based on my own experiences.

Please don't talk to me about not contributing here; that's the pot calling the kettle black. The only "contributions" I've seen from you are just repeats of other people's thoughts; most of your posts are requests for information that could have been found in a simple search.

Much of what I know about cast bullets is information I've learned here, but everything that I claim to know has been verified by my own experiences. My criticism of you was for repeating unverified information, and ridiculing others for not doing the same.

Even if your information was from a trusted online source, you don't know it to be true if you've never tried it, and yet a number of your posts lately have presented other's information as if it were something you know to be true. That's not contributing, that just hot air.

You're right about one thing, I do find most of your posts annoying, because many of them are worded to get a lot of responses and heated discussion, without adding much value to the forum; aka, borderline trolling. Not this particular thread, but many others.

[Bucks Owin]

Sure a 270 HP would be fine on a deer. Actually, the original black powder .45 Colt load has dropped more than a few critters such as buffalo, grizzly, runaway horses etc. The "lesser" .44/40, even more of 'em! But since we're talking HEAVY bullets in the .45 Colt, that means 300+ grs to me. From 255 to 270 ain't much of a jump....No one respects 44man's opinion any more than I do, in fact I sometimes ask his advice "behind the scenes". His is the voice of experience not theory! As to "Heavy .45 LC bullets", HP or not, I've found that when you step up to a 300 gr @ 1250 fps level, the .45 Ruger becomes a whole different animal! I'm enjoying the heck out of playing with these handheld thunderbolts. Penetration? In spades! Can't wait to try some 457122's now! [smilie=w: I can understand your enthusiasm regarding the .45 LC Changeling, and reading about and theorizing about various aspects of reloading and ballistics of same. I do it too. I dearly want a .500 WE to play with and I gobble up anything written about that cartridge that I can find. But what I'm most interested in, is folks who actually shoot one. Their opinion means the most to me. Savvy?....:wink: Dennis (who also thinks you need to actually SHOOT your .45 Colt! :razz:)....Photo: Hardcast 335 gr .45 Colt http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a356/BucksOwin/RossSeyfried45Linebaugh335grhardcas.gif Link to article: http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/article.cfm?tocid=321&magid=24

[Changeling]

I'll shoot the Ruger when I get it finished and not before, if anyone doesn't like the way I do things I really don't give a dam.

If you don't like my posts, try not answering.

[Bucks Owin]

I'll shoot the Ruger when I get it finished and not before, if anyone doesn't like the way I do things I really don't give a dam.

If you don't like my posts, try not answering. Huh! Pardon me sonny.... (And "dam" is spelled damn) [smilie=l: