Need help picking a revolver from three choices.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Howdy all,

First, though I work on a lot of revolvers, I'm not a "revolver" guy, but am buying one because the wife picked out a 642 and if I'm going to reload for it, I might as well have a pistol I can reload for as well.

Here's what I'll be doing with the gun:

1. Reloading .38 special brass with 158 grain RNFP and a low powder charge, then shooting it at the range for fun, including the occasionall PPC match in the spring of the year.

2. The rest of the time and the vast majority of the time, this pistol will be hanging in a hand made leather holster designed for the purpose behind the headboard of the bed. (My babies have babies and live in another state, so safety IS NOT a concern.) It will be used as a tool, if needed, to help me get from the bed to my 12 gauge pump located near the bed in the middle of the night. In this role, it will be loaded with premium quality defensive ammunition from Federal, Winchester or Hornady.

3. I much prefer a 4" barrel in a 38/357 when I've shot them. I have medium sized hands and I do know how to handle a revolver vs. a pistol.

Note: I already have S&W adjustable rear sights, springs, screws, side plates, old style color case hardened match triggers and hammers on hand. I already have all the tools needed to perform a quality trigger job, reliability package and forcing cone tune. I already have a milling machine on hand to cut for a rear sight.

Here are my options:

1. Pick up one of those used model 64's J&G sales is advertising for $200.00.

2. Pick up a S&W Model 66 for about $400.00 from another distributor.

3. Look for a used 686 and get one of those.

4. Pick up a new/used Ruger GP100. On these guns, I generally use the parts they come with to tune them.

Your thoughts?

Dave

[crgaston]

Get the 64, or hold out for a 67 or 15. If you're just going to use it as a .38, it'll be more accurate and efficient that way. Also, if you're considering it for defensive use, the .38's have an ejector rod stroke that's longer than the magnums by the difference of the length of the cylinders, so ejection is more positive, even compared to using .38's in a .357. Final advantage is that you'll only have to fool with one type of brass and die setup for both the 642 and your K frame. It's certainly not a bad dilemma to have.

[jhrosier]

...
Your thoughts?...

The 686 is a dandy gun.

http://images16.fotki.com/v352/photos/5/590147/2786028/pc686p1-vi.jpg

And you just never know when a seventh shot might come in handy.;)

Jack

[Bullshop Junior]

Get the cheapest one if you don't care what you get, or get the one that you like best.
I would get the used model 64 for $200

[Bullshop Junior]

The 686 is a dandy gun.

http://images16.fotki.com/v352/photos/5/590147/2786028/pc686p1-vi.jpg

And you just never know when a seventh shot might come in handy.;)

Jack


Thats is a Dirty Harry gun, when Harry want to play Dirty.............
;)

[OutHuntn84]

I've always been fond of the 66.

[Mk42gunner]

The Model 64 sounds good to me, and I have had a couple of GP-100s and S&W 586/686s.

It is very hard to beat a fixed sight K-frame with standard grips and a Tyler grip adapter.

Robert

[dubber123]

Get the 64, or hold out for a 67 or 15. If you're just going to use it as a .38, it'll be more accurate and efficient that way. Also, if you're considering it for defensive use, the .38's have an ejector rod stroke that's longer than the magnums by the difference of the length of the cylinders, so ejection is more positive, even compared to using .38's in a .357. Final advantage is that you'll only have to fool with one type of brass and die setup for both the 642 and your K frame. It's certainly not a bad dilemma to have.

Given your intended usage, the above answer is about as complete as you can get. The 64's are a nice piece, and the K frame S&W's in 4" handle great. If VERY high volume shooting was in order, the beefier 686 would get the nod. In .38, it's pretty hard to wear out a K-frame.

[EOD3]

I know you said "one of these" but the revolver I use for bump-in-the-night is a Ruger Security Six w/4" barrel (adjustable sights) there is also a Speed Six which has fixed sights. You can usually pick one up at a reasonable price and they're solid as a tank. :smile:

[Lloyd Smale]

id buy the cheapest k frame 4 inch smith i could find. Used to be alot of police trade ins on the market cheap. theyve kind of dried up but you still can find one being resold if you watch the gunshops. Most of them have finish wear from being carried but have been shot sparingly.

[Houndog]

Get the 64!!! I got mine from Nuclear Fuel Services when they "upgraded" to Glocks. It has holster wear, but was almost like new mechanically. Ask yourself these questions: Do you really need a tricked out revolver for home protection? How will a trigger job and adjustable sights make the gun better for home defense use? I left mine as it came from the factory and just made SURE it's internals were up to snuff. I load mine with 158gr Speer Gold Dots over 5.0gr Unique. It shoots to point of aim and the Gold Dots WILL get er done if need be!

Just MY$.02

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Get the 64!!! I got mine from Nuclear Fuel Services when they "upgraded" to Glocks. It has holster wear, but was almost like new mechanically. Ask yourself these questions: Do you really need a tricked out revolver for home protection?

Home defense isn't the only intended use.

How will a trigger job and adjustable sights make the gun better for home defense use?

Makes it more accurate and more reliable.


Regards,

Dave

[StarMetal]

Given your intended usage, the above answer is about as complete as you can get. The 64's are a nice piece, and the K frame S&W's in 4" handle great. If VERY high volume shooting was in order, the beefier 686 would get the nod. In .38, it's pretty hard to wear out a K-frame.

It's not only the power of the cartridge that wears out a revolver, it's also the repeated use of it's mechanical system too. For example the cylinder timing and indexing doesn't have much to do with the power of the cartridge.

Joe

[Bucks Owin]

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a356/BucksOwin/Rugertank.jpgHere's my choice, GP 100. Check the gun auctions for a reasonably priced one. Spend the extra money you would have spent on a S&W to buy practice ammo....JMO, Dennis

[MtGun44]

Slightly outside of your list, but I have a couple of S&W Mod 14s (basically the K38) with
6" bbl and target sights. These are VERY accurate pistols, really they help you to train up to
their capability. Great single action out of the box, dbl is very good. I paid a bit under
$300 for the latest one. It has finish wear and a really ugly PD inventory number electric
penciled on the side plate (WHAT WERE THEY THINKING!!!??) but is mechanically excellent.

I find that the 4" guns (which I really DO like for carrying) just will not shoot as accurately
for me, an issue when I am trying to improve my skills by practicing.

Any K frame Smith is a near perfect tool. The details if HB vs std, ramped frt sight vs Patridge,
adjustable rear vs fixed, target trigger/hammer vs standard are just styling and minor
differences for target vs carry. All are wonderful guns and you just about cannot wear
one out with .38 Spl, decidedly not the case with hot .357 Mags in the mag chambered Ks.

I have a 6" Security Six SS Ruger, and it is very accurate and strong enough to digest a lot
of hot .357 Mags if you are so inclined. I don't know how closely the GP100 is to the Sec Six,
but the used Sec Sixes are out there and the action on mine is very nice with a Bulleys spring
kit and some simple flat polishing of the internals on 600 grit wet or dry with light oil on a
glass plate. No rocket science in polishing up the Ruger's guts.


Bill

[MT Gianni]

Dave, I would buy a cheap Uncle Mikes holster for the bedroom and use the leather one you made to pack it in. Some tans can eat a finish if they are left holstered.

[Dframe]

Get the cheapest one if you don't care what you get, or get the one that you like best.
I would get the used model 64 for $200
What he said!

[trickyasafox]

I'd get the 64- but thats just me projecting as I want to order one of those things :)

[dubber123]

It's not only the power of the cartridge that wears out a revolver, it's also the repeated use of it's mechanical system too. For example the cylinder timing and indexing doesn't have much to do with the power of the cartridge.

Joe

True, but I would still lay money on a K-frame .357 getting loose long before a K-frame .38. Round count is round count, but the added pounding of an extra 20K+ Psi. does take it's toll. My old M10 was bought used, and probably has 50,000 rounds through it. Other than wearing out 1 mainspring, it is untouched. I would not expect a K-frame .357 to make it through in the same condition.

[NickSS]

I would buy the model 64 as it will cost you less money and you already have the know how and parts to make it from a DA only the a DA/SA as well as tune it up. It does not appear that you plan on making it your primary shooting iron so you will be out less cash this way. If you want a gun to shoot and shoot with hot ammo I would get the GP100. I recently added one of them to my collection and it has a good feel and is strong as a tank. Mine shoots good too. I also have a fix sight GP 100 in 38 special without the under lug. I picked it up cheap from a guy who wanted an auto pistol and did not like what the dealer offered him for it. It also shoots very well and is regulated for 158 gr loads to hit a 25 yard pistol target X ring with a 6 o"clock hold. Either of them would serve you well and cost less than a smith will if bought new.

[sargenv]

Of those three, I'd pick the 686 over the other two... I have both a GP100 and 686 and I prefer the 686. I've fired the lighter frame guns and never really cared for them.

[machinisttx]

Well, I'm a bit biased...but since you ask.....

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b20/imakechips/gun%20stuff/100_0808.jpg

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b20/imakechips/smith%20and%20wesson/100_0831.jpg

[jnovotny]

I've had the S&W's and the Rugers, and for the money I like the S&W 686. Although the little security six from Ruger I had was a real good and accurate shooter. Even the GP100 that I had was pretty good in the accuracy department. The 686 in a 6 inch barrel was the most accurate of all. Man I need to buy another one now, currently the only .357 I have are a pair of consecutive numbered Ruger Vaqeros. What a pickle you have put me in, thought I could live with out a double action .357.[smilie=b: :lovebooli:castmine:

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Dave, I would buy a cheap Uncle Mikes holster for the bedroom and use the leather one you made to pack it in. Some tans can eat a finish if they are left holstered.

Gianni,

Thanks for that information, I'd let the tanning chemicals consideration slip my mind and an Uncle Mike's is a lot cheaper for the application. Be easy to find a flash light holster to go with it as well.

Regards,

Dave

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

A consideration I forgot to mention in the original posting is the 66 comes with an adjustable sight, so this would eliminate the machining time and extra cost of adding an adjustable rear sight, even though it's more expensive out of the box.

So far, the votes are 9 for the Model 64, 1 for the 66 and 3 for the 686. Any further votes/thoughts/input on the revolvers?

Thank you,

Dave

[MT Gianni]

My 14 had to be rebuilt due to lots of DA shooting. I dread the thoughts of a DA only gun and was shocked to seeonly one vote for the 66. I'd jump at one for $400, I paid $500 for my 2 1/2" 66 and am very happy with it. {vote early and vote often}.

[Changeling]

Good grief buy them ALL. You can always sell, yea right. I've always told myself that, but I just can't seem to sell anything, LOL.

[Bass Ackward]

Here are my options:

1. Pick up one of those used model 64's J&G sales is advertising for $200.00.

2. Pick up a S&W Model 66 for about $400.00 from another distributor.

3. Look for a used 686 and get one of those.

4. Pick up a new/used Ruger GP100. On these guns, I generally use the parts they come with to tune them.

Your thoughts?

Dave


357 is sorta like motorcycles. You can start small, but you end up big no matter what logic you apply to the process.

Gun weight is the most over looked factor to accurate shooting. I don't care if it's squibbs or more. And placing the gun in a mechanical rest tells you nothing if you can't reproduce it yourself. Increase gun weight and you can toss the rest.

From what you list, I would get a GP100. Had one and it was tank like and accurate. Then I graduated.

Look at an N-frame 357. Was the origional way it was supposed to be. Way to big for the cartridge. Way too heavy for the cartridge. And all I own these days.

Suspenders for an older man set you free as far as gun weight is concerned.

[BOOM BOOM]

HI,
I CAN NOT FAULT EATHER THE s&w 686 or the RUGER GP100.

[Joni Lynn]

There's no bad choices there.

[9.3X62AL]

What Joni said.

[Lloyd Smale]

never owned one but my vote goes to the 686

[Bucks Owin]

Glad I'm a single action guy, my choice never wavers...OM or FT Blackhawk! :bigsmyl2: (Or a FA if my ship ever makes it..."I'm over here!"[smilie=s:)

[TDC]

With all the smithing capability you have I'd go with the 64 or try for a 65.

You're limited to 38 Specials in the 64 model number. You could put a bull barrel in any length on it, a Bo-Mar target rib, quality target grips and have it all in one inexpensive package. You may want to hold out for the 64's brother, the 65... so you could have the option of using .357 Mag loads if you would later choose to.

I've been a S&W collector for decades and have held and shot most all the frame sizes, models and calibers. There is a reason some particular models are in very high demand. In .357 caliber the K frame 66/19s are highly sought after, not only because they are no longer in production, but because they handle and balance so well. The 4" 64/65s are on the same "K" frame and are simply a fixed sight, "bare bones" 66 for those who aren't familiar with S&W. The "K" frames drawback is they can shoot loose with frequently digested very heavy loads.

Next is the 686 "L" frame. Developed to replace the .357 "K" frames to solve the heavy hot load wear problems of the "K". A very wise and popular choice, especially with the use of frequent hot magnum loads. The drawback is the sacrifice to a larger frame size than the "K", as well as a very high new or used price due to its popularity.

When I carry a .357, or simply want to shoot one, it is either a 2 1/2" 66-1 or my all time .357 favorite... a Mod. 27-2 5" 'N' frame...

I'd recommend anyone trying to decide which would suit their needs best should visit their local gun store or a large gun show, handle them all, and don't base your decision on other opinions... When you find choices as vast as the S&W line-up you're sure to find the ideal frame/grip size that fits for you....

JMHO :drinks:

[machinisttx]

The L frame was designed to eliminate the weak point of the K frame, which was the barrel shank where it comes through the frame. On a K frame, the bottom of the barrel must be milled flat to allow the yoke to close. With heavy use of 125 grain magnum loads, this weak spot will crack, ruining the barrel. I have doubts that the L frame will handle a steady diet of 1400 fps 158 grain loads any better than the K frames, but it won't have the problem of cracked barrels with 125 grain loads like the K frame. The K frame has been around since the 1890's, and it wasn't until 1955 that metallurgy had improved enough for the K frame to handle the .357(there are some slight differences in magnum versus standard frames though).

If S&W hadn't put that goofy full length underlug on the L frame models(619 and 620 excluded), most folks probably wouldn't be able to tell any difference between them and a K frame....they just aren't that much different.

[Dale53]

I bought a used LEO Model 15 in very good shape (shot little carried more) and gave it to my son for a "house gun". They are around, are reasonably priced and are a wonderful handgun for the use you envision.

Dale53

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Went to a local shop yesterday and handled several pistols. Unfortunately, they didn't have a Model 66 in stock. I did manage to handle the Model 64, a Ruger GP100 and a couple of other pistols. (Odd, you would think after working on so many, I would have evaluated them for myself, but I never have, other than to fire them for function/accuracy. Never thought about the ergonomics for myself, as I still prefer pistols.)

I didn't care for the balance of the 64 in my hand, it may have been the rubber grip, which felt clunky to me, but the gun just didn't "sit" in my hand well. I really liked the balance and heft of the Ruger GP100 in 6", but am not excited about the amount of work to smooth up a Ruger's innards.

Another complication is I have an opportunity to buy a Model 28 Highway Patrol N frame, blued steel, with a 6" barrel for $400.00. This gun is about 98% as is and has been shot very little. Owned by an old business acquaintance. Would take very little smithing I suspect.

[MT Gianni]

Dave, That mod 28 will more than fit your needs.

[Super38]

I hate to bring in another one but the Colt Trooper MK III is a fantasitc choice in your price range. I picked one up recently for way under $300 with 3 grips and a shoulder holster. Shoots both .357/.38, nice heavy barrel, smooth trigger and good adjustable sights.

Although, I've been looking at the J&G 64 for a .38 only gun, the Colt is a smooth shooter.

Super38

[dubber123]

Dave, That mod 28 will more than fit your needs.

The only thing I would mention against the N-frame Smiths, is the short cylinder they put on them for some unknown reason. It limits the nose length on many booliits, the 358429, and RCBS 180 Sil come to mind. The RCBS will fit in my Chiefs Special, but not in my 27 or 28. :roll: Great guns otherwise.

[405]

If you stick with 38s then hard to beat a S&W 15 or 67. Those N frame guns are beefy for certain and almost yell," 44 Special", not 357 :). Like others have said.... shop around and be patient in the used market. If one of the K frame guns you picked up didn't "feel" right don't forget there are all manner of grips available that will likely provide the best feel.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

After a few more days of handling various revolvers at local outlets, I managed to get my hands on a S&W 686, six shot in 4" with factory Hogue grips. (Amazing, when you're interested in a gun for yourself, none come into the shop for repair/tuning of that type. Must be a rule or something.)

The gun balanced perfectly in my hand and the sights came right up aligned when I held a corrrect revolver grip. I think I've found my "keeper" revolver in .357.

As far as the N frames go, I recently stumbled across a great deal on some Lyman .44special/magnum dies made in the eighties. Just need a mold, a sizer, some brass and I'll be ready to add a pistol in that caliber.......

Thank you for all your input. Greatly reduced confusion related to revolvers from a shooting aspect.

Dave

[Dale53]

Dave;
I believe that you'll be VERY happy with your choice. I have enjoyed my 686's for some time (my first was a 4" barreled CS-1). The 4" is one of the most useful field revolvers ever. It also makes a fine defense weapon. It shoots well (NRA Bullseye level) with both .38 Wadcutters and full house Keith loads. Further, it'll shoot that way for several generations if you take care of it.

Shoot Center!!
Dale53