Loaded my first 6 rounds, have a few questions

[ironcowboy]

Well i just put together 6 rounds (.45lc), now i have a few questions, first, the bullets i used were 255grn flat nosed cowboy bullets (I just cast them today, that was a first too). They looked all good, not having any bullet lube i dipped them in hot wax and then ran them under a flame to just give them a very very light coating, from what i've read that should be fine for these first test rounds till i can pick up some good lube.
I loaded 7 grains of unique powder, i'll work up to 8ish from there if all goes good.
The one thing i found odd was as i seated the bullet in the case, a little bit of lead was cut from one side of the bullet (some of it came off, and some kinda hung over the edge of the casing, which i trimmed off with a knife) just a tiny amount, but i'm not sure if its something i'm doing wrong or what...
All the rounds chamber good and freely in my ruger vaquero, and hopefully i'll get a chance to test them this weekend! I can say for sure i've been bit by the "bug". :)
Also, how harmful are the vapors that come off of the melting lead? If its going to cause me to go brain dead i guess i'll just buy bullets, (though casting them is fun!)
Another thing, the mold i'm using is a lee two cavity mold, but for some reason i could only get the first cavity (away from the handle) to work right, the other one kept not filling right, maybe only half my mold was warm?

Thanks for the help!

[waksupi]

Welcome aboard, Cowboy.

The lead ring is most likely from not enough flare on the case neck, and possible mis-adjustment of the seating and crimp stage.
No need to worry about lead fumes, unless you can take it to red hot, and a rolling boil! Lead contamination comes from handling the lead, and putting your fingers on your face, in your mouth or nose. Also, don't eat or drink while casting, and you will have no worries.
The Lee molds like to be ran hot. Crank up the temperature, and you should get good boolits. Don't worry about frosting. Many of us prefer to cast them frosted, for better fill and weight consistency.

[ironcowboy]

Thanks for the info!
Correct me if i'm wrong, but with the .45 colt, there is no crimping involved?
I have a lee single stage press, and the lee 3 die set, i adjusted the bullet seating length to take it right up to the last ring in the bullet. (this is the mold i got http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=775664)

Any more info/tips you guys can give me would be awesome!!!!

[OutHuntn84]

''The one thing i found odd was as i seated the bullet in the case, a little bit of lead was cut from one side of the bullet (some of it came off, and some kinda hung over the edge of the casing, which i trimmed off with a knife) just a tiny amount, but i'm not sure if its something i'm doing wrong or what..''

No ''big'' deal but curtainly can mess with accuracy and Im sure some other small issues but IMHO don't worry about it. They do have a bell or expander die that will open up or flare the case a lil bit to keep that from happening they can come caliber specific or universal just remember all you need is a little expansion to start the boolit in the case before you seat it.

''Also, how harmful are the vapors that come off of the melting lead? If its going to cause me to go brain dead i guess i'll just buy bullets,''

BLASPHEMY!!!!!!!!!
You will go to he!! (california) for talk'n like that. ;) but really though as long as your not hovering over your pot like a dang huffer your okay. I like to cast outside up wind or in the garage with strong ventalation. More importantly wear gloves while you handle the lead or atleast scrub the heck out of your hands before eating drinking picking your nose etc. Good common since and read some of the sites stickies and you'll be just fine. BTW all us casters/reloaders/gun nuts are a lil brain dead ;)

''Another thing, the mold i'm using is a lee two cavity mold, but for some reason i could only get the first cavity (away from the handle) to work right, the other one kept not filling right, maybe only half my mold was warm?''

Try cleaning the mold real good. You might have some crud in the cavity. The aluminum molds heat up pretty evenly. If that dosent work try running a lil hotter.

and welcome to the wonderful sickness of casting and reloading.

[ironcowboy]

Awesome!! I cant thank you guys enough! You got me so excited i think i'm going to go load up another few rounds to take with me tomorrow for testing!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

[mooman76]

I'm sure it isn't always the case but I have fould that if one cavity fills out good and the other doesn't (on lee's anyway) that it isn't venting good. Try loosening the prue plate a little. JPW (Johnsons paste wax) used for floors and furniture polish will work as a lube. Just apply it like Lee alox.

[lwknight]

The 7 grains of unique will make you a nice plinking load and it will be smokey from the powder and the lube as well. You will not melt or burn any lead with a load like that.

[ironcowboy]

Thanks for the help.
The smoke i was talking about was when i was melting the lead in my pot to cast my bullets, not from firing the gun. ;P

[Bret4207]

The smoke that comes off your alloy when fluxing is far more likely to cause you problems than the lead alloy itself. That's part of why I got away fluxong with boolit lube, wax, etc. Now I just use a wooden stick and what smoke there is consists of plain old carbon, not carbon and all sorts of additives that make up lube, wax, oils or whatever. I'm sure excessive carbon is bad for you, but even trace amounts of somethings are really bad for you, so I'll stick with the stick!

The lead alloy itself shouldn't be much of an issue at casting temps unless you hover over the pot. No one I've ever seen casting does that. The bigger issue comes from ingesting lead off your hands. Wash after casting and your problems are lowered to near normal shooters levels.

[Edubya]

Welcome to the greatest sin.. I mean hobby of man and child.
As mentioned above, the "Classics and Stickies" are full of informative and entertaining information that every new caster should enjoy and heed for the pleasure of casting boolits. You would benefit from buying a couple of reloading manuals too. Amongst the most educational books is "The ABCs of Reloading". I'll bet that you have friends and neighbors up there in Lancaster that reload and probably some that are casters. You could benefit yourself by getting to know them.
EW

[Wayne Smith]

What loading dies are you using? If they don't have a case mouth expander you need to get one. The Lyman die is probably the best but Lee makes one too. The Lee is really a flare tool. Do you have a champfer tool? Sometimes, and with some boolits, I find all I really need is a champfer on the mouth of the case. Most of the time I'm using the expander in the die set or my Lee universal set.

[MtGun44]

Lead does NOT vaporize at casting temperatures. Partial pressure is in the millionths of
a mm of mercury where 760 mm is sea level air pressure. Watch your hands, do not eat
or drink with lead contaminated hands and you will be over 99% of the problem.
The real reason for ventilation is if you use smelly or smokey fluxes or dirty lead.

Bill

[ghh3rd]

I tried a new Lee mold twice with dismal results, swearing that something was wrong with it. Tried it the third time with bad results for about 150 boolits (that I was going to try to salvage some from), but all of a sudden everything started to click, and I have probably 500 nice round, full shiney boolits! I couldn't stop casting when I saw how good they looked, and wound up staying up half the night. Of course, the first 150 were remelted.

My point is, that I've heard that sometimes a mold may be finickey and just need to be broken in. If nothing else works, just keep using it, make believe that it's a single cavity mold, and perhaps the other cavity will 'break in' and catch up..

Randy

[Bret4207]

Good point Rnady, there are a lot of moulds that seem to take some time to straighten up and fly right. I always put it down to various oils and what not cooking out of the metal. Just a theory, but ut seems to make sense. Some moulds take 2-3 heating and cooling cycles before they "fix" themselves.

[mdi]

Yer Hooked! Now comes the quest for more lead, more lead, more lead!

Check your instructions for the dies. The seating and crimping is in the same die. I like to seat all the boolits first, then adjust the die to crimp.

If you don't have any lube try Chapstick. Fill the grooves by smearing a bunch on the boolit. Just clean excess off base and yer good to go!

[TAWILDCATT]

If you have lee dies the expander powder thru die can be set to flair.I have them on my 1000s and works good.any set should have a shoulder that flairs.the rifles may not.

[ironcowboy]

Thanks for the help guys!
I got the part down where it was cutting the bullet up, i just did not have the powder through expander die set deep enough, works slick now! :)
I loaded up 25 rounds, so will see how they shoot.
Once i got on a roll with the casting i could not stop! :) Just kept doing one more and one more. haha
Now i gotta go find a place to get cheap/free lead, and find some more .45 colt brass and i'm golden!!!

[JIMinPHX]

Many guys who load lead boolits use a universal case expander die, also called an "M" die, to "bell mouth" or flair the mouth of the case. this gives you a small funnel shaped area to start the lead boolit without shaving any lead off the side of it. On some die sets, the powder charging die is also the case expander. You may just need to adjust it down a little further. Don't go too far with it though. You just want a little funnel. Too much weakens your brass. Your seating die, then presses this belling back down to the original diameter of the case, or even a little smaller, depending on how the die is set. The dept to which you lower your die controls how much crimp you get. I believe that the .45LC gets a roll crimp, as opposed to a taper crimp. Most guys use a little bit of crimp on cast loads, but not a lot. A lot of crimp can reduce the boolit diameter in some cases. Not enough crimp can let the boolit move around under recoil in some cases. If you are loading hot loads, then you probably need a firm crimp. If you are loading lite to medium loads, then a straight wall case with no visible crimp is probably good enough.

[canyon-ghost]

Expander dies are wonderful things, a case mouth chamfer tool can help too. For lube, a lot of us like http://www.lsstuff.com/ White Label Sales. Their prices are decent and service even better. Good Luck

Ron

[Dale53]

Ironcowboy;
The Lee bullet that you are casting has a crimp groove (the groove nearest the bullet nose). You should seat the bullet until the case mouth is even with the "top" of the groove (just under the edge). Read your die instructions and they explain how to adjust the die to crimp.

Using a revolver, you need to crimp to keep the bullet from walking forward out of the case from the recoil of the previous shots. It also helps to promote clean burning.

FWIW
Dale53

[fredj338]

Many guys who load lead boolits use a universal case expander die, also called an "M" die, to "bell mouth" or flair the mouth of the case. this gives you a small funnel shaped area to start the lead boolit without shaving any lead off the side of it. On some die sets, the powder charging die is also the case expander. You may just need to adjust it down a little further. Don't go too far with it though. You just want a little funnel. Too much weakens your brass. Your seating die, then presses this belling back down to the original diameter of the case, or even a little smaller, depending on how the die is set. The dept to which you lower your die controls how much crimp you get. I believe that the .45LC gets a roll crimp, as opposed to a taper crimp. Most guys use a little bit of crimp on cast loads, but not a lot. A lot of crimp can reduce the boolit diameter in some cases. Not enough crimp can let the boolit move around under recoil in some cases. If you are loading hot loads, then you probably need a firm crimp. If you are loading lite to medium loads, then a straight wall case with no visible crimp is probably good enough.
An 'M' die is not needed. All dies come w/ the expander & crimp built into them. Just adjust the expander so you have a nce bell to accept the bullet. WHen seating, adjust the bullet so the case mouth aligns w/ the crimp groove, then adjust the die down until the case mouth rolls slightly into that groove. Good luck w/ the wax, but you'll need a real bullet lube sooner than later for best results.

[ironcowboy]

Thanks very much!

The wax was only for these first 25 rounds, i cant wait to test them. :) I'll pick up some lube this week.

[Tom W.]

Waksupi will sell you any extra loob grooves that you may need, but he likes to over-charge...

[JIMinPHX]

...All dies come w/ the expander & crimp built into them. ...

Many, but not all.

[Phat Man Mike]

Now i gotta go find a place to get cheap/free lead



:bigsmyl2:sounds like you hooked now! and let us know if you find/get that cheap free lead ![smilie=s:

[AZ-Stew]

Set your expander die to just barely flare the case mouth enough to get the boolit started in the case by hand. As long as you seat the boolit straight before running the case into the seat/crimp die, you won't shave lead from the boolit. If you over-expand, you'll over work the brass and it will soon split at the mouth. The less flare, the longer your brass will last.

Adjusting the seat/crimp die is easier done than described, but here goes...

Unscrew the seater stem (center part) as far as it will go. Screw the die body into the press 3-5 turns. Insert a cartridge with boolit into the shell holder. Lower the press handle until the ram is at the top. Screw the die body down until you feel the crimp ridge in the die touch the cartridge mouth. Back the die off 1/2 turn and screw the lock nut down until it touches the press top. No need to torque it into place because you'll be moving the die body again later.

Screw the seating stem down until you feel it touch the boolit nose. Now raise the press handle about 1/4 of the way and screw the seater stem in a couple of turns. Lower the press handle and you will partially seat the boolit. Repeat this last step in small increments until you have the boolit seated as far as you want into the case. Usually you'll want to align the case mouth with the top of the boolit's crimp groove. When you have the boolit where you want it, unscrew the seater stem several turns.

Now it's time to set the crimp. Loosen the die body lock nut a few turns and lower the press handle. Screw the die body down until you feel the crimp ridge in the die touch the case mouth. Raise the press handle 1/4 of the way and screw the die body down about 1/8 turn. Lower the press handle and apply some crimp. Raise the press handle and inspect the crimp. If you need more crimp, repeat screwing the die body down another 1/8 turn and lower the press handle. Raise the handle and inspect the crimp. Repeat until you achieve the desired crimp. Lower the press handle. Now screw the die body lock nut down until it touches the top of the press. Tighten the set screw in the lock nut. Finally, screw the seater stem down until it is snug against the boolit and tighten the seater stem lock nut. As long as you shoot the same boolit, you should never have to adjust the die again. It will seat the boolit and set the crimp with a single stroke of the press handle.

Regards,

Stew

[wallenba]

7 grains of unique is a good starting point for this boolit. If your Vaquero's are the "New" models, be careful getting to the hotter loads, they are'nt as stout as a Blackhawk. Chamfering the inside of the case mouth will help a bit with the lead shaving too.

[ironcowboy]

Awesome writeup!! Should help a bunch!!!!!!!

I have one of both vaquero's, both an old bisley vaquero, and a new vaquero. Now to go set my crimp! How much do i need? I dont think its much...

[JIMinPHX]

If you're loading up a fast powder like 231, Bullseye or Unique & you're not loading it up to magnum velocities, then you just need a little bit of a crimp. If you are using a hard-to-ignite powder, or if you are loading up high recoil loads, then you need more of a firm crimp.

[HamGunner]

Aluminum molds need to go through several heating and cooling cycles before they start to settle down. Make sure that you clean the cavities well of any oils and when lubing the sprue plate pivot, use just a very small amount so it does not get into the cavity. Pour the farthest away cavity first letting plenty of lead pour over the sprue plate before going to the next cavity. Tilt the mold down in the rear to prevent lead entering the first cavity until ready for it and then allow plenty of over flow on the sprue plate for the next cavity. Should start throwing good bullets soon.

Try to maintain a rhythm to ensure the mold heats evenly each time for best weight consistencies.

[ironcowboy]

Good info guys!!!
I tested 6 shots tonight when i was done hunting (private land) and they all went bang. :) To dark to really see where they hit on the stump, but sure got good flame. :) I loaded the rest of my 40 or so shells with about 8 grn's, so will see how they do.

Does anyone have any info on how long .45 colt brass will last (how many times i can load it?) Anything i should look for other then a crack to know when to toss it?

[Dale53]

I have loaded .45 Colt brass (Starline) many times with black powder and smokeless without losing any cases. I DID clean the black powder cases immediately (black powder residue draws moisture which causes severe corrosion) EVERY time. I use a moderate roll crimp and do not flare excessively (excessive case flare and too heavy a crimp both can cause early case failure).

About the only thing you have to worry about is splitting at the case mouth. I inspect everytime before I reload. A split case will almost always lead to much larger groups.

I have heard that "Ruger only" loads will lead to early case failure. My loads have not been super heavy .45 Colt loads so I have little experience in that area. All of my "heavy" loads have been with the .44 Magnum and I have NOT noted excessive case loss.

FWIW
Dale53

[ironcowboy]

Awesome thanks!!!
Also, how important is it to clean used cases? I do not have a case tumbler, should i just let them go? Or wash them in water? I dont care how they look, but want to make sure they work good, and that not cleaning does not destroy them.

[lwknight]

Your cases need to be free if dirt or any kind of grit. At least wiped off.
Bright shiny cases is mostly a vanity thing.
Hot soapy water will do a lot for getting sand,dirt and powder residue out.
Tumbling does not readily clean the inside all that much unless you leave it a really long time anyway.

[JIMinPHX]

Aluminum molds need to go through several heating and cooling cycles before they start to settle down.

What do you mean by "settle down"? I hadn't noticed any real difference.

[docone31]

The aluminum molds need several heating/cooling cycles to get to the point where you can just pick them up and cast. It is hard to notice the differences but they are there.
After they have been used for several sessions, they start really behaveing.

[JIMinPHX]

I haven't noticed that, but I do a pretty good clean up job on them before I use them for the first time. That may have something to do with it.