Oops, I am an idiot.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

I know, I know, I am an idiot.

I attempted to plain base a gas check mould using the dowel and sand paper trick and here is what I got. In all reality it is not to bad. However the little flange left on the base of the boolits is annoying to size out.

I was wondering if anybody on this forum could fix it. I think that the top of the blocks will have to be filed down just ever so slightly to get rid of the flange, and then the GC portion properly plain based. How much might this cost me?

P.S. Just incase you all where worried, that boolit is a reject.

[Bullshop Junior]

Size them Nose first, then lube them, and they will be just fine!

[2ndAmendmentNut]

Size them Nose first, then lube them, and they will be just fine!

You mean with a lee style sizer die, then lube them in my RCBS?

I guess that would probable work fine, but the point of removing the GC was to save a step. If I have to size twice that kind of defeats the propose.

[RobS]

I had a bit of what you see with the Lee 452-230-TC mold when took off the bevel base. I found that using a Lyman die was not as effective as the RCBS. The lyman has more of a straight mouth with a bit of taper where as the RCBS is tapered about 2 to 3 times more the the Lyman.

If you are sizing with a lyman die then try a RCBS. I was lucky in that a friend let me borrow his first so I could see if it would work.

My friends and my rcbs dies are new and I don't know if the older dies are made the same though just in case you borrow one.

[JIMinPHX]

Put them in your lubrisizer nose down, use a flat top-punch that is below .355" diameter & adjust the thing down far enough so that you hit the lube groove(s) with the lube. Push the boolit down into the die fast, so that the lube doesn't have time to squeeze out of the die around the nose of the boolit. See if that works for you.

[docone31]

Pan lube, then size. Simple, efficient, effective.
If you wanted an one size all, why cast?
Casting is about the precision, not speed.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

Thanks guys,

I think I will take BJ’s advice and add a Lee sizer die to my next Midway order. It has been a while sense I used a lee sizer die and from what I remember it is pretty strait forward, not nearly as much of pain as GCs.

[looseprojectile]

I feel partially responsible as I have posted on doing that.
Now it is time to find a disc sander and take off some of the top of the blocks. Use a miter gauge and measure a bunch as you go. Make sure that the gauge is square. Also that the table is level and square. You will burn your fingers unless you have a water source handy to cool them.
I have removed the check rebate from two moulds and several times regretted it.
Seems that later I had need for gas checked boolits for rifle loads.
At this point I would urge anyone to use a brass rod the right size and grit such as diamond dust to lap blocks in a drill press. I have a wonderful complete set of drills in letter and number sizes. A good drill the right size will cost you two or three dollars. Drill a little small and lap to final size.
You might find that if you sized them base first it would straighten them out too. Revolver boolits don't have to be bench rest quality anyhoo.

Life is good

[theperfessor]

Not trying to criticise anybody's efforts here but this is why I consider spending less than $20 on the proper size machine reamer from Enco or MSC to be a cheap investment.

[jhrosier]

...Now it is time to find a disc sander and take off some of the top of the blocks....

Sounds like a "hold my beer and watch this." moment in the making.:-)

I would guess that there are any number of folks on the board who have a proper milling machine to take a bit off the top of the blocks without doing any more damage.

Jack

[looseprojectile]

those of you who have no skills should hire it done!
I have learned to do most anything with nothing and do very well IMHO.
I didn't mention reamers cause they are costly. Reamers, I make mine.
I have been repairing airplanes, cars and trucks and guns for over fifty years that people have bent and broken and lose sight of the fact that mechanics don't repair things anymore, they replace parts. A man has to know his own limitations.
Sorry.

Life is good

[madcaster]

Is that mould the 200 grain Lyman .357/.38 mould that everybody is after?:o:coffeecom

[geargnasher]

Sounds like a "hold my beer and watch this." moment in the making.:-)

I would guess that there are any number of folks on the board who have a proper milling machine to take a bit off the top of the blocks without doing any more damage.

Jack

+1.

taking .015-.020" off steel blocks with sandpaper is a tall order, doable but even with a heavy machined steel dressing block those edges are likely going to get rounded.

One benefit to having a mould that casts a bit of a flare on the base is you're virtually guaranteed to have a nice, square base after running through the push-through Lee sizer. I'm afraid that mould will make a skirt with that much flare, but mill off a bit of the top and I bet it works just fine.

I've just experimented with one cavity of a two cavity Lee, but I had excellent luck using a letter drill and drill press (turned by HAND) and a drill vise to remove the gas check shank with NO hourglassing of the base band. I cast a lap and trued it with a bit of 600-grit Clover to be sure it was concentric and even all the way around. I don't see why it wouldn't work on a steel mould just as well, even if it had to be done in several steps (drill sizes).

Gear

[theperfessor]

I can only repeat - $20 or less to NOT take the chance on ruining an expensive mold is a cheap investment in my book.

There are a hundred ways to do something wrong, and dozens of ways to do something almost right and get by with it, but when you make part of your living doing something for a living there are only a few ways to do it right the first time.

Ask your self this - would you hire somebody to do this job for you if they said they were going to drill it with an undersize drill, lap it to an hour glass shape, and send it back to after grinding off the top on a disk sander, or would you prefer them to use the proper size reamer in the first place?

[Buckshot]

...........Well I'll tell ya 2ndAmendmentNut, and that is I'm proud you tried and it's too bad it didn't turn out well. Trying is the first step to succeding. You should have seen the first doghouse I attempted to make :-) I thought my dad was going to bury it or set it on fire. If accuracy is required then by eye and hand is usually not the best way, especially when you have the item in one hand and the tool in the other . Even a failure is a learning process, so there was at least one positive, eh? :-)

.............Buckshot

[Beekeeper]

+1 for Buckshot.
He who does not try , learns nothing !


Jim

[docone31]

You can always get another mold. Keep an American Working!
However, if it had worked, you could feel good about it. Now, you get to add to your experience pool.
All ways, a winner.
My success never taught me anything new, my mistakes gave me new insight. By not quitting, we learn.

[deltaenterprizes]

PM sent.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

I can only repeat - $20 or less to NOT take the chance on ruining an expensive mold is a cheap investment in my book.

There are a hundred ways to do something wrong, and dozens of ways to do something almost right and get by with it, but when you make part of your living doing something for a living there are only a few ways to do it right the first time.

Ask your self this - would you hire somebody to do this job for you if they said they were going to drill it with an undersize drill, lap it to an hour glass shape, and send it back to after grinding off the top on a disk sander, or would you prefer them to use the proper size reamer in the first place?


Thank you for twisting the salty gut hook knife.:smile:

[Muddy Creek Sam]

If I could just get a nickle for every time I felt like and idiot. I could buy a lot of casting equipment. You live you learn.

Sam :D

[looseprojectile]

I can't speak for the Perfessor as he has probably never screwed up. He must be one of those that buys tooling for every job. He is not income challenged such as I am obviously. A machine operator evidently.
Now a craftsman such as me does every job perfectly every time. I have never screwed up anything such as you have that mould.[smilie=l:
Now if you want to keep hearing these kinds of lies stay tuned to this channel :groner: . I am probably one of those that is trapped inside a wall of ignorance.

Life is good

[opentop]

+1 on what buckshot said. Can't blame a guy for trying. I'v done some things that didn't turn out the first time, but I learnt from my mistakes and try agin with better results.

Find some one that can mill the top down to get rid of the flare.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

Find some one that can mill the top down to get rid of the flare.

I think Deltaenterprizes is my man.


Thank you all for your input and support.

[Springfield]

The trouble is, buying that 20.00 reamer isn't going to do any good unless you have a mill/lathe or a GOOD drill press. I opened up a mould using my cheapo press and it was difficult to keep everything round. We don't ALL own a machine shop. Finally got a decent lathe, but that is a very recent purchase. I have got lots of pistols running again with using a dremel and a few files. The key is to go slow and be careful. I have more interests than I have money, so sometimes you just have to use what you have at hand.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

I have more interests than I have money.

That’s my problem too, but the Prefessor has made an excellent point. Had I paid someone with a machine shop to plain base the mould properly in the first place it would have been done right. Instead I tried to save a few bucks, and now I am going to hire someone to do it right anyway.

The reason I starting this thread was so that no one else would make the mistake I did. It takes a smart person to learn from their mistakes. And it takes a smarter person to learn from someone else’s mistakes.

[theperfessor]

2ndAmendmentNut

I wasn't trying to criticize your efforts at all. If I gave that impression please accept my apology. I'm all for experiential learning. But in the almost three years I've been a member of this site I've seen numerous threads on this and similar topics - altering bullet bases from bevel or gas check to plain base, or milling off the top of a mold for some reason or another. And almost always the conclusion is that a better job could be had if a small investment in the proper tool was made, or if one of the excellent craftsman on this site had done the job for a reasonable fee. I see raves here all the time for the mold mods done by some of the fine craftsman here. So please understand that my comment was based on two different experiences - my own experience as a machinist, and the collective experience of the some of the members of this site.

Like everybody else I've made mistakes in trying to do certain things. There isn't enough server space on this site for me to detail all of them. I just try to not make the same mistake twice, and I try to learn from the pros on the best way to do something I've never done before. That's one of the reasons I love this site - there are so many people here who have had different learning experiences in different areas and are willing to share them with others.

I'll admit I'm not a good enough craftsman to produce top quality work that meets my personal and professional standards without the proper tools. And if I don't have the proper tool to do a job, I either acquire the tool, turn down the job, or farm it out to a reliable person or shop that can do the job properly. I consider tools to be an investment, and I have made a conscious, thoughtful efforts to acquire what I feel is necessary to be able to exercise my creativity to the fullest. I won't apologize for that. I've only got one corporeal life and I intend to maximize that.

That said, I've spent less over the last fifteen years on my shop tools than some people spend on an SUV or four wheel drive truck. And after fifteen years I've made a lot of that back doing subcontract work. When my widow (hopefully that status is some years away) sells my stuff she'll get the rest and more back. How much is a fifteen year old 4 wheeler worth?

A lot of people like to, or have to, do their own work on their guns and gear. That's great, nothing wrong with that at all. So let me offer a few creative suggestions on how to make up for lack of equipment.

1. Get to be friends with the shop teacher at the local high school or community college. If you're lucky they may have a milling machine, even if they don't they probably have a heavy enough post drill to turn a reamer slow enough to get a decent job.

2, No local school shop? Get to be friends with the guy at the local auto shop. A lot of them have a decent enough drill press to do the job.

3. Split the cost of a reamer among other members here that want to do the same thing. Pass the reamer around, and then rent it out or sell it for half price here and get some of your money back. A good reamer, used properly on the materials bullet molds are made from should last a long time.

I'm not an elitist, but I do demand the same quality work from myself that I would expect from a paid professional. And if you paid me, or any other person to do a job for you I think you would expect professional workmanship also. And oftentimes the reason a paid professional is capable of producing quality work is because they have the right tools for the job and know how to use them properly.

Again my apologies - no offense was intended.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

Prefessor,
Don’t worry I was not in anyway insulted, but thank you for your concern and excellent advice.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

Here Deltaenterprizes I hope this allows you to see what you need to know. Notice lube left around base of boolit.