Small base die , yes or no for .308

[frank_1947]

My buddy said I should get the small base die for 308 semi auto but I load semi auto 223 never any problem both 223 and 308 are in a AR platform im not sure why 308 would be any different then loading 223 that i would need a small base die I read comments vfrom those who bought RCBS small base die all were shooting thev M-14 or M1A, so im thinking maybe that action requires under size die , your opinion please

[frank_1947]

one more thing this is all once fired brass no military stuff most R&P and WInchester a few CBC

[StarMetal]

Bottom line is if you can reload with the standard dies with no feeding problems at all, do so. Small base work the case too much.

Joe

[helice]

I have a Savage 99 in 308. I like my small base dies. Never have to worry about feed problems.

[frank_1947]

okay i got a feeling this subject is one of those that is a toss up, thanks

[Papa Foxtrot]

Bottom line is if you can reload with the standard dies with no feeding problems at all, do so. Small base work the case too much.

Joe

+1 Try the standard dies first. If you don't have a function problem, then save your money...

If you do, then buy the SB resizer.

I've never owned an SB size die and I've shot thousands of rounds of reloaded military brass. Just depends on the individual chamber.

YMMV

[frank_1947]

good point if it cycles fine then i save over $30 if not then will go with SB it is all about chamber, this is a DPMS LR 308 this one is chambered 7.62x51 they also chamber some models in 308 so will see when my dies get here how it does

[Bullshop Junior]

I see no need for a small base in any thing. After the first itme I fire my brass I only neck size.

[StarMetal]

I see no need for a small base in any thing. After the first itme I fire my brass I only neck size.

Junior,

That won't work in many semi-autos. I'll give you one example, my 6.5 Grendel.

Joe

[frank_1947]

yes even die mfgs say to full size semi autos but neck size is fine on bolt type gun

[doubs43]

IMO, the answer is: It depends. If you are shooting all of your cartridges through the same semi-auto rifle then a standard die should work OK as the cases, once fired in a particular chamber, will all be "sized" for that chamber. Once fired in a particular chamber, you may even get a number of firings from each case using only a neck-sizing die before it becomes necessary to go back to a FL sizing die. If you have multiple rifles using the same cartridge then a SB die may be necessary for proper feeding in the various rifles.

Bolt action rifles will rarely need a SB die unless they have a very tight match chamber.

As others have said, try the standard FL dies first and if you have feeding problems then go to SB dies.

[frank_1947]

yep thats my thought will try see how it goes

[missionary5155]

Good afternoon
YEP... it sure seems each chamber is it's own individual. I have 2 Garands. The H&R (52) has a VERY tight chamber and does Like to be FL sized while the older LOOSER Springfield(43) could care less if it is just necked sized or not.
My M1A (Military barrel) Likes FL sizing. My Fal (same load) is indifferent.
AS long as the fired brass stays with the rifle that shot it that is what I have.
I so far have not needed a Small Base die but know another shooter who has a "Custom" barreled 308 that MUST use it. Probably has a TIGHT Match chamber.

[Guesser]

I use SB in 308 simply because they were the cheapest I found when I needed 308 dies on short notice. $10.00 for a brand new set of RCBS, couldn't pass!!!!!!!!

[Hip's Ax]

If you've got a factory rifle the normal FL dies are what you want. In fact most match rifles would use the regular dies as well, it is the ones that are chambered with the tight match reamer that need small base dies.

That and perhaps if your buying machine gun fired brass a small base die might be necessary to get that brass back to a useful dimension.

I have many match rifles both bolt action (Remington 700, Winchester 70, Stolle Panda and Borden) and semi (AR, M1, M1A) and I do not own a small base die in any caliber. I tell the gunsmith up front I am not interested in a tight match chamber and most say that they won't use that reamer anyway.

BTW, for my semi autos I always set up the FL die using a Wilson Chamber Gage and every single piece of brass goes through that gage as a final QC check before priming.

[mike in co]

i own small base dies in 223 and 308.

when i SELL processed brass for 308, it goes thru a small base die...cause i don't want the customer bringing it back.
when i process 223 brass for retail...guess what, same thing.
when i do once fired mil brass in bulk for my own 223 55fmj blasting loads for multiple guns....small base die.

now i load for 5 or 6 308's....lot sorted brass no small base die, and most are neck size only...two are ar-10's..and one is a tight chamber/neck turned br rifle.

some 223 is neck sized only, tho some is full length sized.


like someone said...each gun and chamber is its own......do what works...BUT for the life of the brass do as little as what works....


mike in co
Ps:
any die maker can screw up...i had a redding sb die that would not size enough for the brass to chamber in an inspec chamber....they did offer to replace it...but was a bit frustrating for a couple of days trying to figure out the issue.

[frank505]

Please buy RCBS case mike and set your dies to bump the shoulder back 3 to 4 thou. If not you probably will get to experience a slam fire.
Third barrel on my M1A, no slam fires and lots of rounds in High Power(makes you a rifleman)

[mike in co]

Please buy RCBS case mike and set your dies to bump the shoulder back 3 to 4 thou. If not you probably will get to experience a slam fire.
Third barrel on my M1A, no slam fires and lots of rounds in High Power(makes you a rifleman)


he does not have an m1a...he has ar10's

yell at me all you want....3/4 thou is overworling the brass...and not required in his case.

yes i shoot ar-10's

mike in co

[frank505]

it is not over working the brass, the semi's are opening before the pressure is gone so the brass is being way overworked by the function of the rifle. the brass must be sized so the cartridge will go into the chamber all the way otherwise a slam fire. had one happen two years ago with a 308 garand, broke the stock and put a big bruise on the shooters thumb. i do not think the reciever was damaged. he was not sizing his brass and the bolt was not closing, he kept shooting.......................................... ..................

[frank505]

i get four firings on my 308 brass with match loads, 168's and 41.5 4895 or 42 of 2520. the brass then goes to my bolt gun for a few more then to the scrap bucket.

[Char-Gar]

Some years back I bought a large lot of once fired Lake City 7.62 Nato brass that had been fired in a machine gun. To size it back to spec I had to buy a small base sizing die. After the brass had been sized the first time, I never needed the SB die again. A regular die works just fine.

I have four rifles in .308, a Remington 700, a Savage 16 and two Winchester 88s. Like them all.

[deltaenterprizes]

I see no need for a small base in any thing. After the first itme I fire my brass I only neck size.

I have a couple of rifles chambered in 308 Palma Match that need to have the brass sized with a small base die. They will chamber factory ammo, but ammo fired in a 7.62 NATO or 308 win chamber need to be sized with a small base die.
Ammo that fits my Ar-10 will not fit my bolt action chambers.

[BruceB]

All of my .308/7.62 NATO shooting is done with military-type semi-autos (M1A and FAL).

For many years, before my current rifles came to me, I used a standard RCBS .308 sizer for M1As, M-14s and L1A1 (inch-pattern FAL) rifles without difficulty.

Now, knowing a bit more about the subject, my brass is sized in small-base X-dies for both .308 and .223/5.56 rifles. I want the free-est possible chambering of the cartridge, and I don't care a whit if it's a tad looser than necessary. Slam-fires are well-known occurrences and I want nothing to do with the problem...therefore I minimize the chances. The FAL has a spring-loaded firing pin, but the M1 and M1A do not. (M1 .30-06 loads are sized in another RCBS small-base sizer.) I also run every single loaded round through an L.E. Wilson cartridge gauge in the last loading step for all the semi-auto rifles.

Rolling the dice has little appeal for me, and I greatly prefer to maximize my precautions BEFORE requiring an autopsy on what used to be a nice rifle.

I'm not a match shooter, and I don't need the last .001" of "accuracy" which MIGHT be obtained from tighter-fitting brass. For all that, the accuracy I do get from my rifles is gratifying and also better than I can reasonably use except from the benchrest.

[azrednek]

Buy RCBS dies. If the standard doesn't function, write RCBS. I've done it twice and both times RCBS replaced the standard die with small base no charge.

[mike in co]

it is not over working the brass, the semi's are opening before the pressure is gone so the brass is being way overworked by the function of the rifle. the brass must be sized so the cartridge will go into the chamber all the way otherwise a slam fire. had one happen two years ago with a 308 garand, broke the stock and put a big bruise on the shooters thumb. i do not think the reciever was damaged. he was not sizing his brass and the bolt was not closing, he kept shooting.......................................... ..................

another garand story...he is shooting an AR10!!!!!

IT HAS A SMALL SPRING ON THE BACK OF THE FIRING PIN TO ELIMINATE SLAM FIRES.

THE WHY THE BOLT ROTATES FORWARD IN AN AR KEEPS THE FIRING PIN BACK.



we took loading gear to the range and shot a 308 case 50 times and finally gave up...it was still working well. so 4 firings is WITH YOUR SIZING METHOD IS OVERWORKING THE BRASS.

you do whats comfortable for you, but it is not required for the rest of the world.

mike in co